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welcome to the ABA program demystifying the judicial clerkship process and experience the event today is being co-sponsored by the ABA law student division and the AV a national conference of federal trial judges my name is Josephine bond and I will be serving as your moderator today joining me on the program and serving as faculty faculty today includes judge Leo Brisbois judge barbara lynn and judge margaret see more during this session the faculty will be sharing invaluable insights into what the clerkship application process entails how to stand out amongst the very large number of people applying for these positions what application and interview pitfalls to avoid how to prepare for your clerkship the qualities of successful clerks of these judges have had before and what clerkship and internship opportunities are currently available before we start the program with some introductions I would like to give you some housekeeping information first this program is currently being recorded and will be available afterwards and is available for free to all ABA members second time permitting we will have a live Q&A session during the near end of the program you may submit questions any time during a program using the questions function in the webinar interface Austin has provided details for you in the chat section right now as a final reminder there's handouts including the faculty bios and information about clerkship and internship opportunities included in the handout section on the right side of your screen now let's start the program off with some introductions by the faculty judge judge bridge brisbois can you start us off yes I can't thank you very much and welcome everyone the pleasure to have you joining us my name is Leo brisbois I'm a United States Magistrate Judge for the District of Minnesota the Minnesota is one single district and we have eight full-time magistrate judges and seven current active district court judges we have courthouses in st. Paul Minneapolis and dilute and I chambered in Duluth the my been on the bench since august of 2010 prior to that I was in private practice as a litigation civil litigation attorney and prior to that I was a judge advocate prosecuting cases in the United States Army in Europe I was the president of the Minnesota State Bar Association from 2009 to 2010 and I also been involved in judicial selection on the state level the my practice if you will as a magistrate judge includes all aspects of pretrial civil and pretrial criminal and i also have provided judicial services that are non resident courthouse in Fergus Falls thank you thank you judge first boy judge lynn can you tell us a little bit about yourself sure good afternoon everyone I think most of you it's afternoon to those of you who are in the morning as i am good morning i have been on the bench since 2000 i attended the university of virginia and then southern methodist university law school I graduated from law school in 1976 and I joined a dallas law firm carrington coleman sloman and Blumenthal I was with that firm I started as a summer intern in 1974 I joined the firm in 1976 as an associate became a partner was on the management committee and worked there until I was confirmed to be united states district judge at the end of 1999 so I've been on the bench almost 16 years I had a very diverse practice as a trial lawyer doing civil litigation as judge Brisbois did I have been very active since I was a very young lawyer in the American Bar Association I became the chair of the litigation section in 1998 and I became a judge I eventually was the chair of the National Conference of federal trial judges one of our sponsors today and then became the chair of the judicial division so I'm a Navy a junkie I am presently on the jury Commission and I've been on the sandy committee on federal judicial improvements I am at the moment one of the chairs and I have been for a long time of the judicial intern Opportunity Program which is sponsored by the litigation section and you'll hear more about that as we continue and last thing I want to say bye brief introduction to our next speaker as I had the pleasure of chairing the bankruptcy committee at the Judicial Conference of the United States and one of the other members of that committee was judge see more so I'm very pleased to be on a program with her thank you gentlemen judge see more go ahead and introduce yourself thank you so much it's a pleasure to be here it is a pleasure to serve with to be here with judge limb as she indicated we served together on that bankruptcy committee I'm currently a senior United States District Judge for the District of South Carolina I was appointed to the bench in 1998 and before that I was served as the United States Magistrate Judge from nineteen ninety six to nineteen ninety eight on this district court I've served as the chief judge for the court and also served in various other positions on the court prior to assuming the bench i served in the office of the United States Attorney for the District of South Carolina I was also the interim United States Attorney for the District of South Carolina and also the chief of the Civil Division I've spent a number of years in private practice in South Carolina and prior to that I was in Washington DC and I served as a senior trial attorney with the office for civil rights in the Department of Education I was an attorney advisor with the equal employment opportunity the Commission and I held other policy positions in Washington DC on a the district of South Carolina is one district we have eight full-time judges and eight seniors well eight senior judges and eight full-time judges and eight magistrate judges and I took senior status two years ago so I have a reduced caseload of a 50-percent caseload and I'm also doing both civil and criminal cases thank you all so much for those brief introductions I'd like to now move on to the application process I'm kind of the start of the clerkship process and more specifically um to beach of you prefer a specific method of delivery whether it be mail email or Oscar what do you look for in a resume and need more than one writing simple talk about what maybe is has been most successful during the individual application process for people that are applying to your offices and judge judge Brisbois if you could please start us off that would be wonderful thank you I personally use Oscar exclusively for people to apply for click ships I interview on a yearly basis for the next year the reason I use Oscar is and the specifics of the system judge scene where we'll we'll get into a little bit later but one of the reasons I decided to use Oscar is that it allows you to set criteria and one of the criteria is a connection to Minnesota or the Midwest in Minnesota Wisconsin Iowa the Dakotas and because there are so many opportunities out there for students to attend law school all over the country obviously the school that works best for them may not be where they are connected that being Minnesota or other Midwest state and but Oscar allows them to go away to the school and yet still apply for the position with me and in my chamber here in Duluth because it's a national system and they can build up they can see all the availabilities of all the people who use Oscar all over the country and so that's why i use Oscar to provide as big an opportunity for people all over the country who might wish to practice in ultimately or relocate to the Minnesota with regard to the resume you know everybody resume reflects their unique experience but the things I specifically look for obviously academics are important you know that the results of the first or second year law school performances but I'm also particularly interested in not just law school practical experience internships clerkships with courts or with law firms or with the US Attorney's Office or federal defenders office but I'm also looking for just their activities in general and this can be extracurricular at their school or their community activities and I'm on a resume one that stands out to me is is not one with bullet points and 20 30 lines of different activities but I'm more interested in resumes that give me a little bit of detail as to each of those and I'm looking for those activities both community and academic where there are leaders in those activities they they put in a time and effort and are rather than just paying the dues and being a member and then how that balances against their academic performance and so because that shows to me a good both work ethic and ability to to manage that workload far as writing samples I believe that pretty much up to the applicant they can submit one or two and if they do submit to then they need to be two different isle of writing so I I'll end there and hand it off to one of my colleague panelist judge line if you'd like to jump in here and and kind of answer some of the questions that sure sure and I'll try not to repeat to the extent that i agree with one of the other speakers I think we're all looking for excellent academic achievement as far as the manner of receiving applications I prefer Oscar because it cuts down on the paper load but I accept applications by mail I don't accept them by email but I do get applications in the mail and when I get them I don't throw them well look at them but I don't encourage that but it happens every year and in fact I've hired a clerk for 2017 and I got his application by mail sort of out of the usual season and that's when I typically get mailed in applications because people think and they're correct that i'm not trolling around looking at Oscar in kind of the offseason so that's something to keep in mind i will begin with a word about writing samples i am not as interested in writing samples as others might be because frankly i'm somewhat skeptical about them because when i get an application that has a writing sample from a summer at a law firm i know that that has been edited by the law firm and so I'm not really seeing a student work there's nothing unethical about that I don't mean to suggest that but it isn't necessarily to me a good indicator of the writing skill of the applicant so I have a writing sample that I'm going to take seriously I want to know that it is actually is due work that's only been edited by the applicant and sometimes it's hard to get that unless it's a law review and even that sometimes it's gone through editing so I look at them but I'm not wedded to them I look for many of the same things that just judge brisbois already mentioned so I won't repeat that but I am a very interested in work experience or some kind of experience that is not just going from college to law school to an application even though that that's what I did so that certainly is an acceptable format but if someone has had another career or has done something that is significant other than just go to school and go to work that is something that I find very interesting and useful to know judge see more you want to pick up anywhere yeah I'm I'll just pick up on that and indicate that my my current law clerks occur are very much involved in my whole selection process and I take applicants applications from both Oscar and by mail just like Judge Lynn I do not take them by email and I find that one writing sample is enough I mean and that's efficient I'm also looking for participation and outside activities and as was indicated earlier I want to know what your role was in the organization that you were involved in you know whether or not you were later I would also look at the courses that you took in law school and how challenging they were and the most important thing to me is life experiences how you maybe overcame some type of challenge or how you worked and went to law school at the same time or things like that to make you show me just a little bit about your personality and what kinds of activity you're involved in things that I look for also at one point I only took clerks that had worked for at least a year after law school but now i will take applications right out of law school and I give a writing test for the applicants I once I've gone through the process and narrowed them down to maybe 10 applications than I will do telephone interviews and after that I will select maybe five of those to give a writing test and I do a blind writing test and then I pick after I do that so I think that that's been very helpful to me is the writing test because it's different from the writing sample hopefully the applicant is given a right from the fact pattern and will it will just be there writing with no assistance so I found that to be eye-opening Josephine this is judge Lynne I wonder if I could respond to that last comment of Judge see more if no my I don't mind but if you wouldn't just add in anything else that you might see as far as standing out it for people in the application stacks within your answer ok that would be fine so I actually when I select people that I have decided to interview I give them a questionnaire to fill out that's pretty extensive by and I send that by email and they send that back to me within a day of their interview and that gives them an opportunity to write good narrative answers and I also have planted some typographical errors in it which I invite them to correct so that is an additional screening mechanism I used to give a proof reading test and nobody ever passed it so I stopped giving yet but it's it's very important so I'll go to the next topic standing out in a good way and a bad way standing out in a bad way is not to proofread your application and it's pretty amazing how many applications i get that are addressed to someone other than me and that's not good that has happened on occasion where it's Oscars fault where there's a merge function and I may get a reference letter from somebody that is addressed to a different judge than me and if I can figure out that that's Oscars fault then obviously I don't know that against the candidate but sometimes there's a letter to me from the candidate and it's not actually to me and sometimes they're glaring typographical errors in a resume and in a cover letter and that should never happen this is one of the few occasions in life where you not only need to strive for perfection but you need to actually achieve it because we're getting a lot of applications and it's very important for the judge to know that the applicants take the matter seriously and if they're typographical errors that indicates otherwise so that is standing out in a bad way standing out in a good way to me is trying to have some sense of the particular judge so I'm a little light-hearted in my approach to some things and so there may be something on an application that is other interests that I might find interesting because somebody has done a little work on me researched me and may find something funny about me you are interesting about me and they put something on their resume that is intended to show me that they've done that now it's important not to become creepy and stalking like I did have someone do that one time and that stood out in a way that I felt like maybe this Apple can have been driving by my house which is not good but if there's something that we have in common and it's sincere that's a good thing to include and again as I said earlier interesting unusual work experience or commitments in the community is very good and the last thing I want to say is what also makes an application stand out is a very good reference letter and when you ask a law professor or a lawyer to write a reference letter make sure that you are requesting that from someone who is going to be your advocate and is also a good writer because if I get a very good letter that doesn't sound like a form letter from someone i know well and respect or someone i don't know well and respect that goes a long way to making an application stand out and it also stands out unfortunately when i get a letter from someone who doesn't really know the applicant very well and write something like well i knew joe smith from a class of 500 people and as i recall Joe did reasonably well in the class that is not a very good reference letter to
ause an application to bubble up to the top of the pile thank you judge alone just see more if you wouldn't mind talking about standing out from the stacks I think one of the best ways to stand out I agree with judge lynn is that if you have a recommendation from a professor or someone that is highly respected and it's a very good recommendation I think that that that helps your application stand out and also to indicate that you've been involved in various journals or clinics also is helpful in helping your application stand out and I would also agree with her up with regard to ways not to stand out and that's not proof reading your application or making some very big mistake makes for example i've had people to write me and say thank you for the interview and I enjoyed meeting with your law clerks and then put the wrong name for the law clerks that's not a way to stand out so I guess I'm just agreeing with judge Len as ways to stand out thank you don't see more and if you have anything to add feel free judge brisbois I won't repeat what obviously I agree with but let me just give a different perspective on one piece that no one's mentioned yet and and that is a cover letter I mean that's your first opportunity to introduce yourself to to us and so you want to take advantage of that opportunity and you don't want to write a 10-page brief but on the other hand you don't want your cover letter to be one sentence saying enclosed please find my application period that doesn't do anything to distinguish yourself from the other stack of application but that that's an opportunity that I see is often missed and so I would commend the attendees of this webinar to consider how they might take advantage of that opportunity to begin to present themselves in the in a way that distinguishes them from the other applicants if I could follow up on the cover letter that you just mentioned I know when I was applying to clerkships for after law school I had a tough decision to make I wanted to make a two-page cover letter and my career services opined that we were only allowed to use one pages one page to have everything in there do you have any kind of comment on whether or not there is a page limit I know you said 10 minute at 10 pages was too much but is there something that you look for whether it be one or two or even three pages yeah I mean I met I I get cover letters that are you know one pages from border to border and and then others that are page and a half to two pages with you know spacing along the edges I mean I I think anything beyond two pages probably too much but you can say quite a bit in two pages and that's pertinent to what your the position you're seeking and but it also it's you know along the lines of some of the comments that's also a writing sample that I get to consider so you know the effectiveness and efficiency of how you communicate in such as tight confines says are quite a bit to me fantastic I'd like to start the next section off on the interview process with judge see more if you could give me a little bit of insight and how you know your interview process works I know you mentioned a little bit about what your clerks do and that you have a writing test but if you can give a little bit more insight into what you're an individual interview process is and how does how best to succeed alright my process starts with I have law clerks that go through the applicant applications and they scream the applications based on some preferences that I give them you know I may have a cut-off GPA and all this certain organizations that I'm looking for that I think people that are important to me if they're in a particular organization and I don't limit it to any geographical area so I take law clerks from all over so once that those applications are narrowed down and that might be down to a hundred or so and then I get them and I read each one and pick out individuals that I would like to interview based on what's in the resume and I look at the grades I look at the letters of reference and i will do a telephone interview probably do a telephone interview of 20 applications and then after i narrow it down to about five i will give a writing test and once the writing test comes back we read them I read them my law clerks read them and then we each rank maybe the five that took the writing test we will rank them and we will meet together and discuss I mean this writing test is done blind we don't know who the applicant is that of the person we don't know the name of the person that did the writing until after we've reviewed them and once we've reviewed and ranked them then we reveal the names of them and we invite three people to come in chambers for face-to-face interview if they can and then I will make the final selection after that fantastic thank you so much judge brisbois if you could talk about your interview process in Minnesota that'd be wonderful all right well we get when people heard I'm from Duluth Minnesota they must figure I get three applications a year so but that in fact is not the case that we we get anywhere between 100 and 150 applications a year for for our vacancy and so we have as much of a daunting task to as my colleagues on the call to decide who it is we want to meet in person and so we also do a paper screen we get it down to about 35 of potential candidates and then I go through each of them again privately on my own entirely on my own and identify the ten that I want to meet with personally and we extend invitations for in-person interviews each interview lasts about an hour if they accept the invitation the reason I extend so many invitations is I find that out of that 10 3 yep you know three to four will self select out which tells me something about their commitment to actually clerking for the district in Minnesota and particularly here in Duluth the people who have not self-selected out then we arranged for the personal interview here in Duluth and my law clerks participate in that interview not because they have the de final say but because we are a chambers away from the main body of our court obviously we're very small working family and so I their input is very important that we are because there will be some overlap with the new clerk and and the junior clerk and so they're how they react to the people is going to be very important to me to consider the as i said the interview last about an hour I don't do a separate writing test but I perhaps one thing that I do that others don't is I ask them the last question first and I'm probably giving away the secret here but I asked them to close out the interview by telling me something about themselves that is entirely outside the box or a non sequitur with regard to what we would assume and what our career counseling offices tell us would be something pertinent to an application for judicial clerkship that's entirely up to them as to what they want to tell me but the point of it is something that is not included in the ridge materials not included in the professional and educational BIOS but yet still demonstrates character traits or personal skill sets or some other personal quality that would translate to success in the hard work environment that clerkship does require and that sometimes you know how people react to that question also is very telling in terms of you know creativity on the spot sponsors kind of things that happen all the time in the judicial and litigation setting thank you so much judge sling do you have anything to add about the interview process well just to say that I interview the candidate for about 45 minutes my clerks screen as the other judges mentioned and then I select a number of people that I'd like to come I only have one spot available now because I have a permanent law clerk effective this year so I'm only interviewing one person for a position every year to the extent i have an opening that I haven't already filled and then my staff also interviews the candidates not just my law clerks but my staff because it's in my view very important for everyone to get along this is a close working environment and I want to make sure my staff is comfortable with the candidates as well I do have people fill out that form and I go over that it's very important that that be accurate and complete and I think I learned a little bit more about the candidate than I would know from the resume before they come in so that I don't have to start from scratch I don't give as I said a writing test in addition to that but obviously I'm very interested in the quality of the writing that I see not only in the cover letter as judge brisbois mentioned in the resume itself but in the questionnaire that I have for them to fill out thank you so much insulin you've all have talked a lot about it about things to to do well and also to avoid I'm just wondering if you have any other application or interview pitfalls to avoid and starting off with judge brisbois well this is kind of a universal but I it's every year that I interview I find this at least one or two people that have not thought about this I know what the job is that you're applying for and let me just make it specific to Duluth here every district the 94 districts utilize their magistrate judges bench differently and so if you come to the interview with just a general understanding or or think you have an understanding of what the magistrate judges do you're not going to know what they do in this district and of course that's going to be important to me so I would say the number one pitfall is you know depending on the judge that you're applying for understand truly understand the nature of that job the nature of the caseload and you know before you get there because the judge I'm going to be looking for that I'm sure other judges will be looking for that and but that also helps you prepare for the interview because you'll be able to have some prior give this some prior thought to how your academics your practical experience in law school your practical experience outside of law school translates to meeting those needs and challenges thank you judge Brisbois Judge Lynn do you have any pitfalls to add well I mentioned being very careful about the quality of the writing and if you are coming to a district where you have no apparent connection you need to be prepared to explain why you want to come there i mean the judge is having to screen among other candidates and i personally i don't require that my clerks stay here in texas after they clerked for me and many have gone elsewhere to work but i like to have the possibility that they will stay in my community so i'm looking for some connection or particular interest in our community and sometimes people have no explanation and that makes me think they're not likely to stay and if I know that going in that is not a positive and it's important to have an interesting conversation uh I don't want to be checking my watch five minutes in and feeling like time has Stood Still you really should be engaging and have an interesting informed conversation that you've worked hard to prepare for thank you gentlemen judge see more do you have any pitfalls to add I don't really have anything new to add and I would just emphasize that the proofreading is so so important because I think this reflects reflects on the bigger issue and that it's an indication of whether or not you pay attention to detail which is so important for a clerk and I think it's so important that you know one of the qualities that you know a clerk have is intellectual honesty and that you're prepared to talk about you know ethical issues that maybe you've encountered and be prepared to address those when you come in for interview thank you judge see more before we move on to the next topic I just like to remind you all that you do have the ability to submit questions that can be answered later hopefully there aren't there's time remaining austin has posted in the chat on how exactly to do that as we move into the next section now you have achieved a clerkship the coveted position um what specifically do you recommend some law students do in preparation of a clerkship whether be taking a class in law school for example my judge recommended that we take federal courts and he also gave us a writing guide on how to write judicial opinions for him so starting with Jaclyn do you have any recommendations on what a law student should do to prepare for the clerkship well I think it's very important to know what the docket is like of the judge for whom you will be clerking I'm a patent pilot judge so I have a pretty healthy caseload of patent faces and that is a hard subject to teach oneself so I always encourage my clerks after they've accepted a job with me before they start to take a basic patent course so they can understand the Lego I think federal courts procedure evidence the basic courses for practicing and understanding practice in federal court of course are necessary I think it's a good idea to at least come down and watch some proceedings in court so you know what to expect and I have a clerk manual every year it gets revised with things that happen that we have been already covered and my clerks have to study that before they get here it's the Bible and it teaches them a whole lot so that those are the quick and easy things to do to get ready thank you gentlemen judge Seymour can you discuss some of your preparations I think it simpler class is necessary but I'm a stickler for writing so any course that requires you to do some type of analysis and writing would be very helpful and I think it's important that a clerk read some of the opinions of the judge that you're going to clerk for just to get a feel for that that judges writing style I think that's very important thank you judge Seymour and judge brisbois can you discuss some of your preparations what I recommend once the clerk is accepted an offer of employment is much of which has already been referred to but first read prior orders and reports and recommendations but so that you before you get there so that you know what the expectations are in terms of what a final word product might look like with regard to the nature of the work that a law clerk does for me as a magistrate judge in this district obviously Civil Procedure Federal Civil Procedure federal criminal procedure but also social security habeas corpus mean those are things that we do on a regular basis in this district and I'll point that out to them and so to the extent I'm not saying they need to change their course schedule to do those things but they're going to want to be look into those areas do some reading those areas horn books other things just so they have some background before they get here or it's going to be quite a shock thank you I know that we have a little bit less than 20 minutes left so I want to make sure we get to all of the wonderful information we still have but if possible could each of you choose one quality of a successful clerk that you've had kind of a recurring quality that each of your clerks I've had that have been successful beginning with judge see more I think intellectual honesty is very important to me and self-motivation if I'm limited to what qualities I'm looking for fantastic judge brisbois well I would obviously that's important work ethic but also curiosity I mean the intellectual curiosity is important is intellectual honesty because you have to be willing to sometimes look outside the box that's been presented to you by the parties because they may not have it right themselves and you don't want to just be let down the path by them if you got to be willing to look at other options so intellectual curiosity would be important and has been a trait of successful clerks here in my chambers thank you and finally judge line well it's hard to limit that to one thing but i will and i would say the ability to juggle there you have to be able to come from a very difficult long project to a quick matter you have to be prepared to be interrupted by a temporary restraining order that walks in the door and you have to be prepared for the judge coming in your office just to chat when really don't have the time or the inclination to do it so it's just a lo
of moving targets all the time and the clerk has to be prepared to move from one thing to the other and keep focus on what needs to be done and not drop the ball thank you all so much for your invaluable insight we're now going to talk about some specific clerkship and internship opportunities including the online system for clerkship application review also known as Oscar the ad a judicial clerkship program and finally the ABA section of litigations judicial intern opportunity program jio pig judge seymour can you start us off with a little bit of discussion about Oscar all right sure Oscar is like you said the online system for clerkship applications and leave you and the system was created to give federal judges a way to communicate to law students their hiring practices in the timelines that they have this system Oscar allows judges to get law clerks to a good fit for them and also gives the student a level playing field because all of the students have the same information they know what the judges are looking for what their their timelines are and any preferences that they might have prior to this Oscar system students may have heard about a clerkship position by a word of mouth or by contacting a judge's chambers and so they really knew what a judge wanted in a law clerk under the Oscar system judges will post descriptions on Oscar of what they're looking for in a law clerk the mean for example a judge could indicate what courses they are looking for what barb memberships of any they require if they have a cut-off class rank prior work experiences and any professional organizations that there would give our interest to the particular judge and the Oscar system allows the judges to electronically sort of applications and by doing that they can focus on those applications that meet their particular criteria and it also has been students because it makes it easier for students to find judges that they would like to apply to and areas that they want to apply to and judges who may have a background or interest that they also have an interest in and once the application process is is completed the judges then can look at the letters of reference that the student put on and then use use that the electronic system to look at applications rather than getting boxes and boxes and boxes of application also under Oscar the applicants can review the different profiles of the judges and determine you know which judges have open positions and which judges do not so that you don't send an application to a judge that doesn't have an opening and recently Oscar now allows the applicants to update their documents that is you can report a new grades you can report class rank updates and any new awards or recommendations and other information you can do that now also under Oscar you can see a judge's preferred interview methods whether a judge does interviews by telephone a video conference or whether or not the judge has any preference at all so the benefit of Oscar is that it lets the judges sort through and rank applications that are of most interest to them and it also allows students to be have information all of the students have the same information and apply to judges that they're also interested in as of now I think there's seventy-three percent of all the federal judges have an Oscar profile and rising second year law students can register for an Oscar account on jun 1 and rising 2 l's can submit online applications for available law clerk positions third year law students and law school graduates can register for an Oscar account anytime and submit online applications and I there's a limit of 100 finalized applications to law clerk positions of any term length so that is the cutoff and so I think it's a system that makes the whole process a little easier for everyone thank you don't see more in judge brisbois can you tell us about the AV a judicial clerkship program yes thank you you know where our attendees right now the there how do we do it but great many of them may be wondering if I'm even interested in a clerkship and so the ABA judicial clerkship program gives you an opportunity to explore that see what being a law clerk is like and whether it's something that you would either aspire to or want to make part of your professional career after law school the program is in its 16th year come this sebra weary at the major meeting it's a BA it's held in conjunction with the ABA major meeting this year that's in San Diego California we have the program is one that's open to law schools who wish to send a group of students to the program they law schools will select who are the attendees are going to be usually if a school participates it's based on student communication with their administration and desire to have them be a participant with a in the judicial clerkship program the typical size of a law school delegation is 5 to 10 students usually six to seven is about average and the hey ghouls well there's a fee which the administration would pay and in the past it's been a three-year commitment to the JCP but this year given the economics that law schools are facing schools can commit to a one-year participation to see if at the program that they want to make a regular part of the services available to their student body see we have room for 75 to 100 participating lawsuits and the way the program works is over the course of two and a half days they will be paired in small groups with two to three judges State Court judges state court trial judges state appellate judges federal trial judges we have federal appellate judges participating we have also are exposed to other kinds of courts we have an administrative court judges participate and we have international court judges participating because they all use law clerks in different ways and so it's an opportunity to not only find out if you want to be a law clerk but also to find out a variety of the types of law clerks and the areas of law where they're utilized which might better fit with your personal interest not during the two and a half days the way you interface with those volunteer judges is part of it is a resume critique just mentoring answering questions but also there is a writing project you get you get a fact pattern and you work with the judge to develop analyses and drafts of an order or opinion and the problems are interesting and unique because they are based on cases that are currently pending before the United States Supreme Court and don't have a clear-cut answer and so the research that's done during the two and a half days to come up with the writing that the student do is challenging and interesting and unique it's sponsored by lexisnexis so you have full access to online computer research and then during the time there are also other opportunities to meet and socialize and network with the volunteer judges other members of the judicial division there's a there's a field trip to see actual oral arguments in our local court and talk to their clerks as to how things are going on on the ground for them in their position the and a number i can tell you that a great many of the attendees will make relationships with some of the judges volunteer judges that have in the past led to internships and in many cases to clerkships after law school the typical student to attend the JCP is usually a 1l or a 2l because they're as i said they're using the opportunity to see if clerkship is something that they're interested in and then get the insights of judges volunteer judges as to how they can use the remaining time in law school the best position themselves to pursue and achieve that goal of a clerkship if the people attending this comp this webinar are interested in attending the judicial clerkship in san diego this coming februari you should approach your school's administration explain the ABA judicial clerkship program there's information on the ABS website but more specific inquiries and information can be directed to a be a staff person who is in charge of registration her name is Sharon Kindle fh aro n TI n da ll her phone number is 312 98 856 424 email is capital F H arom capital p IM da ll app American Bar dot org we are currently accepting applications the registration deadline is will be is actually going to be extended well into December so there's plenty of time for your students to approach your administration if you have an interest in the program and have them inquire as to participating for this coming year in San Diego thank you thank you judge burns by Judge Lynn can you quickly tell us about the ABA section of litigation judicial internship opportunity program yes I'll make this brief so we'll have a couple of minutes for questions this program is called the J op program an acronym for the title of the program its purpose is to provide internship opportunities that come with compensation for the summer some students work for credit some work for compensation the compensation is paid through the American Bar Association for to the litigation section for a minimum of six weeks it provides opportunities to students who are in traditionally underrepresented groups racially or ethnically students who have disabilities or economically disadvantaged who are LGBT students and also veterans it's a full-time summer internship program it works at various times during the summer the applications are screened and then given to judges who make their decisions about hiring we hire both first and second year students in the cities that are listed on the screen that you see and also in Washington DC the application deadline is January the fourth we sometimes have extended that for people who participate in the program that Judge brisbois just described at the ABA mid-year meeting which is in February but if you're interested you should assume this is a solid date of jiggler fourth and get your application in you can access the program by just googling the joy out program and it'll bring it up but you also have the email address on the screen thank you very much judge Lynne we have received three questions in advance that you all have so wonderfully already answered one was whether or not students from small out-of-state schools will be considered and we've heard from Judge Brisbois that yes they are and also from Judge Lynn that you just need to explain why you're interested in moving to a new location and we also heard whether or not prior work experience is considered both from Judge Seymour judge Lynne that yes it is sometimes it's focused on by certain judges more closely than others and finally should a student who seeks a clerkship have a writing certificate and while it may not necessarily be necessary it is something that is highly considered and extremely important to judges the writing samples whether or not their cover letters have been proof read and also the importance of a great recommendation letter during the process those seem to be all of the questions than I am seeing Joseph rain this is judge Lynne if we have just a second I would love to add one more thing if I may and that is the importance of an internship and that flows nicely from my very abbreviated discussion about the judicial intern Opportunity Program I take in terms every summer and my hiring standard for summer interns is a little bit lighter academically than it is for clerks I don't hire my summer interns as clerks I've made them all ineligible so someone really wants to clerk for me should not intern for me but it gives a pretty good experience in my judgment that is a very helpful credential to apply for a clerkship elsewhere and I've had plenty of my intern who have gotten clerkships where I think their academic achievement might have been a little white but they got a better evaluation from judges who were considering their application because they had that internship experience so I just want to say that whether through the jail program or otherwise it's a very good thing to try to do either during the year part time while you're in school or during the summer and let me just say that I agree with judge lynn that I take interns every year and their volunteer they're not paid but and that shows a commitment to learning the process of what the judicial system is all about and I don't hire my interns but I have hired interns from other judges so thank you both for that I actually interned my after my first year in Kansas City in federal district court and I'm not on the law review or moot court at my school but was still able to land a federal clerkship in Philadelphia after law school and I take part of that too great nan formed recommendation letters but also to my internship experience that summer in Kansas City with that I'd like to thank our faculty for this program judge Brisbois judge lynn and judge see more thank you so much for sharing your expertise with us on behalf of the ABA I'm Josephine bond thanking you all for joining us as a reminder ABA membership is now free for all law students with no worries about dues now all law students can access the abs resources build networks and develop their profession their professional outlook please visit our website for more information finally before you leave please wait for the evaluation to come up on your screen thank you all so much for attending the program you
