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good morning everybody and welcome to the seventh edition of our fast forward webinar series here looking ahead with industry experts my name is craig hart i'm the product manager at infinity workforce solutions and we're very happy to have you with us today we're very excited about uh what we're going to talk about today because it's a little bit different than traditionally how we approach these and it really came about as a conversation that we were having with some new organizations that were looking at safety training they had challenges that they were trying to surmount within their organizations they understood the value of safety training they wanted it they're the ones that had gone through the most recent audit or dealt with a recent accident they wanted to make sure that that didn't happen again or put in steps to prevent it but they were having a hard time with getting the ownership on board or they had ownership on board or the ownership said hey you have to have these other departments in line for this to be a winner for us and also they were having challenges getting their drivers to participate they were scared that their drivers would push back if they were asked to do anything additional when it came to safety training and i know for some of the people on this call today it's gotten to the point where it's so bad that there are people within your organization that say hey there's nobody out there in trucking that does this and and that's just not true uh there are people that have put in place very successful safety programs that have managed to get the buy-in of all these different groups to make their program a success and we felt it would be very helpful for those of you competing against that pushback to hear some of those folks today listen to them let them share the things that worked for their organizations that elevated their safety program and without further ado i wanted to introduce our panelists today first on the call we have bryce alexson who is the safety and compliance coordinator with magnum limited out of fargo north dakota we also have larry finley who is the environmental health and safety manager of white arrow llc out of the los angeles area and last and certainly not least is jonathan richardson the director of corporate training with martin transport out of kilgore texas um thank you all for being on the call today everybody thank you yeah thank you good morning awesome well i'd like to help set the stage a little bit for our audience and give you guys just a couple minutes uh starting with bryce just to talk a little bit about uh magnum just to let people know who they are what you guys do what you all haul how big you are and where you operate sure well my name is brace alex and i'm the safety and compliance manager at magnum we are based out of fargo north dakota just a little bit about our company so we have five different divisions within our company we have an lt uh ltd company which is our over the road we have right around 250 drivers within that company our ltl which is less than truckload is our local and regional division right around 300 drivers maybe 800 to 100 freight handlers we're mostly based out of minnesota north dakota south dakota iowa nebraska and montana we also have a dedicated division which only hauls for certain companies right around 100 drivers we have four warehouses where we also have about 100 employees employed and then we have a logistics division as well so overall we're just over a little over our 1000 employees company-wide excellent excellent all right jonathan tell us a little bit about martin absolutely martin's a pretty diverse company martin transport is actually one of the business units under that corporate umbrella it's kind of important to know the rest of the company and why that transport division is actually there martin is comprised of businesses from coast to coast from california to florida and as far north as as omaha and our our expertise really is in chemical and petroleum so we have refineries and we have fertilizer facilities and and everything in between our transport division helps us obviously move that product among products also for for other customers that are out there and within that mti umbrella it's a host of things molten sulfur is one of the things that we do along the gulf coast of course that fertilizer anhydrous acid a host of petroleum products you name it so if it's a it's a hazmat type load petroleum chemical that's where we're at gotcha excellent all right and then larry um tell us about white arrow uh yeah white was based out of california we are actually in illinois area um new york new jersey portland oregon area um massachusetts and east coast to west coast we uh actually haul produce and dry commodities we're over 100 rivals we have warehousing and private locations states that we deal with and basically i'm out of california so i run the show from here to the east coast excellent so awesome all right well i know um that safety training doesn't just come from a vacuum that you have to start someplace and i know that it's a process that has to be addressed year over year with ownership because it is a i know at least with our model is a yearly contract sometimes multi-yearly when you all are approaching ownership or when you were putting this process in place because i know uh jonathan it's it's been a couple years that you guys have been working with us and you probably remember what it was like to have that initial discussion um how did you approach this with ownership what did you tell them to get them on board with why this was a necessity and i'll start with you jonathan absolutely i think it's a multifaceted question honestly and and and we started in phases for us as a company there's a there's a there's a place in apex that we want to shoot for and like any dream or goal that moves so when you get close to that it moves a little further down the road and you keep shooting for that this company realizes the value of training and the value of people and and their safety and so i'm fortunate to be able to work for a company like that and the way that this really gets started for us is yes we can run kpi's we can run crash and incident statistics and data and we can see where training can have a direct influence on that but that's only if everybody gets by him um you know if everybody doesn't have buy-in then it may not move those numbers like you would like them to move so so we've started or implemented executive management here in operational excellent system and that's all about culture for us our core values you know what we want to do the whole philosophy is is do it right and and do it safe and treat everybody like a leader because honestly regardless of what some position is you're in that position because you're the best at it you're the leader of that and so we want to take that approach and so for us training was one of those things that came naturally to drill down on that the problem that we ran into is you know by by nature um mti the transport side has employees has drivers and they have their mechanics and those people in those shop areas are pretty easy to be able to train but from the transportation only side as far as the drivers are concerned they're very transient you know we were trying to catch up with these people and provide training from instructor-led type methodology even with the instructors that we had on staff multiple it was very difficult to do that sure so our whole goal there was to reach them well looking at it from that standpoint there was three things that we approached them with when we started talking about let's let's go towards an online platform to try to reach them with a portion of this training one was that whole distance thing what what's the efficiency you know do we have an instructor that goes out and tries to catch drivers but he may miss one because of a special run he had to go do and so we got to send people back and forth and with us being spread across the country that leaves some gaps that leave some concerns so you know you can you can see the value of being able to reach them you know in an online delivery and doing that more efficiently the other item that was a selling point for us going towards an online platform for transportation was that a lot of times there's training out there but it's not specific training it's industrial safety well it's not specific to transport and that's something that infiniti allowed us to do their content was designed and pointed towards this type of industry transportation not to mention you allow us the infinity allows us to be able to put company specific information so we have a group here in house that can design and develop content so we're able to load that specific information up and give a specific message that maybe executive management wants kind of a point of need if you will so for us it was revolved around you know efficiency people less travel and more impact and being able to give a specific message training content to individuals that are out on the road excellent excellent no i've actually seen some of your in-house content and um i know that you guys are are fortunate to have that unit in-house that is able to build those things for you and they do very good work um so i i have been uh very impressed but i also understand that the need that you all have because some of the things that you are working with on a daily basis so that your drivers are hauling you know that it could literally kill you in 30 seconds if you don't know what you're dealing with um and uh because i have gone through your anhydrous ammonia training and so i i can attest to that but no that's great that's great um larry uh what uh what did you use how were you able to get get the buy-in from ownership and leadership well um when i first came into the era i'm actually a little bit of a quality background as a law enforcement a little i'm safe to the raptor for uh when i was in the military also when i was in um working for the joint enforcement agency so i was a safety person um like that's why they held me while i retired um the reason they wanted to um use a system they had jj challenge first okay j.j keller to me is um is only used for one thing only which is trucking industry in our case we have warehouse and we have trucking and we have admin people so they want me to put a program together to see how to be trained everyone just not one person but we need to train one person on what the other person does but he can understand what drivers do a lot of people understand what drivers do they think is a bunch of old man driving a truck with attitude so my thing is i'm looking for a training program for dispatching which you guys are the only one i know that has a very good dispatchy training on how to train a dispatcher to talk to a driver um once i went through yoga guys i guess a weekend or a couple of days program i came back to the company i gave them some of your websites and they asked me how i felt about it it was very easy to get on board with you guys um excellent excellent now i know that dispatcher training is that that's the damn baker training that you have everyone right through and you'll be really active and and you're not lying you you train everybody at your company i mean it's not just drivers it's the lady that answers the phone at the front desk it's shop maintenance it's everybody from mechanics to the dispatchers to the customer service to the accounting because everybody has to know everybody has to understand the industry if you don't understand the industry then you're going to have communication issues back and forth and then if another company calls this for something and the county lines down what they're talking about then you have a father so your guys platform integrates with my training and also i go out every three months and do training uh which all look with the whole staff um because i'm noticing so if i so i'm always a trainer so i combined that with that and it works like great for me i mean and then i insurance you can pick up the tab because we have something insurance between our people if i get away from con cases then they'll pay for our training so it works out good for us and then a lot of these companies don't realize they have that training program in in their insurance they just don't utilize it so something to think about too absolutely absolutely now bryce how did uh how did you approach that with magnum um yeah so it's it's it's funny it's kind of silly when i think about it now but when i first came on with magnum um what we were doing and this just kind of shows how far the technology has come we would um do our own um safety content but we would uh you know burn it to cds send it out to our terminals or you know our over the road truckers we would make sure they would come into either a farmer facility or one of our other facilities and complete training that way um it wasn't a very good process you know i kind of lucked out i didn't have a ton of pushback from um you know upper management on this they between upper management and the help with our insurance companies we knew the importance of providing continual training so we just started looking around for platforms and and infinity was by far the best we found because of how specific it was to the trucking industry um but for us too along with what larry was talking about we provide training for every employee so infinity also helps you know we can upload our own content pdfs if i find a pdf i think everybody should be reading or looking at we're able to upload that and everybody's get some sort of content it's not going to be the same for everybody but we're able to get in front of everybody with continual training excellent now i think that's actually key because when drivers feel like they're being singled out for something uh which many of them can potentially consider a punishment or punitive um and you know they can't go back to the company and talk to someone in dispatch or operations that or even hr payroll what have you that that's not experiencing the same thing they they do feel left out versus when they can call in and know that somebody else has gone exactly through the same thing that they have gone through uh and knows where they're coming from and what they're talking about it's it's another point that they have in common with the company and with the home office staff and i and i do think that's important because it does lend itself to the a culture that everybody does it everybody's participating this is not just something we're singling certain kinds of employees for um so that is great now larry when you were rolling this out since i know that you provide this training to literally everybody in the company was there any department that pushed back was there anybody that said i don't want to do this and and if they did what did you do to get them on board larry's still there i think we may have lost larry all right i'll take it to you bryce um for those folks since you do train everyone wasn't anybody that's sorry about that okay excellent all right i was worried about last year so no well our company um they just they they go with the floor because they feel the more training it gets the better is but you guys you know i was telling to talk to them about your company because they like to get a report for how the company or what companies can do for us but in your just to give you guys you know a little praise and certain things you guys actually do that that sold the company with any company ever messes up the ceo or the ceo or the cfo wants to give a message out to all employees you can go to your company and you guys are broadcasting after the company which would be really really good setup that's all you guys have and we can also use our platform and put into your system as long as we own the platform and grew training that way also that we can't do with jj keller or any other company uh so it was very easy to sell everyone um if the county had a special train they want to give i can give it to me i put on pdf uploading your system they shoot it out to your you know their team also with the colbert thing you know we can shoot out messages to get to everyone even though we may email everyone but everybody does their monthly training they get a double double wrap and they can understand what we're trying to do with it you know for coal vet so you you guys the main thing i really like about the company now is not that training for the train is excellent and it integrates with our system but it's a customer service you guys dedicate that one person to that one company as long as they don't leave you know you have that person for it and that person knows you you know that person so you get a like a you know your own personal person to help you out throughout the time sure no that's your your client's success rep so um yours is leslie uh jonathan's yours is aaron bryster's is leslie but we have a team of uh gosh right now i think we're at 16. csrs and for those of you on the call not familiar with that we don't do the the faceless customer service we assign a client success representative to every one of our accounts and some of the relationships that that these csrs are able to form can be very long-standing uh upwards of several years and they and they basically function as an adjunct for your organization on our end so if you find yourself in a situation where you need help putting together some training for a particular month or you go on vacation and forget to assign something out for a given month you can call them email them go hey i need to put together training on this particular subject can you help me out and they'll find out a couple details about what you're looking for when it needs to go out and then they can make recommendations of coursework that you can use to save you the time and trouble from having to do that so i know that the relationships that our three panelists have on this call uh i mean they are participating in this call as a direct result of relationships they have with their csrs because their csrs know how these these groups all operate and how successful they are at what they do that when i asked for uh recommendations of people that would be great speakers uh these these were absolutely hand-picked folks by their their client success reps so um i can't stress that enough we don't believe in doing the faceless version where you call in and have to talk to someone new every time you have a challenge because you have to restart your conversations every time you do that over and over and over again and that's just not good for your safety training continuity we want to know what you're trying to fix we want to know what you've done in the past and how we helped previously so we can build on these things over time um now bryce since you do also train for all employees was there any pushback when you guys were trying to implement this system and move away from those cds particularly our over-the-road division it was it was difficult at first with them still kind of can be um but as long as you're you constantly explain the importance of it why we do it um how it can improve them as drivers how it helps the company just you can't be you have to be unwavering with it you just have to be relentless and be continuous and we've our buy-in has really increased i think the first year we started doing this you know we were probably around 50 to 60 completion second year we were in the 80s and then and so far this year we're hovering right around 92 to 93 completion rate company wide every month uh i want i want you to repeat that because they're going to be people that are on this call today that don't believe that that can happen they think if they get 50 they are doing awesome but i actually leslie and i audited your participation last month you had 94 this month you were already up to 95 percent yeah and it's it's just staying consistent you got to you know a lot of people don't understand why you do this and you know another group you might see the more the most pushback from if you do do a company wide are going to be your office employees um they can look at it as well it's you know it's pointless that nothing's going to happen to me i'm i'm at my desk everything's fine but i think it's also important you need to mix up the content if you kind of do the same thing every month or even decide well i'm gonna these are the topics i'm gonna cover every month or the next 12 months and just kind of repeat that stuff that's when you start to get people to not become interested in it i'm always changing stuff up they never know what i'm going to cover from months to months so it kind of keeps them interested that way excellent no i i do we do encounter people that have that kind of fatigue topic fatigue i guess you would kind of call it and that is one of the things that we're constantly having to work against internally putting out new content uh different ways to save the same information because the information is still valid it's just how can we talk about speeding and speed management in a way that doesn't become a droning voice in the background that they still pay attention to so uh jonathan when you were implementing this was there anyone internally department-wise that was was not on board or that you had to get by and i know sometimes people have challenges with hr challenges with groups that think well hey this is not the way that we've always done it we want to continue doing it how we are our same patterns because that's what we're comfortable with i didn't know if you had any experience with that there were i wouldn't call them challenges there was lots of questions concerns about delivery and you know with drivers the whole hours of service how are they going to do it you know and not exceed this the way we count things time wise and but the beautiful thing here was you know with the whole micro learning content that fear kind of goes away we're throwing those short segments out there those those key points we want to make impact with and it's not eating into a lot of time so so with that delivery you know mti was the martin transport was the last business unit that we brought on to training and the industrials they do uh industrial training too but the reason this one was the last is because you know normally those online deliveries are somewhere between you know 30 minutes to 60 minutes those training segments it's just not conducive to the atmosphere that that the driver is working within so so micro learning was one of those sway points that was really the concerns that they had it was time of training how long was it going to take how do we deliver that and break it up so that was that was the fix for that solution or for that issue excellent excellent now so we've got we've talked about ownership how do we get the the person that signs the check on board we've talked about how do we get all the additional stakeholders on board within an organization um your hr your business services your shop your maintenance getting everybody to participate and then of course last but not least is drivers drivers are the group that is the end user the recipient of all this training and they tend to be conservative not in a political sense but in a sense that they don't like change uh they they are adverse to sometimes things that are new or forced upon them um but they're also the group that is the highest risk because they're the ones behind the wheel in the equipment is traveling along now we do have groups that have varying degrees of participation i know with with magnum bryce your group is exceptional is very much on the high end of participation um in terms of of companies that that even we work with and encounter that is that is great uh because it means that at that point and you've probably experienced this that if you don't assign out training one time does your email blow up with people going hey where's my training now because you've made it that habitual yeah uh yeah there i usually so i set up the training um so everybody receives their training for sure by the first of every month um i may forget to send an email out reminding everybody it's on there and yeah that first week i usually get a bunch of emails or phone calls asking if the training's up so yeah it's gotten to the point to where people just know no that's awesome that's ideal because it means that in some respects the ownership of this program has shifted from you to them um and and then they care they're paying attention and that's that's really all safety is about is are you paying attention to what's going on do you know how to respond um and and i think that's wonderful and uh uh do you have any kind of incentive program that you use or i guess how do you get people to participate is it a carrot or is it a stick is it a job expectation something that's in their their job agreement how do you get that hive of participation yeah we well i mean for our um ltl and dedicated divisions they're i mean they're paid hourly anyways so um they're kind of not given given the choice um if they're going to be at the terminal it's just something that and that's that that has come from our managers within those departments um within those divisions uh they've just been really good at making sure that you're not going to have a choice this is what you're going to do ltd which which was a little bit more of a struggle for us we do have um they have an incentive bonus every month um and it's an all or nothing bonus and um part infinity training is part of that okay so they could make a pretty significant bonus every month um doing a number a number of things but if they don't complete their infinity training everything else they did um it's not going to matter gotcha gotcha okay now larry with your folks do you have any kind of uh i guess how do you drive participation of your folks completing the trainings well my drivers they know it they they went from 20 minutes 25 minutes training video from jc keller to a three to four minute training every month for you guys um it's just required by law that they have to do training so i mean they take it seriously in our case which i love your platform is because i do a year of training i give leslie here's my yearly training putting your system in automatic every month on the first of every month because if it's a sunday or saturday it shoots out an email to all my drivers and then when you get towards the end of the month it shoots out another enough that you have not you know done your training and then i'll take that report and we'll have a chit chat with the drivers of this a month um your train is part of my orientation because my orientation is in your system so the drivers already know about it they know how to get into your system when you do the orientation from our company that we put in there um and they know they get training once a month so they love it because this went from 45 minutes 25 minute videos to three to four minute videos you know i'm sitting at a terminal waiting on a delivery and pick up our drop off so i don't have too much of a issue you know i think i'm going to have an issue with sometimes the executive you know yeah ceo or the ceo like you know well ceo is pretty good he does he does the training with the dispatchers he's at the train as a driver so but you know sometimes i see or my vice president they have a tennessee beginning and they get written up just like everyone else so it's nice they share their their blame so everybody works together on it so like i said but it's introduced at the beginning of orientation which is great because that way you don't have to worry about anything just tell that this is what i got who's the orientation when she takes care of it i'm done no i love that because you can't say oh i've never done this before because they did an orientation you set the table already for what they can expect and they can't push back on that now so yeah that's all we do yearly training so the yearly training is good because certain months of the year we have to do it like you know for uh trucking trafficking now kind of came out again we have to do so all that's set up for everyone so much they may have two or three videos you have to do sometimes you may just have one but it's set up in a year in advance and every year we have the same training a particular month that we have to do by law and then we switch off other stuff too even with the mechanics in the in the warehouse personnel and also they turn if you have a hr tab in there too to be used for hr so uh it might like say i don't have to worry about thinking oh did i turn out the training this month it's done yearly once he has it he shoots it out i'm down a lot i can give him all times or whatever for that whole year because i know that the training has already died so i can work on something else so it's a big help no that's and that's huge and we recommend setting up training in advance because the system can be set up so that it hits different trigger dates but 12 months of training i mean that's a huge time type for you because that means you're not having to figure out month to month oh what am i going to train out you've already got that planned out the content's already been selected and then it just kicks off automatically in the system so that's great that's great all right now jonathan comes to you on drivers so um what kind of i guess how do you drive by in there at martin how do you get people to participate obviously there's the seriousness of of some of what they're hauling uh contributes to their desire to participate i'm sure uh but but uh but i know that you definitely get a lot of buy-in as well absolutely absolutely we kind of goes some there's there's multiple parts but some of it goes back to the whole management system that i was talking about earlier in vision that we have and yes 100 compliance is an expectation but from a management standpoint we have to look at that from a systems perspective as well you know what what do we do to aid in that process and so we do have an incentive program each month we push out training on the first we try to make sure that it's out on the first for consistency because you know the whole change thing is is hard on people so if it's structured that way it seems to work a lot better for us we push that on the month and then by the 10th of the following month we'll run a report and that report will show if there's any outstanding people that need to to finish their training so we have a little bit of a grace there over 30 days their incentive program works on quarters so by the end of that quarter all of that training has to be completed and the way it's set up is that each manager at the terminal has all of his drivers that he's responsible for and we direct it to that terminal he all of those people management including uh including that are eligible for an incentive but training along with other items that are in our metrics are weighed in that process training is weighed more heavily than others and that it's either again like rice said it's an all or none so if all of your drivers have not completed all their trainings then that not only affects their incentive that affects the manager of that terminals incentive as well oh you roll that up okay so the manager has even more incentive to make sure that he's providing you know guidance and oversight to those drivers to make sure they're getting their their training done as well one of the the other items that i've seen that that we we had with drivers that was of a concern you know again i wouldn't say it was it was a push back but it was a buy-in it was part of participation is most of those drivers that we talked to early on if we were talking computer-based training online training it was the whole idea of i've got to use the computer part what infiniti allowed us to do was use things that they're already familiar with so so we have the cell phone they can take their training on that the kiosks they take their training on that well that's equipment they use every day so that in itself eased through that transition and gained a lot of buy-in from those drivers just just to be able to leverage the technology that they're already comfortable with excellent now you said kiosk because that was something that's set up on in each one of your locations that the drivers have access to we do we have kiosks in each terminal as well so if they're there for a stay for any length of time they can log into those kiosks and they can take their training on those as well excellent excellent now just kind of throw this out to the panel um i know some folks have the training assigned out and it's viewable on their elds do any of you have drivers that view their training on eld i do not okay we are we're currently transitioning that we're we're transitioning all of our elds to tablets okay company-wide so all of our trucks will have tablets and that's one of the features that we're adding to it as well is there option to complete the training from that excellent excellent all right here now a couple questions that i've been writing down as you guys have been sharing these things with us and thank you again so much for doing that um each one of you all talked about custom content you talked about the items you're either building in-house or the things that you find um that's something that we always recommend that people take advantage of for a couple reasons one is that it makes the training more yours uh and less infinity and i always joke that nobody signs up for safety training to go through my videos they're signing up to safety training so they can work with your company um when it comes to custom content um i guess what kinds do you use is it is it always safety specific do you do any kind of internal messaging with that i know at least one of you had mentioned that i think it was larry talked about how or maybe it was bryce i talked about the messages going out from leadership that they send out periodically about the organization about the coronavirus response i guess uh let's start with you larry what kind of custom content ideas do you use in your system right now yeah we use that um that was me you said we use customer service ceo a manager so coming and do messaging or we can even come into your green room there there's a message there which is great for something texas um we utilize it for covet we utilize it for we need to get a message out to them you know i also use this for uh every month you know every day for training for orientation training you guys have my files that i put in there because you guys keep proof that they did it just typically they've done it so i mean it's a good database i don't have to worry about using my data servers realize your service for the information to be stored and it's also good because you have outside if my driver ever gets into a accident or a serious accident first thing they're going to determine to do is go look at do you have trinity what you train you know in our case yes our drivers were training they have to get 100 on their training there's no 60 percent with 70 yeah they actually get 100 so it's it's a good data bank to have and in your case you know you have attorneys that talk to us you know who with detroit yeah we have had a couple guest speakers um some lawyers on our calls in the last couple months here so and actually i think those have been some of our most helpful webinars that we've done because they've talked about some of those legal challenges that this world is now presenting us so um but um so bryce when it comes to custom content what do you guys do yeah we you know similar to what larry was saying we will use it for um pushing out company messages you know the other nice thing about this is for example our drug and alcohol policy we want everybody to sign it every year well i can put it on the website and by them answering the have they reviewed and they understand yes that's their signature so you can get a lot accomplished using it like that i also like to between safe driving and injury prevention i try to do about a 50 50 split each month with training so um you know i'll upload a lot of stuff that is um any ng injury prevention specific so that's that's helped us a lot with that as well no i love the reality angle that's great i love the company policies that you put on there those those are great because um there isn't a uh an insurance agent alive that would not give you a giant sloppy kiss if you made sure that you had your distracted driving your cell phone policy your drug and alcohol policy all available to be reviewed by an employee and logged and signed and dated on when they acknowledged that they read it and no that's that's great that's great and jonathan i know you do i've seen some of your hazmat training that you guys have done internally do you also send out training for other reasons beyond that in terms of i guess non-safety topics yeah we've had some customers request various things be pushed out there that were more cultural related not necessarily safety related and so we've pushed those out among the things that the other gentlemen have talked about as well policies and so on and so forth we've also taken some of those if we have or have had an incident or something like that you know and we run a cause map on that incident then we can we can basically build an lfi learning from an incident around that particular you know incident around the circumstances of it and push that back out so it's kind of a you know it's a it's a circumstance but it's a circumstance we all could encounter this is how we're going to mitigate and how we're going to work around that that circulation so it's almost kind of like a broad corrective or or pre-corrective action if you will so not not fixing a problem that's happened yet but one that definitely has the potential to impact everybody okay right excellent excellent um one of the questions i know we're going to get on our q a feedback is uh owner operators do any of you work with owner operators indeed okay jonathan how do you get them to participate how do you how do you compete against the um i'm i'm my own business man or woman i do what i want you know it's again it's one of those expectations uh you know if you part of the team you're part of the team and so we expect that that train to be done and those managers and enforce that and and so far honestly you know that we may have heard some verbal pushback but everybody has participated that we've not run into any issues with owner operators not completing that task it's just important to them to get it there safely with no problems as it is to us so at the end of the day the value of the training speaks for itself and i think that's an attitude that's that is dying out because the the number of organizations that are doing safety and training is dwarfs now the number that don't and i think there has always been a threat previously that oh we'll just go someplace where they don't require this well the list of places they can go is diminishing as trucking companies more and more are embracing safety training uh to protect themselves and protect their drivers let's see here uh bryce larry do either of you work with owner operators um no we don't have an operator driver we've got you yeah we do we we got a handful of them um they're they're included in the um all or nothing safety bonus that we have with our company drivers and we've i've never heard of any pushback from our owner operators okay excellent excellent now um larry i know you've shared a little bit about what you do every month because you've got your new higher orientation for anybody walking in the door you're having monthly training go out every month uh 12 months a year and typically you usually sign out with those monthly assignments two or three videos i know you like that they're short do you have like a time frame that you look in for monthly training is it like hey i want to do 15 minutes total or 10 minutes total you know i just picked a title that i need to train on whatever your timeline you guys have in there that do that too gotcha okay and then bryce i know that you're doing monthly training as well um and then you also do corrective action so that when there are challenges tickets violations that come up you're able to assign out individualized training to specific drivers to address those issues do you have a system put in place for how you manage that um not necessary i mean it's just kind of the the teamwork of the safety department um you know we have people who you know work with our forward-facing cameras who are going to identify unsafe drivers we have our claims department that's going to work with with uh crashes or with injuries so it's we don't have anything set in stone it's just kind of um each case is going to be different you know not every not and not every crash is going to be the same you know what what led up to it what what happened during it so it's just kind of more of a feel once we get to talk to an individual what we feel they should be provided with after that gotcha okay and then jonathan i know you guys do quarterly training like clockwork on on the safety side i know it's specific to various kinds of chemicals that you guys are hauling right there um so that's all great stuff do you typically have like an amount of content that you shoot for when you're doing that quarterly training what we have is a matrix out there that says you know in this time frame we have to cover these topics either that's regulatory regulatory driven or customer driven or we we've seen a deficiency in house and we drive it ourselves and so we try to say hey you know this month we want it's kind of weird we do quarterly training but we said we break it down by month so you know in this month we want to cover these particular topics and those topics may be geared towards the driver the manager so so forth mechanic in the shop it's just it's you know we push it to all of them depending on what that topic is in the need gotcha all right all right we did have a question come through that uh i think is valuable is how do you convince the ceo to implement an incentive bonus program when their philosophy is that safety requirements are part of the compensation package that a driver is already being paid so bryce i will let you take a crack at that first how do you convince ceo to do an incentive yeah um this probably won't be a good answer or i'm not going to be able to answer it very well so it's you know part of what i talked about earlier with our ltl and dedicated divisions the management has you know come out and said you're gonna do it so it's just it's it's expected of of the drivers um or it's it's expected of all those employees to just get it done because that's part of their job and that um but with over the road the reason we moved to that is because we were having um we were struggling a little bit with getting full participation with with our over-the-road drivers so you just have to come you have to try to come up with different ideas um we used to do um monthly drawings so i'd pick random employees who um finish the training for the month and we'd give them 25 visa gift cards at the end of the year we would do uh bigger drawings where they could get anywhere from 100 to 500 um yeah you might just have to kind of kind of start off small and and see where you can develop it from there and i think it also probably helps once you have the program up you can demonstrate what has improved over time and and most improvements in safety for trucking do have a dollar amount attached to them i mean anything that you don't have to repair or replace um any time you don't have to end up in court uh i mean all of that is is financial all that is things that count against the bottom line i know that we talk about roi calculators when we are talking to prospective clients we're trying to figure out okay what's your key pain point and then how can we help you address that so at the end of the year you go okay we were trying to solve for accidents we've reduced our number of accidents by this many and it saved us this amount of dollars um so that's that's good to go so now now larry i did was your incentive program at white arrow was that something that you put in place or was that you had to sell the ceo on or was that something that they they came on board with pretty quickly well yeah the ham program i started was actually it wasn't because of training it was actually because you want to get a center program i look at the two ways how to avoid a joint driver when you get into an accident and how to avoid the truck driver from knocking off the trigger door so what we did was i put a single program together and you see eo and ceo bought off on it because um they have to work as a team each terminal has worked as a team i didn't want them working as individuals so if it's time if they have no incidents that month then each team make a certain bonus amount for that and they can get either 12 times a year or they can get it once a year and have access the rest of the year once i implement that i think i went down maybe one incident every other month from all the terminals which turned out to be good and saved us a whole lot of money so i saw the money that came in that we kept that we normally used and ran a report from uh like maybe 80 000 a year for accidents or trailer doors and then when i started the program it dropped from 80 000 a year to basically around maybe less than 25 000 a year so they own a lot of money so i mean you can put different seminar programs it depends on what issue do you have you know forex training wise though it affects their kpi so if they don't do the training they deduct from the kpi so i think you did a great thing there by tracking the progress as well so that you can demonstrate hey this was our before result this is our after result this is i think sometimes with with ceos they can sometimes get bogged down in the oh my gosh is this costing me how much this is costing me how much but when you can show them hey we implemented this for real this is a real amount of money that we spent last year on this problem and this is the new significantly lower amount that we spent this year then it then it's a no-brainer so yeah yeah they talk they talk money you know see you about to put in my pocket so yep come on tell me i can save you a hundred thousand a year then they'll start listening to you then you're gonna wonder how you're gonna do it well the first one you're going to put out and show that hey okay we have no interest in my soul last year the same month you had twenty thousand so here i saved twenty thousand so it goes on from that point forward it's easy to do you just have to be able to do it absolutely and then jonathan i'm assuming since the culture that you've been talking about on this call and and the buy-in that you've had from the highest level i'm assuming it was it was not a challenge to talk incentives with your ceo um to drive that point home you know incentives have been a part of the company even before i and we critique those cons incentives but here's the the way that that i view it it's very hard to prove incentives can actually be economical for the company that's difficult and can be beneficial from a safety standpoint and the way that you know i have in other places and would approach that here is is first off look at your turnover rate this industry specifically has a very very high turnover rate are your crashes related to those new employees is that where your greatest number is at and if that is the case you know in certain programs not only do they help us with with retention as far as taking information but retention of the employee and typically the longer tenure employees are the ones that are less incidental you know with that data secured because if you go towards anybody in the c-suite they're going to want to be able to see data and numbers and and be able to justify and verify what you're what you're showing so that's one way you could go approach that c-suite and have some justifiable information to present absolutely absolutely all right then uh did get another question coming in from the audience here thank you all of you for taking the time to share this information is greatly appreciated do all of you only have forward-facing event recorders have any of you considered inward facing event recorders and jonathan i'll go ahead and start with you on that do you have um qu stions or not inward facing cameras outward facing cameras on your trucks we we do not um we we only have the forward facing and we've deliberated over that back and forth and and honestly that's between um the mti safety person that we have that's over that part of the safety program and you know i'm over training content but i'm part of those conversations you know there's a concern about you know the value of that inward facing camera and the value of being able to protect privacy if you will so so as it stands today we we have stuck with just just forward-facing cameras okay now bryce do you all have cameras facing inward and outward no we just have the outward facing cameras in all of our trucks right now um we did uh test inward facing with a few a couple years ago but kind of the same reasons johnson brought up it it's a tough sell for drivers to have them on board with that and and understand that you're not spying on them um but i think it's i think it's the direction the the trucking industry is going to be moving in i i think within the next year or two you're going to see you're going to see a lot of it awesome awesome and then larry um do you all have inward and outward facing or just outward no we have both um we generally just mentioned yeah it will be a mandate in a few years with insurance companies because trust me it saves your company a lot of money you know how many times that camera inward and i would save us because of that i just stayed in one other day man said we hit him and pulled the camera up and he hit us so um as far as feedback from the drive you're going to get that at the beginning when we started over six years ago with camera facing them i mean 95 percent we're just going crazy but we use this for a two reason we want to make sure the safety of our drivers and two to cover they're behind and are behind when it comes to a lawsuit is in the case of the accident but mainly you can use it for a training tool you know for not wearing a seat belt you know for um falling too close for um hard turns heartbreak once the driver sees that they use it for training they really don't care of ready-made training videos for those of you that that have those types of cameras you have now the footage you can create a training piece around uh specifically folks and what we do is we go every time you go to different states we use another state camera to show what the person did but you blur burrow out their face you don't show your face we you can borrow to say but it's good for training and then once you're guys you know that um you use it for training then it becomes a everyday thing i mean but you're gonna get that kick back at the beginning when you start using cameras cameras we did and i changed 95 percent to complain and so and we had a serious incident one time and that incident saves our bud you know drivers talk to each other through states and they all accepted it oh that's going to help me oh larry can you go back and check the camera because i this happened that happened so it takes a while it's like anything you know yeah any any kind of training they're going to they're going to go back but they're good it's a good tool for a company and you know it can be mandated pretty soon with insurance companies so it saves insurance comes a lot of money from paying out oh yes insurance companies love camera footage that they can pull and it shows that your drivers were doing the right thing so awesome well guys we are at the end of our time today i wanted to thank you all for participating again i think we had a ton of helpful information shared i hope that uh pens were flying furiously uh with our audience because you guys had a lot of great perspectives and a lot of great steps that you all have taken that have worked and have been 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