Sign Banking Form Montana Fast

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all right good afternoon my name is Martha Cole I'm a historical specialist here at the Montana Historical Society and I'm delighted to welcome you all to the fourth in our series of Montana history and nine easy lessons if you missed any of the first three you can watch them on YouTube there's a link to that from our website this is also going to be recorded to watch if a friend of yours couldn't make it and wants to wants to talk about it with you next week our topic will be disintegration Montana's tribal nations in the early reservation years through the 1934 Indian Reorganization Act and that will be presented by Laura Ferguson before I introduce our speaker I'll just ask if there are teachers here who want to receive OPI renewal units I have forms so see me afterwards and if you already have a form just have me or another staff member sign your form and that's what you'll need to do to to receive your renewal unit so our topic today is industrial Montana and I'm just delighted that Paula Patrick agreed to present on this for us she's professor emeritus from George Mason University in Fairfax Virginia retired to Helena she received her PhD from SUNY Binghamton Tana she's the author of know step backward women and family on the rocky mountain mining frontier and co-editor with Elliot West of small world's children and adolescents in America 1850 to 1950 as was the author of several articles and with that I'll turn it over to Paula well thank you all for coming I thank Martha for that fine introduction today I'm going to talk about several topics it's tough to squeeze them all in but we'll try this is a quick trip through the economic history of Montana now when we talk about industrialization there were two industrialization periods in US history the first one took place on the East Coast mostly textiles manufacture in Massachusetts we probably all learned this in the sixth grade but there was a second one it's called the heavy industrial revolution and that's when companies began to really capitalize on using steam and later on the internal combustion engine so we're talking about heavy industry when we talk about industrialization in the second period and that pertains to Montana now we're not talking about the potato chip factory in Missoula or the biscuit factory in Helena or talking primary's is probably a Butte story but more than anything else all right so keep that in mind heavy industry now if we plot on a map sites of heavy industry you're beginning to see it already aren't you DoD contractors high-end retail will notice something now if we draw a triangle and we go across the our northern border and North Dakota is included in here I'm not sure what they do in North Dakota but I'm sure it's important we can even see this more clearly now and for whatever reason and we'll explore that today Montana this area in the United States has none of what we call heavy industry right now even the copper mine and Butte copper mining in Butte right now is not classified as that that of course is using a more modern classification but the question then becomes what happened why is this the case because it's very important it says something about why perhaps Montana does not have a sales tax and an income tax instead their whole wrath load of questions we could ask about why Montana that part of North Dakota etc does not have heavy industry while the rest of the nation pretty much does I think there's a small area in northern Alabama that doesn't have any either but we won't compare ourselves to Alabama okay so that wasn't always the case now we're going to step back a little bit here in the beginning after the gold rush we had silver mining unless for a moment sort of step back even a little bit further when Montana sort of came into being as a territory there were high hopes in fact in the new york times montana would advertise come to montana build your factory here and they would tout all the advantages one would have in putting a plant or some kind of heavy industry in montana or any industry at all to be honest this was especially prevalent in the 1880s right montana advertised in new york times all the household periodicals and it was very optimistic very optimistic by 1900 those advertisements had vanished instead articles appeared in various publications like inside the mind of the montana brown trout battling the chinook salmon what had happened between inviting all the industry to montana and then contemplating the mind of a montana brown trout now i know there are people who think that's very important so but the whole mindset of montana had changed from industry to tourism why had that happen well let's step to take a step forward and talk about silver mining because this is really where our story begins right silver mining requires heavy fixed capital cost things like stamp mills and whatnot silver mining began in montana roughly with 1878 around Phillipsburg with the bimetallic and the granite mountain mines okay it required a heavy investment in works and whatnot and that was because silver is an amalgam unlike gold it doesn't appear free it has to be smelted to bring the silver out and then of course you have to get rid of the mercury that was part of the amalgamation the smelting process and to do this you needed to build a good deal of stuff this is an early mine in cable Montana but you could already see that unlike placer mining which you did in a long time a sluice box or using your thighs sitting in a stream or the pan this is much more complicated and it very quickly becomes even more complicated okay this is a comet mine still exists you can go and see it and you can see already that the works has become much more complex they're using gravity a lot here to move the silver and what they're doing essentially is crushing it this particular mine did not have smelting works so they are crushing the ore in order to send it off okay where did they send it in the early days they had to send it all the way to Wales to be reduced okay so wagon loads of this crushed rock went to the nearest railroad which during the 1870s the Utah Railroad ended about in Dillon so it was a good trip a good long trip to move this crushed rock to Dillon get it on the Utah Railroad get it to the Union Pacific Railroad send it to the east put it on a ship and then send it to Wales to be reduced they would also do that with copper in the early days too but it began here with silver now in addition to the infrastructure required for silver mining it soon became clear with all this moving or to Wales that that was not a profit-making endeavor so there was always pressure to get a railroad into Montana and with silver the possibility of silver and its profits investors in the east saw a possibility and so they were the sort of impetus behind getting a railroad into Montana and they had enough money to do it the first round Jay Cooke ended badly anything that Jay Cooke touched seemed to end badly except for his last project which was good for Montana but he was like a cat with nine lives he always recovered from his latest financial disaster so the railroad became extremely important and investors saw now that there was a reason to really build one in Montana because there wasn't a reason before why build it into a place where there are no people so now there was a reason okay the first railroad as I said was the Utah and northern okay and it came up to Dylan it was a narrow gauge railroad in other words it didn't fit into the standard gauge but it got things and whatnot from around Dylan south to Korean Utah which is where it hooked up with the Union Pacific it was a seven day stage ride or wagon ride to Dylan and then loading up in these very small narrow gauge cars to go to Corrine okay now the Northern Pacific Railroad soon followed and the Northern Pacific the story of the Northern Pacific Railroad is a complex one it go it makes it to Bismarck by 1876 earlier in 1873 it had declared bankruptcies one of three that the Northern Pacific would endure and in 1876 of course it carries the news of the Battle of Little Bighorn okay and we can see here it enters Montana about near weibo guys a little jump up to Glendive which is its first railroaders correct me if I'm wrong section point in Montana goes down to Miles City Billings oh by the way when I was doing this putting the presentation together I was thinking I wrote on trains I would say how many people in the audience would have ridden on a trade how many people yay yeah I thought there's someone as old as I am in the audience okay went down through here and here was an interesting thing it's split here Livingstone which was a big big shop for the Northern Pacific one the northern route went up to helena southern through Butte and then on out to the Puget Sound it arrived in Butte on the day after Christmas in 1881 by June of that year it was in Helena and on out so pretty much the state was covered it just had a little bit there left to do the Golden Spike was ceremony took place in the summer of 1883 and Frederick Billings had a great party and of course then the Northern Pacific declared its bankruptcy again we're lucky to have it now so finally the railroad comes there is a reason for it to come it of course at this time also there's another development nationally and big investors who are always on the lookout for the next big thing see it as extremely important and that is Thomas Edison's electric light and Thomas Edison's electric light will require copper and lots of it and Butte Montana had copper and lots of it so now there is a second very large reason to invest in Montana okay now the problem be Kent becomes then where where does the money come from this is a huge investment project this is not a small thing at this point the sources of capital are in Helena and but the project is too big for the banks in Helena at this time Helena had six banks four of them national banks it was richer than Denver in terms of its capitalization but even then it could not handle the risk associated with railroad building it will soon become clear that it can't handle the risk of building the infrastructure in Butte and certainly Daly & Clark W a Clark Marcus Daly realized this and they go east and west for the sources of their capital because once again we're going to require lots now along with the railroad comes immigration the Northern Pacific for example opened offices in Norway and in Germany recruiting people settlers to come to Montana it was a good time to do this because Europe was in an uproar and people wanted to get out for example my ancestors there were third well there were 12 when they started out from what is now Czechoslovakia be Bohemia then twelve boys and the one girl would be born in on the island in New York City and they came because of the twelve boys they didn't want to be drafted so I come from a honorable family of draft dodgers but they were just not going to get into what was going on I looked at their you know now with the internet you can see everything and I looked at the town they came from a place called Terra DJ I would leave chairman DJ really I mean it looked like a horrible place I jump on that sign up and go right away okay now immigration of course there are two streams one is the agricultural stream what these railroads want are good farmers stalwart good farmers and they want them in places where no people live so they can build towns and sell Lots in these towns and sells sections now it's probably someone in this room who comes from a family that bought a farm or a ranch from the original Northern Pacific or Great Northern land grant this is how the railroads made their money and paid off their debts as selling for example the NP owned every other section in eastern Montana so this how they made their money and barring the bankruptcies which seemed to overtake them because of bad management they made a lot of money and this attracted the farming the farmers the second stream came because they had heard about the good wages paid in mining never mind that many of them knew nothing about mining when they heard five dollars a day they were on a train and folklore has it that sometimes they really didn't know where they were going and so someone who knew where they landed in New York City or New Orleans and whatnot would pin a picture on the jacket of the seven stacks of the never sweat mind and conductors along the way would know to say keep going keep going until they got to Butte where they would say stop this is this is it this is the place so you have these two stream the industrial stream the agricultural stream and of course the industrial stream heads immediately for beauty I see the good wages as I said many of them did not know anything about mining and the coroner's inquests and silver bowl county attest to that some of them are pretty pretty grisly to read one of them is the before safety regulations required it the cages had no sides and what you would do is you'd hold on to a bar on top and then drop down the shaft you would go from maybe 30 below on the surface to maybe 96 degrees below okay and you're going at a pretty good clip down there people of course would get dizzy and they'd reach out to steady themselves except the wall was a moving target and several of them were sucked between the wall and the cage which I can't imagine what that would do but and it happened quite often and sometimes they would be warned but so many languages were spoken that they oftentimes didn't understand and most of the shift bosses were Cornish and spoke English and that was probably the least of the number of languages now if we saw that silver mining required a huge infrastructure copper mining in Butte required even more this is the gallows choice Gallus waste at the Seward mine in in Butte and you can see already we have a hoist we have a hoist house back there you can't see it but there would be a a cable running back to the hoist house you can see the tracks for a narrow gauge tramway that would take the ore out to the main train which would in later days take the ore over to anaconda to the smelter or as they say and the Conda in eastern Montana okay now it even gets more elaborate this is the famous seven stacks of the never sweat mine and you could see already what's necessary this is the mines own rail line as smelting facilities inside this sort of long building here are big compressors that are sending air down you could see a double hoist there the never so it was a big operation and here's the hoist house here the cable runs in there and there are complex series of belts and whatnot that makes sense to the miners about things that are happening underground if someone needs to come up or down if there's a medical emergency an accident someone needs to move material if they're doing blasting the hoist house will be put into action and people will move up and down the shafts shafts in Butte were very deep for those of us who saw in the early days the pit before it filled with water it's pretty deep and that was the deepest it went if you sort of think about an inverted Christmas tree okay that's how the mines looked going down into the pit they all went off like little branches from this Christmas tree type of affair okay so we have this huge investment and the investors are from the east and that's going to be important because they will pull out when the going gets tough and we'll see that again okay now let's get back to the amount of money that is required for for butte these are custom built host motors they are huge six-foot man they're roughly fourteen feet high and they handle this is a real modern one probably 1939 1935 and double hoist in the hoist room here and you can see over here this is where the hoist hoist man stood and there that the round thing up there which is looks like a beach ball is the call signals and he's got them all memorized and whatnot and will read them he is an incredibly important man a wrong hoist call can cause all sorts of problems but all custom-made if you go to the steward mind how many have been to the steward mind and beaut taking a look at it oh go it's really great if you like machines that's wonderful there are these wo big blue generators they're as big as this part of the room here and they were custom built for anaconda by General Electric it's got the little Anaconda Arrowhead on it and they are huge and you would think about the money that went into those big generators it's just amazing so go and see those I hardly recommend them but you kind of got to be interested in machines you know I know it's not everyone's cup of tea okay early on in Butte blasting was done by doing something called single and double jacking and what this was essentially was a bit a drill bit and single jacking was taking one hammer and pounding it in making a hole in the stope which was the front of the where they were expanding the mine or following a vein and double jacking was there would be a young bit holder who would hold a bit and then there would be two guys with big sledge hammers pounding alternatively on this bit and if they missed someone wouldn't have a hand they were huge and then the blast would the powder would be pounded in the blasting caps and then hopefully everyone would step back and then they would count to hear the number of blasts and if they didn't hear one someone had to go back and check to see went wrong and there are a number of coroner's inquests that point to the fact that sometimes they got it wrong okay now later on though these two items were created which made that job a lot easier the ingersoll-rand drill and the burly drill these are not things that you tuck in your pocket you can see the ingersoll-rand here has wheels wheeled into the tunnel and then up against the wall you can see it's kind of drilling a hole there this is the burly drill it was much more powerful than the inker saw this was steam-powered of all things and this of course was a pneumatic drill the problems with both of these is that they produced a lot of dust and a lot of the copper mining was done in heavy silica grounded rock and the silica would be breathed into the lungs and this would be turned into if a man worked long years underground and to something called miners con miners consumption and what would happen is the little sharp Silica's would literally shred the lungs this was a dangerous business you had the cage you had miss blasts you had silica and then you had simple accidents like this drill falling on people the burly drill was quite heavy mostly it would be put on a tripod and manned by two men one who would sort of steer the drill any other one who would operate it but you can see how complex is this becoming from this sort of simple thing to this thing that looks like it came from outer space now here we can see the con the combination of the this is the this is Martha's favorite slide into this is the no-smoking and it's in 16 languages you have Greek okay Italian French French is right down here at the bottom obviously not many people spoke French but there are a few Spanish you can see the number and kinds of people who were there Serbian a large population of Serbs and vo but it shows the the combination of immigration and industrialization and urbanization that the buttes population swell I'm not sure it's as big as many of the books say is a hundred thousand because I really don't think they all would fit if you count the number of houses even boarding houses and the number of people several thousand people would be living in tents but that's never been reported so I'm thinking that it's a little bit less but still the population went from a couple thousand up to sixty thousand people lived right near the mines must have been terribly noisy and there are reports of people saying at four o'clock in the afternoon the visibility was so bad from the smoke that you couldn't see the street lights it would have to turn on the street lights so people could see to cross the street and not be hit by wagons okay now let's go to Helena because here's where the original sources of capital were okay and the first bank now you have to think you know what's going to happen here okay why can't Montana capitalize its own industries they could have done a small mind but they couldn't have probably done Butte that and it needed outside so St Hauser we have any number of things that are named after esti Hauser I'm here first to tell you that he was nothing more than a white-collar criminal president of the First National Bank he had all his relatives in the bank to what he would do was he would have his relatives get loans from the bank and then they would take a cut and then they would kick it back to him and this was a way he financed a lot of his projects the interesting about SD Houser he always managed to have someone else take the rap for any kind of failure in a business as a bank examiner once said st Houser is more popular than competent at running a bank he added that the records are in disarray he does not know who he has accommodated and co-signed for or what loans are in his own name so the First National Bank was chaotic from the beginning an st Houser was right in there and chiefly that's how he made his money he went through several cashiers his brother-in-law was the cashier and he made sure he had his thumb on the cashier cashier was married to Hauser's sister in the beginning he was very worried about the bank in his position in the bank but he had six children and he wanted to educate them and he soon discovered that being close to Hauser gave him a lot of money but in the beginning it caused him a lot of moral oxd that didn't last too long so there we have okay now the First National Bank is was the smallest in terms of physical plant but it's the only one that still exists right you know all been by the Securities Building this was the First National Bank and if you look at the carving right here it will tell you you'll say it was the First National Bank and when when it was built it's I think in 1935 it lost its good cupola which I would like to see come back sort of looks like a guillotine has God after the securities building but this was Hauser's headquarters when he was governor you can see there's a kind of a little door in the back there he built an annex onto the bank so that the government of Montana and the bank were in the same building he wasn't governor for long and that's an interesting question in Montana history he had wanted to be governor for so long he gets to be governor and seventeen months later he resigns I've often wondered why that happened oh why he resigned from something that he had wanted all his career interesting question you know wonder maybe something maybe someone had something on him okay we have the merchants National Bank maybe some of you remember the first National Bank no one remembers that yes okay it fell victim I think to the urban renewal but it was run by two popes well ACA Broadwater C Broadwater was president of the Montana National Bank unfortunately he died in 1892 of pneumonia things might have been different had Charlie bought broad water lived he was a very honest person and maybe some of the hide that the other banks got up - wouldn't have happened okay ta Marlowe followed him he was not as honest and upright as Charlie Broadwater there's a situation where he tried to buy bonds and one of the few going businesses in Helena he wanted to get them at a song but et Wilson the receiver of the other banks really played his game close to the chest and bested him ta Marlowe never forgot that in fact he walked over to et Wilson and told him that he would get him someday not a nice person okay here's the Montana National Bank for the how many of you are familiar with the Lewis and Clark library in the Buffalo yeah the Buffalo used to be right here right there when Charlie Broadwater founded the bank one of his friends told him that the bank that the bank would last as long as there were Buffalo know the bank would there'd be Buffalo in the streets of Helena before that Bank existed or was built and so Charlie Broadwater wanted to wanted to commemorate that and so he put the Buffalo right above the front door this the bank burned in 1943 and I think four people lost their lives in the late in the 30s and early 40s there were a lot of fires in Helena mysteriously enough and this was one of them now the second National Bank was run by Erastus de Edgerton of the amazing comb-over what was he thinking interestingly enough though he was the one honest person in the whole banking fraternity he was also left holding the bag at the very end and probably committed and probably that commit contributed to his early death but he came he was the manager of the smallest bank in July 1893 however two of the major banks closed the Montana National and the First National Bank closed their doors over in the merchants bank it was pretty scary by the end of the day Hirschfeld I have a picture of her she'll simpler the Hearst fields were down to their last ten thousand dollars as people made a run on the bank but they were steely eyed and managed to make it through IDI Edgerton also stood at the helm and managed to make it through the panic right but the failure of these two banks really rattled investors and depositors when the depositors came back they wanted to express confidence in the bank sometimes banking is like a done with smoke and mirrors and if people believe in the bank it will withstand a lot if they don't believe in the bank it will go it will go down over the cliff so both Edgerton and the Hersh fields stood strong and oh and the Helena National Bank also did the Helena National Bank though was betrayed by its president who went out and assigned his property we don't do that much anymore assignment assignment is simply that you go to a friend and say here are all my debts and all my assets figure it out so my debts are paid etc surely ashbey was his name he was extraordinarily clever he would write checks to people who write write loans to people who had no chance of paying them back one was a stable guy worked in the stables few blocks in the bank and the Helena National the other one was so upset when he discovered that he'd done this sort of bogus loan that he committed suicide when Edgerton went to ask Ashby to pay up because he owed his bank ashbey said Erastus you're taking this entirely too seriously and Edgerton is just amazed by this he's so taken aback that he's speechless nothing like this has ever happened to him so he goes back and he makes a decision then that he is going to sue Ashby in federal court he loses because Ashby lies like a rug and owns you know as part of the old old group Ashby will land on his feet after a little punishment period Edgerton won't go Edgerton in the end becomes president as these banks consolidate president of the First National Bank he does everything right clears the ledgers does everything right and he goes now to collect these these these debts that I mean and they're people who can pay it's not that AJ Seligman of the Seligman Zinn New York cannot come up with 20,000 bucks and they basically blow him off too and in the end he's connected with a Butte Bank and the Butte Bank lets him down and that's the end of the first national but to the very end even with the receiver he is extraordinarily straightforward and honest probably does him in this is something you rarely see this is my favorite it's like this is the closure notice that someone had the good sense to save from the closure of the merchants National Bank the merchants lasted was able to stave off everyone until 1897 and just before Valentine's Day in 1897 it was forced to close and this was primarily because of the Arron Hirsch Fields very messy divorce he had been involved in with this nice young girl 20 he was 20 years older than she was but Aaron is kind of a character that you kind of feel for as a historian he's 40 years old he kind of turns around his brother has a family has all this and he's been a dog's body his brother LH Lewis Hirschfeld goes off to New York does all these things and there's Aaron working in the bank it's 30 below zero in a Montana winter no he never you know never gets to go anyplace but for two weeks Lewis has gone for months at a time leaving the bank and Aaron's errand I think turned around and said what have I got and so he this young woman really likes him no and they decide to get married well they did a little bit before they got married too and they go to Chicago and go to the World's Fair and are married in Chicago okay LH his wife Mary is a force to be reckoned with one observer said Mary Hearst field wore the pants in that family at one point there's a guy she doesn't want to see her daughter during the winter here she goes up 6th Avenue in her sleigh and she corners the guy in the vestibule of the diamond block gets out her horse whip and beats him senseless jumps in her back in her sleigh well I should tell you also her pistol initially didn't work that's why she had to use the horse whip jumps in her sleigh it's not like hi-ho silver away and she you know it takes off so she is and she basically tells Aaron get rid of that woman I don't want her in the bank should say the Hurst fields are Jewish and Dell is Roman Catholic so but that didn't seem to bother them it bothers Mary Hirschfeld and Aaron is not a strong personality and he caves and when he caves it's vicious and what the Hearst fields do is they put together conspiracy Aaron goes off to Fargo which was a divorce mill its time period 1895 and they concoct this whole conspiracy that she's having sexual relations with these people in Chicago and they have these sort of lowlifes come in and testify but there's one young man who is kind of worried about this whole process and he goes to see B Nolan her attorney and he blows the whole thing up and CB Nolan is a good attorney and so these lowlifes get on the stand in Fargo in this divorce case you battled it out in court when you divorce he tears them to pieces okay and the judge is furious because well Aaron had asked not for a divorce but for an annulment because that would prevent inheritance and all this kind of stuff the judge just will not grant the annulment so the whole thing comes back here to Helena and she CB Nolan suggests to Dell that she sue mr. and mrs. Hirschfeld for alienation of affection that was an old thing we don't do that anymore he just kind of break up that's it and she wins they pay her $30,000 multiply that by 27 and you get what it would be in current dollars but P and then the Hearst fields come back and they put what is known as a card in the Helen independent and basically it says well we thought you would understand about this whole process and everything that you know that we care about this and actually I'm thinking what did the Hearst feels hope that the citizens of Helen I would understand that conspiracies are a good deal you might want to try one that it's okay to totally try to destroy a young woman's reputation it's not exactly clear but it's terribly messy and the people of Helena turn against the merchants national it's what I call or argue is there certain sort of theories in economics about what causes runs on banks and this is what I call a social shock it doesn't need to be an economic shock but things like this can affect the bank's history well what happens at the end of this 50% of the banks in Helena fail 50 percent their national banks all that's left are the American National Bank Tommy cruises workman Savings Bank and a Union Trust from Virginia City absorbs the merchants national such as it is and it becomes the Union Trust which probably several you remember was down here okay now Helen is not the only place where it banks fail 50 percent of the banks fail national banks fail across the state so capital and Montana is wholly impaired I don't think you could invest in a used-car lot at that point and what does the state do well first of all the feds do something they authorized in 1913 the federal banking Act of nineteen the National national Banking Act of 1913 and Montanans glom on to that they found found a hundred and thirty-one new banks in Montana anyone know where Edgar is Edgar Edgar had a National Bank yes small Edgar had a National Bank okay they're all pretty much in the eastern part of the state alth ugh there are several in the western part of the state now Montana also gets into the act and legislates banking and puts together a state banking system where anyone with twenty thousand dollars can put together a bank whether they know anything about banking or not this is not a good idea no no especially of course during the first world war and I I would say in one of the forthcoming lectures on home study Professor sward out will go into more into this more in more detail but this with the state response they'd legislate all these little banks so now you have 131 national banks and a bazillion of these little state banks which no one knows how to run during the First World War weather was good in Montana especially eastern Montana then came the 20s okay commodity prices tanked everything that could go wrong goes wrong and these state banks fail left and right left and right and I would like to be able to tell you the rest of the story but the governor's office took away my records so I'll just have to imagine the rest I guess I'm not kidding so at the end of this you get this some of these have been turned into drugstores the most popular way to rehabilitate some of these derelict banks just turn them into you guessed it a bar okay but they were pretty buildings they were nice now some of course has taken the lower floor here and here's a this is the to dot State Bank and that marvelous plans because there is a mercantil or some store that was built onto it so the people who put the State Bank together were kind of hedging their bets there the bank fails we still got the store in the end of course they had neither so endings with all this Bank failure and whatnot we come down to in the end we have beaut one historian has described as a not as an island completely surrounded by land it is the only industry and the only community in hell in Montana at the end of the 1930s or if even a 1920s that has any economic vitality everything else is pretty much hanging on to the ropes you sort of have the you know one-two punch you have the failure of banks in the 1890s followed by the failures in the 1920s and just when Montana catches its breath you have the Great Depression which wipes out more banks remember the Montana National Bank finally dies in 1936 takes them a while and what happens is all those old debts that they've been carrying on their books some from 1893 finally catch up with them where does Montana turn it turns to the only thing that's left its landscape and so begins Montana's tourist industry which is not capital intensive thank you [Applause] and follow-up just a few minutes for questions that for the people on in the lobby and who are watching online I'm gonna repeat your question