Convert traffic into leads for mortgage

How to create outlook signature

all right everybody this is Jimmy King over at banking Bridge we're going to get started with our webinar here in about one minute let some folks join and um we'll get started here shortly [Music] all right trip we're GNA go ahead and get started you I'm sharing my screen you can see the screen correct yep great so uh got a great March webinar a trip ginden from relu trip is a longtime mortgage industry veteran even though he he doesn't even have one gray hair on his head I don't know how he did that so he's uh he's definitely got a wealth of knowledge wanted to bring him in talk specifically kind of diving into lead lead buying uh what's worked for him through his career he spent a lot of time at Windham Capital before they were uh had their acquisition to Sofi he's now with relu is a CRM in the specifically built for mortgage seen a lot of growth there and thought he would be a great uh contact for everybody to to to better un know who he is and some of the things he's worked on so uh tell us trip a little bit about your background uh how you got into the industry uh with your with your different stops there sure um thank you Jimmy first and foremost I just wanted to thank you for inviting me really looking forward to it um I think the world of of you personally and banking Bridge I've used banking bridge in the past and it was extremely valuable from a number of perspectives for us um and I'll talk through some of those um aspects today as I kind of go through what worked and what didn't work for for me in my past life um running marketing technology and strategy for a direct to Consumer mortgage lender but um I wanted to thank everyone else that um is participating in the webinar as well I hope you guys get a lot of value out of what Jimmy and I are going to be talking through today so a little bit of background on myself I've been in the direct to Consumer mortgage world for almost 20 years now um I started my career in the early 2000s at Lending Tree it was one of my first four after college and got a really quick crash into all things direct to Consumer lending with a lot of the pioneer lenders that were buying leads on the The Lending Tree Network I supported the quick and Loans account for a little while I was actually their first account manager that was a big deal at the time like obviously Now Rocket but learned a ton about what lenders were doing with acquiring leads what strategies work Distributing leads to loan officers communicating with leads pricing strategies um again I worked with 50 60 lenders throughout my my tenure there and just learned a ton about all things direct to Consumer lending that was a really nice pathway into where I've spent the bulk of my career which was working directly for a large direct to Consumer mortgage lender out of Charlotte North Carolina Windham Capital mortgage um they just acquired they just acquired by Sofi spent a little over 13 years there um started in marketing kind of stood up their business intelligence program moved over into strategy and then was running all of Technology across the gamut um towards the end of my tenure there um purchased over a million leads um at one point or another during the 13 years that I was there um hope we converted at least 10,000 loans on this one million leads or I wasn't doing a very good job of the acquisition strategy um but uh yep ran all of our count contact center technology sat hand inand with loan officers for eight or nine of those years figured out what work what didn't work got a really really good um purview into all things direct to Consumer mortgage lending and mortgage lending in general um I've been at realu now for about a year and a half we're a fully unified CRM um focus specifically um so I've been able to apply that boots on the ground experience at a mortgage company and at lining tree and just the last 20 years that I've been in this world to developing a CRM that um is going to work for Lawn officers and um GNA have the features and the functions that they they really need um so looking forward to telling you more about relu looking forward to telling you more about what we're doing at realu and where we're going um in conjunction with what I've learned the the tenure that I've had in this business great thanks for sharing trip and if there's any questions as we go through the webinar you'll see there's chat there you can feel free to chat those and we'll stop every few minutes maybe every 10 minutes and and look through the webinar so we're going to try to con do cover 30 30 35 minutes here on the webinar give you guys some a nice outline of kind of high level what we feel like really on trip side and what a little bit of what I've learned uh of what strategies if you're going to buy leads what seems to be uh what you need to have in place to be successful uh for that and I can attest to to trip and the early days of banking bridge I called on trip and you could hear in the background when you called trip all the guys making calls all the people making calls so he sat there on the floor close to the team um that we're talking directly to those to those customers so diving into wiam Capital which is uh was super high volume lots of money spent on acquiring leads on technology so tell us a little bit about when you when you think about when you're planning a media strategy uh just out of the the very first couple things that you that you want to understand if you're thinking about spending money so yeah you're you're ultimately developing a a Prof fora right so um what do you want your volume targets to be and how do you get to that volume right and that's going to boil down to how many laan officers you have obviously how many leads per day you need to feed those laan officers and what that means for you Leeds and then your your biggest factor is going to be your projected conversion rates if you haven't bought historic leads you can project project those out but if you've been buying leads for a period of time you're going to have those conversion rats and you're going to know what type of leads convert levels are they purchase leads are they refi leads which states are they in what your LTV buckets what your loan amount buckets and you should be able to uh manage your filters that you're depl with your lead providers in a way to come pretty darn close to what you want your conion targets to be and ultimately get pretty darn close to your volume targets well that also coincides with how many leads you need to feed your loan officers keep them in their seats so that they're closing the volume that they need to close to be successful in um all those things that you're looking at work hand inand so you want to plan for that strategy make sure that you're you're getting your Media budget and your filters in place with your lead providers um at at the outset of each month and you're monitoring the volume as it's as it's projected each and every day of the month and you're making changes as you need to to drive the volume that um that you want um from a key performance indicator perspective you're tracking a large number of full funnel conversions right and it starts at the top of the funnel what's my lead to contact rate and then from there what's my lead to credit P application rate right and then from there what's my lead to pre-approved customer purchase or my lead to lock rate if it's a refa and then what's my lead to approval rate and then what's my lead to funding rate so there's you're wanting to track your conversions on any number of leads that you're buying as the month is progress and if you start to see your contact and your credit poll rate come down within individual provider drastically then you know that you need to potentially make a change and shift volume to a different Source or a different area based upon your filter set so full funnel conversion tracking to make sure that you're hitting volume targets is super important for making sure that you you hit your monthly goals um the second big thing on top of conversions you want to track is your cost right so um the more expensive the lead the higher the conversion rate needs to be for your your cost per unit to justify the the spend right so if if you're buying a large number of leads from a lowcost provider right you don't have to have a really high conversion rate to get to a good cost per funded unit but that does oh let's see here do I lose your trip trip up we lost you oh no there we go you got me I'm sorry know what happened all right that's all right let me let me share this again here hold on uh sure we got got you here yeah so you were we we we were on uh key performance indicators you were doing cost per contact credit pull lock and funding that's right so like uh I think again I was saying the more expensive the lead the higher your conversion rate needs to be to ensure that you're you're meeting your your cost targets right and your cost per credit pull is obviously going to project your cost per lock and then your cost per lock is going to project your cost per fund right so you want to make sure that you know what your targets are for each of those metrics on a bu provider basis and that you're tracking to those targets um as you're you're managing your spend um so conversion rates is the biggest factor and and your your cost per lead in terms of what your cost and unit economics are ultimately going to be and I would add to this like what we see with the market changing in the last year and where we are today is cost per contact to me is a a very good measurement in this in this market because someone might be ideal but they can't find a house that's different than it was a year ago or two years ago or three years ago so if you can measure these are great measure the contact credit pull lock and funding those are really just if you can just measure those four that's going to open up a lot of eyes with where you're spending your money so for me cost to contact and I think that's a how many how many dollars do I have to spend to actually have a conversation with somebody is that what that is exactly yeah and there's a whole bunch of uh ancillary metrics that surround these things right if you're doing a lot of outbound marketing automation right what your engagement rate look like what your open rate look like in your email your response rate what your response rate look like on your SMS messages right but at the end of the day you know your your cost for your funnel conversions um are are some of the biggest thing you need to keep an eye on and you need to be comparing those to leads that I purchased versus like Direct Mail leads you might be buying versus um you know um digital marketing leads organic lead that you're generating so you're you should be looking at those main measures across all of your kind of your main media Outlets if that makes sense yeah so technology from all you know there's the three or four main systems that you felt like you had to kind of have in place from when you're starting to spend a little bit of money let's talk a little about that so um your your LMS CRM is critical right you you got to make sure that your Lawn officers have the tools and the visibility and the insights that that they need to Prospect and originate right um and the goal for me was get them spending as much time in the CRM and the LMS as possible in conjunction with the contact center technology right your your POS is pretty critical as well especially in the digital world you want to make sure that as many of your customers that can leverage your digital application are leveraging that digital applica application as possible right you obviously need an loss you got to do findings and and credit and deliver the lock loan and process an underwrite and all that good stuff and then you obviously need your pricing engine right there's a whole bunch of technology that surrounds those those main areas that uh you can choose to deploy or or not deploy based upon uh what your strategy but but those are your big areas that you're you're always wanting to optimize and integrate that's the key like those those four big systems have got to be very closely integrated so that you can get to that goal of the the loan officer spending as much prospecting and originating as possible right you you don't want them doing a bunch of like losos cleanup work and like and and managing their pipeline for a good chunk of the day they should be talking to new and existing customers to origin blocks as much as they possibly can so if you and just to be Del out if you have an Lo that says man I just I don't I don't use crms or it's not my thing how early do you have a conversation with a with an Lo about the importance of the CRM well I think you get like how are you prospecting like how are you identifying new clients how are you nurturing your past clients how are you nurturing people that are looking for home what's your what's your plan then if you don't want to use a CRM right and you want to have that conversation early and that's typically a conversation that you're having during the recruitment process yeah yeah well let's talk outbound strategy so outbound versus inbound um you it seems like wendam did a lot of outbound to but that strategy was to actually develop inbound over time is that right yep we um that's correct so you're you're buying a large chunk of leads every month right and you you might contact 55 60% of those leads right so your your goal is to leverage those leads as much as you possibly can to drive initial connection on on outbound calls from your loan officers and then continuously Market to those to those leads in the form of marketing automations to drive inbound responses to your loan officers and you can also do a bunch of additional marketing around that you can do Facebook audience lookalikes using uh leads that you've converted successfully um and start to drive more organic inbound as a result of that you can do keyword search to drive inbound you can do direct mail to drive inbound but your your technology has got to support both right you have to make sure that you're prioritizing organizing your opportunities for your loan officers in a way that they can make really efficient effective outbound dials and they're they're getting the most out of that time while in conjunction responding to inbound inquiries as quickly as possible as well and inbound always trumps outbound in terms of like what Al loone officer should be looking at on a daily basis but your goal is to drive connections and then your your your secondary goal is obviously to drive conversions on those connection yeah so inbound is more valuable than outbound a lead inbound email that you get from a from a prospect or a lead obviously is more valuable than you making an email to them um and then to set like what is outbound outbound is you have a team in your office or in your somewhere that is making outbound calls they're a call center based model inbound is like trip said it's the best one is Direct Mail you're mailing stuff in the hopes that they either submit through some sort of landing page or make a phone call into you um which would be more inbound just to to to define those two so lead sources in building out the funnel um there's you the great thing about trip is he you name it they probably has have used that lead Source uh over time or something very similar to it so talk about you know what you guys managed from a lanoff perspective all the sources that you that you used so I was typically feeding a a number of of loan officers um during my time there was anywhere from 150 I think we had up to 650 or something at one point um but um when you're supporting a large number of loan officers you have to have a lot of different sources because you have to ensure that you're you're able to acquire the leads more importantly in the segments that your company is going to be best suited to perform and that typically means like what what what's your Niche what's your sweet spot is it Con aaper conforming conventional refi is it first-time home by or purchase people is it U people that haven't had a real estate agent and you're going to use an internal real estate matching firm that you want to work with is it are you a portfolio right are you a fhaa govy lender are you doing more low credit type stuff are you non-qm right so um it's more it was way more important to me that I was able to buy leads in the filters that I needed where the the prowess of our product some programs were so and because I was buying for a lot of loan officers I had to have a lot of lead providers because I wanted to optimize more at the LTV the loan amount the state the the purchase versus refi level more so than the the the lead provider level so you you got to have a lot of sources to get the leads in The Sweet Spot that your company's going to be most likely to perform um if I had a lot fewer loan officers that that's easier and I would focus just on a lot higher quality sources and and a lower volume of leads but it's it's it's a balancing act um but at the end of the day you want to make sure you're feeding the right number of leads per loan officer per day and the segments that they're going to be most likely to perform perform and that typically closely coincides with your how your company structured in your product and program makes uh what did for per like what did you try to match number of leads per L was it like eight 10 a day was it two three a day what did you feel like an alone officer could manage well um that depends on a lot of things actually we uh we we had a predictive dialer in my old company so we were able to buy more because they weren't having to physically outbound dial the leads they were more just like being fed connections on outbound dials that were happening behind the scenes and there was multi-line dialing and um a whole bunch of strategy that that went into driving those connections into them but I I so the goal for me more was like new connections per loan officer per day versus like number of leads per loan officer per day and like how do I back into the number of new connections got it right and it that fluctuated with the market because when the really difficult you typically have to drive more connections on a per day basis for them to get to a goal of three to four locks a week um the good people the goal is like a lock a day or or even at one and half two locks a day when times were amazing we had L officers that were doing four and five locks a day right but um at the at the end of the day you need to understand like what your connection Target is per day your new customer connection Target and then what your connection to lock rate is and then kind of back into the number of leads that it takes to get to your connection Target and then your lock Target and that's all again getting back to the first slide of always monitoring conversions so you talked about you know why did why did wiom have such success because you mentioned being able to match your Niche your best product and your programs to those to those filter sets and how important that is obviously if you're not competitive in a specific filter specific product then you don't want to buy leads um based on that and you do you do you find that most lead providers should be able to match like whatever you're looking for most of them or are there how did you how did you feel about that with matching what you guys were good with with the lead provider so each lead provider is different right and um they're gonna drive different amounts of volume based upon their brand recognition and when and how they're marketing and they're going to drive different qualities of volume based upon their brand recognition and when and how they're marketing Lending Tree was always a a phenomenal lead source for for me personally in the past because they had 90 plus percent brand recognition online so they drove a ton of volume and they drove it in the filters that I needed and it was typically really high quality volume um the rate table provider providers perform really well for me in the past as well and that's just because of how that model works and I know we're going to talk about that in a in a minute or two um but it really depends on the lead provider and if they're a smaller lead provider they're running a lot of stuff through affiliates um typically they can drive some the volume that they need but the volume's not as good because it's affiliate volume um so again it's that's why it's so important to measure conversion on the volume that you're able to get in the segments that you want by provider and why I always had a lot of providers active so that I could be really Nimble with uh moving and and and changing my my spend as as the month progress we tell their marketing as the month progresses sometimes they'll have more Affiliates than others right sometimes they're doing more organic search than others and organic search performs a lot better than affiliate volume so you just need to Under first thing you want to do is vet your lead providers understand when and how they're marketing right what type of leads are acquiring what their strategy is what their volume targets are and only work with um you have to work with licensed lead providers obviously that's a big one not licensed then they're probably um not worth much so you you you really got to vet your lead providers and then from there you got to make sure you know how they're marketing and then you got monitor it to make sure that you're shifting as they're doing different kinds of marketing to drive volume as the the month months and weeks progress so having what what's a lender needs to have this the few things there's lots but the three or four things here is reporting is important if you're going to get into the ad buying game from from what trip is saying is the number one thing he had his you told me off before this was you woke up every day you check the report that was like that was the first thing you did is that right yeah I I had dozens analytics are everything yeah like every decision should be made based upon the analytics you can't wing it you can't feel your like you've got to data you got to trust the data and then you have to share the data with your lead providers because that's that can help you negotiate lead cost and uh the quality types that you're getting and your filter nego like so analytics are everything if you don't have a good qual reporting strategy in place you're probably not going to have a good media bu strategy yeah that's a great point it's sharing the data with the lead provider you think well why don't want want to do that it's because you can negotiate and that's interesting well that that you keep them accountable and um they also know that you're you're you're watching everything right so um yeah so it's it's accountability and it's also negotiation and it's also it strengthen it strengthens the partnership because yeah relationships are based on trust parency and a lead provider the media buyer shouldn't be any different yeah yeah right Tech hit on that start with lead management which is your LMS your really your lead management your CRM those are kind of non-negotiables need to have those in place and then we we hear a lot about you with Le with lurn and especially in a tough Market is you don't want to hire new L it's tough to to train people and bring people on so if you can keep uh your Lo turn Low by buying quality leads then you're going to have high morale people are going to stick around longer the system's going to work better uh did you guys see that as well and you obviously were focused on quality to to keep that the Lo churn low as possible is that right yes 100% um you're look you you may be able to get a much better like cost per lock or cost per funded loan on a on a lowquality lead Source if you buy a lot of volume but you're long connecting with people that applied for insurance or didn't apply at all or wrong phone numbers and there's only so much they can do that on a per day basis right so you you you really gota to buy them a good percentage of really high quality High converting leads even though they're more expensive because you don't want churn right you gota you got to drive the the right number of high quality connections that they need on a daily basis you can't do that if you're only buying large volumes of cheap leads yeah and and in that case it's you also have to think about opportunity costs because your cost per lock might be a little bit higher with higher quality more expensive lead sources but you're spending a lot more money on Your Lawn officers to make those make those calls and your your your profit might ultimately be lower so you're you're having a man your total profit with your unit economics right and um that the higher converting the lead the more volume you're going to close and as long as it's profitable on a per unit basis you're going to drive more profit yeah rate tables I've a fan of rate tables for several reasons but what what is your take on some of the pros and cons that you felt was a benefit to being on rate tables oh no trip trip should be hopping on I'm gonna I'm gonna run through these questions while he hops back on here so uh are we recording it yes trip I want to hop through these questions here um what do your ideal conversion rates look like so David asked that question trip if you um whenever you hop back on we'll go through that and then can we get your best leads con War Story So Neil has a has probably an inside joke for uh for Neil I would from a conversion standpoint from the banking Bridge side and trip you can hit on this but what was like an ideal conversion rate it was a lot of different lead providers that you had but was there kind of like one that you were looking for maybe like a bank rate lead or a Lending Tree lead that you felt like there was a conversion rate that that you were measuring against I'm not trying to skirt the answer but it really depended on the source and what you're paying for the leads for the source so like if you're paying a lot more on a like if you're paying a 100 bucks plus per lead your conversion rate better be at least six s% right um if you're paying 10 bucks for a lead it can be 1% or even less right so it really depends on how much you're paying for the lead and what you want your your unit econom targets to be um and at the same time what your you need to sustain to ensure that you're hitting your overall lock volume yeah right because you need to look at your Blended I think I think trips running out of bandwidth um he'll hop back on here so strategy and conversion so if you and and when trip comes in we'll we'll hit this one as well so you have um you know your your lead management which is what you your loos's are kind of living in your lead management system your CRM uh every day so you have uh your outbound and inbound uh lead management which is predictive dialer it gives your it tees up uh those leads for your loos's uh your allocation optimization I'll let trip kind of hit on that uh and then you have again measuring a lot of those analytics that you need to uh to make sure that you're generating the ROI and then obviously prioritizing and nurturing those leads is uh a key because we see it all the time we look at website visits it's usually that third or fourth website visit that is going to convert that person the value of having for us the value of having rates in your website it's because it gives people reason to come back it increases the chances of them revisiting which increases your chances of converting with uh nurturing you know you may not hit them on the first phone call you may not hit him a second phone call it might be a text message it might be an email a week from now so making sure you have those those nurture cans nurture campaigns set up in there and then under SMS a lot of our customers were have used or are pushing into SMS it seems like it gets a much higher engagement uh than than email so definitely spend the money to get a good SMS system in place verse IO is a good one uh to check out they do a lot of compliance in SMS so they can get you squared away there and then uh you've got I like the activity feed so if you're in your CRM and you're thinking what do your loos's need to be looking at every day it's that activity feed which usually gives you open rates gives you clicks gives you scheduling clicks so that you can see which leads are your most engaged uh leads in your in your CRM activity feed and then you have the Lo branding um trip are you yeah give me a little bit about the how you guys handled Lo branding so Lo branding for us was super important because when you're branding for your loan officers you're ultimately branding for the Enterprise simultaneously and we found that customers are much more likely to engage with an email from a human being or SMS from a human being than they were from some general Enterprise company right and the loan officer has actually appreciated it and you you have a better retention rate when you're automating branding on their behalf and helping them build their portfolio in conjunction with your comp's portfolio so we we did find a lot of value in your tools in this regard Jimmy because every had a banking Bridge rate forward website they had a banking Bridge um calculator page um they had a bunch of tools that they could send out to to to allow for customers to monitor their rates um so the more you canly brand for themselves having to do much the better off you're going to be as far as retention and engagement from your customer base as well yeah well pushing into the conversation I think that's what most people are interested in is how did you manage comp if you're it feels like in today's market it's it's pushing towards this direct consumer model if you even call that but it's like a blend between retail and D Toc uh how did y'all talk about the compensation structure so um we typically looked at at if like by how the lead was driven into the the loan officer right lead would typically pay less a a lead purchase from a non-rate table Source would typically pay a little bit more and then a referral would ultimately pay right and the ultimate um goal or story for the laan officers would be build your career on your leads right and just because you're making a a third of the basis points or a fourth of the basis points in a rate table lead um doesn't mean that that can't be a future customer customer or an ability to drive referrals for other they know right so like every lead is an opportunity regardless of how you're getting paid and if they close that rate table lead then down the road if rates improve and they refi that's a referral right and we were doing a lot of automation on their behalf in that regard as well but the E typically the the way that we looked at it is the easier it was for them to to fund that loan the lower they got paid um um so all and the the ultimate goal for the more experienced loss was to to wean them off of leads over time because they have this massive book of thousands of customers that they have acquired over years of working leads and we're doing so much remarketing to those people on their behalf that they're just Fielding inbound inquiries um throughout the day right and then they're getting paid uh on portfolio retention which is referral based compensation and um there's there's a good pathway that they can see as a younger loan officer if I just continue to put my work in over years I can get all this high volume higher higher basis Point compensation loans all right but it was typically the the harder it was for them to to convert the type of lead that it is um or whether or not they generated that lead on their own is um what dictated their comp great if there's any comp questions feel free to throw those in chat and trip you can check chat to see if we have anything anything in there and then we talked about a lot of things that do work so what are some of the things that you that the basics here that that don't work if you're going to go buy at if you're gonna spend money on buying leads you know here's kind of what you what you don't want to do um talk a little about these e trip one thing that hasn't been working is my connection to this webinar I don't I apologize everyone for that but uh I keep getting this message from whatever app app this is Jimmy um that's kicking me this is the only thing I have open so I don't know what's going um but uh anyway I I if how many hours do we have there's a lot I know that doesn't work after 13 years of of working directly for a mortgage company in technology but uh obviously a follow-up is everything right um if you have a poor follow-up strategy because you don't have the to facilitate that follow-up strategy in terms of how you're organizing and presenting opportunities to your loan officers you're going to be in a pretty tough spot because you're going to spend a lot of money on leads at don't because you're losing those opportunities to lenders that have a great follow-up strategy and great technology that that's uh dovetail into the next point which is don't cut corners on your Tech right especially if you're going to be in the dtoc world you got to invest in the tech to make sure that you're converting your leads at the highest level possible and if you don't have the tech behind it it's going to be really difficult to compete with the lenders that do um give lead providers some time make the switch I typically give it at least a week or two after I make a change to see how that change worked out or 100 to 200 leads to see how that change worked out don't throw the baby out with the bath water right get give things time to bake a little bit before you decide that it's a failure um and then we already touched on this a little bit earlier just getting a lot of leads doesn't mean that you're going to close a lot of loans um the typically the more volume you can get from an individual lead provider if they don't have a brand like the finger in the air test would say that they're doing something Shady to drive those leads which means they're going to be low quality MH and that's typically not that's typically not going to change if the if the first hundred are bad quality it's not like the next hundred or all of a sudden gonna be great that's usually an indicator of what's to come right that's right okay so you're saying a 100 leads uh is for for So for anybody that's thinking I want to get in this game you know you can get if you're paying 60 70 $80 a lead on average up or down um you know you're spending eight 10 grand you really need to have that ready to spend to learn if this source is worth it or not if you're only going to spend two grand it's really not worth spending that money you need to be willing to to stick with it for however long it takes to get to about a 100 leads so think about that from a u from a dollars perspective so talk you know your top L's you guys had a number of top L's there working huge volume very efficient what did you see that that they did they did well uh well I'm probably preaching to the choir and lot of these um because a lot of these seem to be self-explanatory but seeing them in action is a different story right um but the Lawn officers that typically plan their work and work their plan um did a really good job they they knew what their hot list was they worked the the the system the way that the system to be worked and they weren't trying cut corners or figure out a way to beat the system if that makes sense they just embraced it and um work through the leads and the priority that we gave did what they needed to do as far as the follow-up strategy um make sure that they responded to every inbound inquiry as quickly as possible so again it's just daily consistency self-discipline and and putting the hours in right there there's no skirting you know doing the work um and they were self- disiplined to do the work um the second big thing that they all did really well was the ones that did the best job of listening to the customer needs empathizing with them and tailoring the loan options and presenting them ingly kind of your spend based selling approach conversion rates on their credit polls um because the customer knew that they were putting together the option that was meeting the very clear needs that they identified and goals for their particular law so listen empathize and present your your options ingly um through transparency was super important as well a lot of the loan officers um that just gave honest answers and were presenting rates really clearly and transparently and talked about rat as it pertains to goals again and were just honest and transparent with their communication had a much better time of building recort Rapport and ultimately converting connected conversations into locks um every connection matters what that means is even if that customer might not be able to benefit from a scenario today a lot of the good loan officers I've worked with in the past would ask them like okay like I I know we've talked about we can't necessarily help you in this situation do you know anyone that we could help anyone from your church your work you know anyone looking to buy a home like every connection mattered and they weren't wasting any connection as an opportunity to potentially reconnect with that person later or connect with someone else that they might know right so every leads an opportunity whether to be converted at that particular time or not and um and last but obviously not least is embrace the technology use it don't fight it uh make sure that you're working the way the Enterprises put it together for you and um and embrace the tools and the long officers that I've worked with and I've worked with hundreds over the years that have done these obviously been the most successful yeah yeah well going into technology you you you moved from from wendam over into relu and you guys are have built an experience from a CRM standpoint that kind of gives you all the things that you were dreaming of from from a a from a loan officer perspective or a management perspective what kind of what makes Ru different than some of the other crms that are out there well I think the uh the first bullet point um is the most crucial one right in that uh I had like five different systems that I was managing the the components that ra coues got out of the box and embedded I had velocify for lead management I had Zoom phone and I was using a separate marketing automation system which was marketing cloud or active campaign I had a the Law Officers were were doing all kinds of different things using Excel in a lot of cases to to deliver initial rate quotes um we were using uipath for some workflow automation processes we were using Compass for loan pipeline management so it's having One Singular story of customer communication on officer Behavior was virtually impossible in in an environment that's that disperate right so unless you have it all in a singular cohesive ecosystem which is what ralu provides it's really difficult to optimize on your loan officer behaviors on your consumer communication on your inbound and outbound strategy and all of that stuff is crucial to drive those those key points we talked about earlier which is lead conversions in Roi on spend so if you're trying to piece that story together across five six different systems it's really difficult to to get the highest return on your marketing investment as you possibly can yeah right and and that that is the biggest thing that makes relu unique is that all of that stuff comes embedded into the system and can all be managed um and communicating with itself in place very good so wrapping it up um from a consumer preference when you're thinking about what does the consumer want today when they're hearing from a mortgage company we found give them leads expect first thing is leads expect you to follow I me they're going through a questionnaire they're going through a form they're famili information they're expecting to hear from somebody U maybe not as many people but somebody they so so provide them something of value provide them something that's unique could be your rates could be rate alerts uh we feel like reviews matter building that trust trip talked about trust a lot building that trust early and quickly is key that gives them the confidence to move forward with you so that means getting your re your reviews in front of them on your website and some sort of text mess campaign email campaign whatever uh and then video it's it's really changed how we do things over here banking Bridge introducing your brand via video introducing your loos's via video introducing proposals via video there's there's lots of Bom Bomb vidard Loom lots of great tools now for selling uh video for video sales so use those anything you would add to that trip no I think you I think you na it um Jimmy I mean it's all about trans transparency and Trust right and the the the more more tools you can give your custom provide that for your officers the more successful you're going to be and the better those relationships are going to be solidified I agree so if people are interested they want to talk to trip they have questions about leads they have questions about what can the CRM do or we did have a couple of questions that came through Jimmy two minutes left I think so I don't know if you want to take those or not or if you want to wrap up yeah let's do it go ahead so it looks like we got a question from Ed Powell I'm surprised you didn't didn't ask me what I was going to what I would do with a million doll he he wanted to ask if uh I notice a change in lead quality throughout the days of the week not typically not per day during the week but you definitely notice it week to week and what I would typically do is run my numbers every week and then look at the trending as they change from week to week so I I trending analysis is really important so like what's this week look like versus last week and the week before and the week prior and you have to look at different maturations like per metric right so your credit pull rate takes less time to mature than your lock rate your contact rate takes less time to mature than your credit pull rate right so you you're looking at trending by provider on a per week basis to figure out how you might need to shift your spend based upon your week- to week trending that that's the way I would typically do it and you would see theity changing on a per week basis but not typically a per day basis I think that's too much day um it looks like we got a question from Justin on can you give me your definition of quality lead I'm going to keep this really simple um a quality lead is a high converting lead how many leads do you have to buy to how many locks you have to get it's as simple as that and usually a lead provider doesn't change the quality right it's consistent whatever you get for the first 100 is probably predictable for the next 500 does that sound right well it it sometimes um it like your your larger like higher brand recognition lead providers typically are a lot more consistent with their volume and their conversion rates but um some of your smaller lead providers that are out there sometimes will drive a ton of volume and again that typically means that they're driving a lot of affiliate traffic and conversion rates will come down right so it's your your non providers especially ones that are driving leads through Affiliates um are typically the ones that um would will fluctuate in volume and conversions the most right he's saying I'm asking with regard to the overload of poor leads or poor leads [Music] one it's typically the ones that are not interested to answer your question so he asked if poor leads were the ones that aren't qualified or the ones that are not interested I'd much rather have a person that was interested in a mortgage that didn't qualify because that means that that LE provider was marketing with the right intent and that person clicked on that ad or keyed in a search term that was specific to them getting a mortgage or that affiliate that did that was was Marketing in a way that you know that that customer was inquiring about a mortgage a lot of lead providers will buy affiliate volume from insurance providers and Auto Loan providers and personal loan providers and and payday loans and it's crazy um where they where they'll get leads to try and turn profit and resell sell those leads as mortgage leads so interest was far more important to me than qualification i' take a non-qualified lead over a not interested lead all day yeah great um if interested reach out to trip at at relu and we'll wrap up this webinar thanks for everybody for participating you'll get a recording via email and then we're looking forward to our next webinar in April trip thanks again for joining thanks for having me Jimmy thanks everyone for joining sorry for the connectivity issues