Meddic certification for Government

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hello and welcome to the Wisconsin Lieutenant Governor's Small Business Academy this hour's session is government and corporate certifications how they can help your business gain a competitive advantage this is a quick reminder we will have Q&A at the end of the session all attendees are free to enter questions into the platform at any time at this time I'll turn over the session to Ana vilson with Wisconsin procurement Institute to lead our discussion thank you Michael um welcome everybody um I hope you've had a good week um started the week off on Tuesday with our in-person um 11 locations this week and Michael I think this is the second to last session um virtually that we're going to be doing this week I think we have a lunch and learn um following this um so welcome everybody so let's get started um I'm going to ask each of you for just a quick 20 second introduction your name your organization um what you do in your organization they we'll get into the more more discussive type things Alex let's start with you I have you on mute how's that there you go there you go all right all right good morning good people uh my name is alexo and I am the director for Supply diversity for the state of Wisconsin and I'm glad you been doing that about a year now I've been yes almost a year almost a year and you're still smiling okay Amy would you introduce yourself hi I'm Amy hacker I own White Buffalo Trucking um we started probably about 13 years ago um and where are you located out of Onida Wisconsin um just outside of Green Bay welcome Jason glad you could join us thanks uh hello everyone uh Jason Ray pronouns are he him his I'm the president and CEO for the Wisconsin LGBT Chamber of Commerce I'm based in Milwaukee but we've got staff uh spread across the state welcome Rosie would you introduce yourself good afternoon everyone my name is Rosie arabat I a senior business analyst with the city of Milwaukee's office of equity inclusion welcome Roslin I think everyone almost knows you but introduce yourself none the same hello everybody can you hear me my name is Roslin robertonson I am uh I work for the Wisconsin Department of Transportation I oversee the DB Support Services um and I'm going on 16 years on May 12th that's like a half a Life Time Shane hi I'm Shane M happy I'm the lead business opportunity specialist with the US small business administration here uh in Wisconsin uh we're out of Milwaukee but I cover the whole state and you had a big event um on Wednesday you had the administrator from the SBA joining us here in Milwaukee yes ma'am sh a couple couple minutes on on what that was about and how that went actually I was in the background of of all that so I wasn't even involved with the with all the hubbubs so oh I'm gonna I really I really can't I was I saw on social media that she did go and visit a couple of our businesses which was um de deante was one of them and what was the other was a construction firm that I that I don't know that I can't I think it was RL construction so we had we've had a great week with um all sorts of events um pertaining to small business my name is AA vamson I'm the executive director of the Wisconsin procurement Institute and have been doing that for I think it's 27 years now um who would have thought right um our focus and our purpose is to assist businesses in getting into the government markets and one of those steps is certification um so we've had the pleasure of working with all of you over time on on the government side and also this time Jason we're we we've added you to look at more of the corporate opportunities too that the government does not recognize at this time so look forward to hearing more more from you on the LBGTQ certification that that is now available to businesses um so I'd like each of you to take a few minutes to talk about um what it takes for a business to qualify what your certifications are what's important what's not important um Alex we'll start with you wow I'm honored thank you uh so with us we we certify uh women business enterprises we also certify minority business enterprises and also uh service disabled veteran business uh Enterprises uh to qualif some of the requirements with us are you have to be 51% owned or operated by the controll demographic or the the demographic that you're looking to get certified with you have to have a useful business function uh that one always strikes me as like what uh but anyways uh so you have to be a uh one year of taxes we require for your MBE uh the women uh certification three years of taxes for that one and three years of taxes for the service disabled veteran we do have uh a a fee for the women business Enterprise certification and the service disabled veteran business certification uh the one that is free which is our most popular one is the minority business Enterprise and that one uh as long as you are from if you're Native American black Hispanic Asian Indian Asian Pacific Alo ESO or native Hawaiian you qualify under that Minority uh uh demographic um some of the benefits you know we have what I'd like to say one of the larger uh directories for the state of Wisconsin uh so you get your uh when you become uh a part of when you get certified with us you get entered into that database and here's an interesting fact about our database there are 31 different states that that that make up that database so so there's that um and also um the certification goes for three years uh if you are an outof State business we will gladly certify you in the minority business Enterprise if you qualify or if you have the require ments and also with the women business Enterprise we will certify the only one where we are keeping it to our own is the uh service disabled veteran certification and that and that you have to be here you have to be from Wisconsin and headquartered in Wisconsin uh I mentioned that there are 31 states that make up our our directory uh we have 741 MBE currently certified we also have 715 women business enterprises and we have 55 service disabled veteran certifications uh the I I'm going to give you the top 10 states that have a pres obviously Wisconsin has a big presence in the directory the state of Illinois California Minnesota Missouri New York Ohio Texas Michigan and Florida um as far as you know another thing that I'd like to add as far as there's this myth that the state only does business with large corporations large businesses that's not true we we work with all sorts of all from all Industries all sizes uh some of our top industries are construction obviously it Professional Services manufacturing health care that's a big one there's a there's a in in in on this side of Co we you know uh we're we're talking more and more about mental health we're seeing a an increase a trend in personal health uh mental health and just holistic health care as a whole uh and so those are just some of the some of the different uh industries that make up our our our directory uh and what else that I want to share yeah that's it what are there any goals Alex um stated goals for these categories oh my goodness yes I'm so sorry that's the only reason that's what I'm here for is to bother you know poke a bit that's right so we the state has a very nice goal of spending 5% of its overall spend on minority businesses and 1% of its overall spend on service disabled veterans and so if you are in the MBE or the DV dvb there is that permissive uh 5% uh goal uh and so there's that bid preference and uh it it doesn't guarantee you uh the the the the contract but it puts you in the running for it if you meet all and here's the thing you know the the sun and the moon and the stars everything has to be aligned just perfectly in order for you to land that but here's the thing those folks that do get it it's a beautiful thing because it keeps coming it keeps you know it's one of those it keeps giving because it keeps met the requirements for this job and you know you did it good you know good gas travels and I'm should say not good gas good word the good word travels and so it opens up the door to other opportunities so back to your question yes there is the goal of 5% uh and I'm happy to report that for FY 23 we hit six the state hit 6.1% of its 5% goal so in total it was about 30 3.5 billion that it spent and 206 of that now don't don't write this down don't do don't pull out your calculator it's roughly 6.1% so 3.5 billion and 206 of that was spent on towards our goal you mean million or billion so 3.5 billion and 206 million got it and when is is that report posted on your website or it will be posted on your website i' I've AC it I I have forwarded on up to the governor's office and they just have to give it its blessing before we roll it out so you'll notify us right you absolutely on your website sounds good look forward to reading that thank you thank you thank you Alex Rosie what is what tell tell us about the city of Milwaukee sure so thank you for inviting me um the city of Milwaukee small business Enterprise program is comprised of 197 small businesses currently uh we are a race and gender neutral program and the way we determine eligibility is based on what we call disadvantaged business criteria and um the set of criteria is something all of our businesses need to meet to um qualify for certification um first and foremost you have to be considered economically disadvantaged um this could be anything from having difficulties uh building business Capital um issues with financing being denied loans um you know bidding on government contracts and consistently being um denied or you know failing to secure those contracts um despite competitive pricing um so all of these factors are what we would consider economically disadvantaged um that's not an all-inclusive list um but just some examples we also require that uh the business is owned and operated by uh at least 51% um of individuals who meet um three of the four follow following disadvantage criteria so we have a social disadvantage employment disadvantage uh education and location um in the interest of time if you want a more fleshed out definition of each of those uh criteria it is available on our website at milwaukee.gov certifications um we do review everyone's uh disadvantage criteria answers on a case-by Case basis and there is an element of uh subjectivity um when determining if you uh actually qualify under those criteria um and similar to Alex's program we have a few basic requirements that everyone needs to meet you need to have uh at least one year of uh tax returns to give us you have to be in operations for a minimum of one year uh you have to be considered a small business based on the sba's industry size standards and you have to be actively involved in the day-to-day operation we don't allow um you know absentee owners to participate in this program so um why get certified um you know getting certified at the city of Milwaukee has quite a few benefits um you know once you're certified you'll be published on our SBE directory which is uh frequently accessed by Prime contractors government entities private businesses who are you know seeking a diverse um uh suppliers to do uh fulfill contracts and do jobs for them um and you know this directory is a really excellent way to open uh networking opportunities for your small business um and then uh another aspect of the program that is extremely beneficial to small business enterprises is um it's a great way to get your foot in the door with uh City of Milwaukee Contracting um we have SBE participation requirements um and the requirement is that 25% of construction and uh 25% of goods and services and 18% of professional service contracts be awarded to small business enterprises um and it extends Beyond just City of Milwaukee contracts um if there is a private developer who is receiving a million dollars or more in city financial assistance they are required to award 25% of construction contracts and 18% of professional service contracts to sbes um so uh there are there are a lot of different benefits to getting certified with us and um we're absolutely willing to work with you to um you know make sure that you are able to meet the eligibility requirements and you know walk through each uh each part of the process step by step to get you certified thank you Rosie could you repeat the website where someone could go to to get more details on this sure so it is milwaukee.gov certifications plural correct plural yes okay thank you much raslin tell us about wisat and the dbe okay well thank you for inviting me and I really do appreciate this opportunity to present on the dbe program and when we talk about um um becoming dbe certified first I would like to say that this is a federal program so there's a dbe um uh uh program in every state in the state of Wisconsin so uh in the I mean not in the state of Wisconsin but in the United States there is a DBU program so um it's really pretty much the same as what um what everyone else said what Alex said what roie said you have to be at least 51% own in control by socially and economically disadvantaged individuals so we look at Asian Indian Amic Americans asian-pacific Americans black Americans Hispanic Americans Native Americans and women and even any individual deemed social and economically disadvantage so you have to prove your disadvantage um what are some of the eligibility criterias they in they include uh we look at your average annual gross receipts for the business which must be less than 3.72 million this is effective May 9th so we got a new rule coming down from the dbe from the federal uh fhwa a new rule came down where they Chang it to 30.7 million um applicants must prove their 51% ownership of the business they must show operational and managerial control of their business and they must also prove their personal net worth is less than 2.47 million this is another change which goes into effect May 9th 2024 they must also show technical competence in the in their work area and the firm is independent of any other businesses so there's specific criteria that um our certification analyst looks at when you're trying to get DB certified so thank you Rin so the one big difference is that disadvantage under the the W the dbe program is that it's it includes women which is not necessarily true in in other government it includ it includes women white women black women all women so but you the main thing is you must show ownership control and ex and expertise in your particular business and one thing that answer listening to everybody speaking now too is note that each one of these certifications is unique to to The Entity that does the certification right so Alex's certification will not apply to Shan's rosin's will not apply to Rosie each each organiz each government um segment has its own um process criteria their own certification their own um requirements I mean there's some similarity where like you said own controlled and some of the other Basics yeah but as as as a small business as you're looking at this just because you get a dbe doesn't mean that Alex is going to care right right has to be unique to where what you're going after okay Shane tell us about the SBA well I got a whole lot um do yeah and I and I will make it fast we have uh a number of different certifications uh one is now self-certified only one of them is self-certified so we have 23% of all federal Prime Contracting dollars must go to small businesses and currently in the state there's 389 so all these programs I'm going to talk about uh Rosie had mentioned it the small business size standards so with all businesses being small they must be small uh in ance with the North American industry classification system or nakes code that they're in that can either be Revenue based or it can be employee based must be for-profit and most of their taxes go to the US so they don't have to be a de in the US but the most of their taxes need to go to the US um I'm not going to get really into the weeds of a lot of these um but we're going to touch base really quick so small business is a self-certification through Sam which is system for award management um sam.gov correct Sam Sam sam.gov you will not receive a certification or a letter saying that you're a small business but you are self-certifying that you are so um we'll move on from there uh we have 8A which is our uh business development program um there's 133% of prime Contracting dollars into that now now when I say that that's 133% two years ago it was at 5% and it's raised up to 13% for this fiscal year and by next fiscal year it'll be 15% we have 26 located in our portfolio in Wisconsin and then we have 54 overall that our office administers uh in the adaa program that is a certification program and it is for socially and economically disadvantaged individuals or social uh disadvantage you have to prove that social disadvantage it doesn't matter who you are um economic disadvantage I'm going to run through that really quick because you're going to hear it in women owned small business as well so for economic disadvantage your net worth must be less than $850,000 that's gone up a lot since I came in nine years ago here and it used to be 450 so that 850 we will take away the equity that you have in your primary residence will take away any business Equity you have and when I say business Equity it's not what you have into the business it's what's on your balance sheet so that's very important to know and then we'll also take away um let's see uh anything in your IRA or 411k will deduct that from your net worth so you get that adjusted net worth of 850,000 or less along with that as well you must have an average gross income over the last three years are less than 450,000 and then a total of all your assets at market value must be less than 6 million so most people I know dis economically disadvantaged so but it goes across the whole United States so all these certifications work throughout the whole United States so we take into effect people who live in Washington DC or out in California where home prices and everything else is much higher um so that's why you see that high that high level um it the 88 is a business development program it is for nine year nine years and nine years only and you receive Business Development um from myself through our Resource Partners such as WPI sbdc score Etc uh getting into women-owned small business it's a 5% goal and currently we have 92 women-owned small businesses that are certified by the SBA and for uh economically disadvantaged women on small business we have 15 that are certified in the state that's coming from the dynamic small business search this morning now it's the same requirements for economically disadvantage as well this is for women woman or women 51% own and control the business when I say control it's not just they have the 51% ownership they must manage the day-to-day functions the long-term decisions the short-term decisions have the biggest office H be able to hire and fire people right so Bice funny when people will say you know I'll always hear somebody say well my wife owns 51% now so we're a woman own small business can she fire you well no then she doesn't control the businesss okay right and uh I'm going to assume that I'm going to be able to stop in and make pop in Surprise visits like I do with hubzone um coming in the near future so if I walk in and the owner control person supposedly is not there or that office looks unlike Amy's and it's a little little closet instead of Amy's nice big office right probably not a small business probably not a woman own small business so the difference between woman own or for the woman owned small businesses programs and everybody else they must be in a certain nakes code right in order to get Prime contracts now that's the N code is located I can always answer people's questions later on it's also our website uh one thing I want to point out that if you want to do subcontracting um you can self-certify as a woman or an economically disadvantaged woman on small business self-certified to do subcontracting to do Prime Contracting you must be certified by the SBA moving on to the hub Zone it's a historically underutilized business Zone and those that's at a 3% goal for uh this is the whole federal government again and we're currently at 44 uh certified Hub Zone firms here in Wisconsin um that's dropped a little bit we try to increase it make it a little bit bigger what a hub zone is like I said a historically unutilized business Zone it's where the um we're looking at the what people bring in they're uh I'm a lot for Words Right Now personal yeah income income levels are lower or the um unemployment R of unemployment are lower so believe it or not I do know what I'm talking about I been smacked in the head you do so so you have that some of the requirements that we have on this the two big ones we have is that your principal office is located within one of these Hub zones and how you determine where a hub zone is is on the sba.gov you can find the hubzone map punch in your address where that address where that uh business is located it'll tell you definitively yes or no if it's in a hub Zone on top of that 35% of your employees must be located within a hub Zone not necessarily the same one so for instance AA owns a computer company that does coding right and in 35% of her employees she lives in a hub Zone that's where her business is located right and Amy lives up in Onida which is at a hub Zone and I live in a hub Zone and we're her employees so she has 100% employees live within a hub Zone we don't live anywhere near each other right so that could still qualify you and and how you figure that out is you also look in the hub zone map to find out our home addresses you can prove that with uh driver's license Etc okay um and that um all of these programs with the exception of the AA you can come in and be certified right off the bat with the exception of AA where you must be in business for two years um moving on for the Hub Zone The Hub Zone the governor of Wisconsin recently got five additional Hub zones in our state did he not three three year before two last year right so there there are different types of Hub zones um and then the new governor designated Hub Zone we've gone out we've marketed to the governor with and with aa's help uh the state has been able to bring in more Hub zone areas so now we have um in general because those Hub zone areas will move because like I said based on unemployment or the uh rates of salary so yep for the income levels are are lower They do change all Indian areas uh like reservations and such are automatically Hub zone so those don't change but like you have Milwaukee county is very fragmented the whole county is not a hub Zone but it's very fragmented so you could go a street over or across the street is not a hub Zone but you are and that fluctuates and changes just so you guys know that I'm showing you on the map that's in my head that it changes um so with those Hub zones we've also we brought in Marinette was fully in last year and then the same with um Jackson Jackson and then now this year we have Juno langl Juno langlay and Lincoln counties are in those are in for a year and if they they should be able to stay in so they'll stay in for another year if not the state has been trying to keep at the uh census tracks in we have certain counties other other than Governor designated that are fully the whole County are Hub zones as well that's all on the Hub zone map I don't want to I can keep talking about all of these for hours so I don't want to do that to you guys we know that okay go yeah the the last one we have is service disabled veteran own small business and then for the VA veteran owned small business and that's a goal right now for 5% for the federal government with the exception of the VA that they have to primarily look because of public law 109 they have to look at service disabled veteran owned small businesses then veteran owned small businesses first before they can go anywhere else okay now this is now a certified program with the SBA um Nationwide for all uh agencies you can self-certify right now until December to be a a subcontractor to a prime right um but that's changing where you're going to have to be certified for that as well so along those lines my guess is that women own small business will be the same thing um sometime in the future where everybody has to be certified to do Prime Contracting and subcontracting so um that's where I am and we have 153 service disabled veteran own small businesses and on top of that another 25 just veteran own small businesses so I believe they're all veteran small businesses so that makes it 178 total I believe you guys are the agencies are meeting all their goals except hubzone correct yes and the thing we've never been able to meet the hubzone goal ever since I've been in Contracting for 20 plus years now they've never been able to meet that goal and it's it's been shy the numbers are going up but it's been shy so we're SBA is trying to make it easier and more inclusive for more firms to get hubzone certified and stay hubzone certified thank you Shane so now you you just heard about some of the public certifications that we have um in in the federal state or local governments we currently do not have an lgbtq certification um but in the corporate world we do so Jason would you share some of some of the information on what's the process what's the benefit um take it from here yeah absolutely thanks uh Ian thanks for for having me so you know while while I'm talking around the LGBT business Enterprise certification it you know we really work uh as um a certification in partnership with other groups like disability in for disabled owned businesses we Bank as well so everything I'm saying um can be translated to other organizations so whether you're LGBT or not um there's some other private sector um certifications that are available and the LGBT business Enterprise certification it's been around about 20 years it really started in the private sector and and now nearly uh all you know a large majority of the Fortune 500 companies um are including this I know here in Wisconsin we've got several who reach out to us on a regular basis asking who are our certified businesses we've also really seen it grow actually in the government sector the California Public Utility Commission actually requires uh a 1.5% spent with LGBT business enterprises the Commonwealth of Massachusetts the state of New Jersey and then cities across the country and the one big benefit uh with this um is that all of these uh governmental entities um don't require um you to recertify with them that they have anou with the national LGBT Chamber of Commerce which is the official certifying body for LGBT owned businesses that they'll recognize um that certification U so that you don't have to go and redo the application process um so the national LGBT chamber is the official certifying body we and Wisconsin are their exclusive inm Market um supporter and provider it's opened uh similar to the other uh certifications to those individuals that are 51% or more LGBT owned operated and managed uh there's an online application process for individuals to start where they including uploading um documentation including Articles of Incorporation uh financial documents tax returns uh their LGBT status qualifier document um following the uh uploading of all the documents and the review by the national uh certification committee there's a site visit that that is done to confirm uh all of the details uh in that application and to prove uh ownership and to go through those steps um and then once that site visit form uh is complete um it is sent to the certification committee for final review um the certification lasts for three years it is um if you are not a member uh of a local uh LGBT Chambers if you're not for example in Wisconsin a member of the Wisconsin chamber the fee to get certified is $899 but if you belong to the chamber it is completely waved as a certification fee for you so great opportunity um that way in the US there are about 2400 certified LGBT business enterprises right now and that's really growing is we're hearing um and seeing more and more corporate entities and governmental units um talking about it events like this are a great way to get folks who don't even know I mean certification is just that one step in the door and I know that here in Wisconsin we've been really thankful to governor iers who in his last two budgets has included language U that has would expand the state Supplier Diversity Program to include LGBT be recognition unfortunately was taken out uh in the joint finance committee but it's been uh something that the governor has tried um to do and getting LGBT be certified opens up a number of opportunities we um from the national side they're sending out I think this week with 16 different rfps that went out to certify businesses uh from corporations who are looking for product products or Services we're also hosting uh regular convenings Matchmaker events uh both nationally and Statewide uh as well really to open up those procurement opportunities for um LGBT owned businesses the other part I'll just add quickly at the end here um is that one of the ways um you know in the private sector that they've been using the certifications is that groups like we bank for women-owned businesses or disability and have created expedited applications so once you get one certified by one of the entities the other entities will help expedite a certification so if you qualify in multiple areas uh it's great to get multiple certifications to help uh show that leverage and open up additional opportunities um for you that way but um that's just a brief overview of the LGBT be certification thank you Jason thanks for bringing this to the table and I think new information for many of us so um then Amy's the last one here and she's you know you're someone that um White Buffalo has has leveraged certifications right and has has grown the business um would you share a little bit about what certifications you have why you decided to get certified what benefits has it given you um just share with us if you would so um when I originally started White Buffalo Trucking it was in 2013 and we were um not certified but we were working on the 41 Mega project here in Green Bay so we were already on Wiz do projects and then with me being the 51% owner it was ideal for me to move forward to get my dbe status so I am currently a n aw dbe Native American woman owned dbe and then after that I went on to get my MBE and my wbe because once you got beyond the Wisconsin part of the Wisconsin do part municipalities were looking for the MB and the wbees to work with them those were some of the certifications that they looked for to get minorities onto their onto their job sites so that is why I used those which then opened up a plethora of like traffic because now everybody in Wisconsin can see that um a woman-owned business minority owned and dbe because it put me on multiple different platforms for construction Crews um you know Prime contractors to find us to do dump trucking work do you have any federal certifications I do not at this moment we currently stay basically just in Wisconsin unless rosin knows something I don't no I'm talking like the adaa certification or the woman-owned business like the Shane the Shane certifications we'll call them by no lack of effort on Shane's part he's smiling um we've looked at the Hub Zone quite a few times we've looked at the 88 but it's just um I'm not really sure where to go with those or how to I don't know if all my guys fall into the Hub Zone area because I kind of have trucks like all over at this time and then when I lose employees and gain employees it's all just trying to M you know match them up for like Hub Zone issues because obviously I'm in a hub Zone um yeah but then my guys don't all live within the Hub Zone areas um you know some of them live in Appleton some of them live in Seymour but so it's just they they fall just outside that that area for me so I haven't yet gotten into any of Shane's programs but not by no lack of effort on Shane's part I'm sure Shane will keep pushing and trying because that Hub zone is is we're just not needing that um what was the hardest what was the most difficult part when you started getting into the certifications you mentioned you were already doing work with you know wisat and then the certification came second what was the hard what was um any challenges there it was really easy kind of stuff um so well I'm a woman who owns dump trucks so that was uh very hard to move beyond what was my actual role within the business did I have the bigger office um I had to prove that I could run my business without my husband before they would allow me to be even dbe certified I did go get my CDL just so I could prove that if my husband was no longer in the pitcher I could drive a truck and perform the work as needed um I had to prove my money Trail on where I got the money from to start my business um being that I was Native American woman a Native American woman Onida themselves already had programs in place where I had to be 51% on to get um small business loans through and I just so that was already put in place but I had to prove that I could operate this this business with dump trucks without without a man really is what it came down to so but she did it and I did it by the grace of God so you can fire your husband we just want to make that clear if you want to you can fire your husband oh I can I don't know if and she she says that with a smile on her face right yeah I if fire him every day but I I really just leaving he's not leaving my relationship unless he's gonna find box so he's just there for legalities anyway for sure um okay now let's let's go back to the certifiers um you you work with a lot of businesses all of you have have seen have been doing this for quite a while Alex let's start with you what is the biggest challenge when you have someone that wants to get certified what's their biggest obstacle is it getting financials is it what is it oh and we have a new guest there's a black dog that just joined us I you know that uh it it you think for us it's you know it's not only like getting your financials and just understanding what's being asked is like one of the bigger ones you know we'll have for example there was uh we were up at the The dbe Summit in in the dalls and there was a young um there was a female owned business there and my Libby was with me and and Libby said hey where where are you at with your certification you know we're waiting for this and so she thought that it had been done and that she was certified and so you know there was a misunderstanding between our program and the DFI and a simple phone call fixed it and within minutes she was certified you know and just you know knowing where you stand at all times you know and and some of you know margerie barer from uh The Business Council and one of her big saying is you know know the business of your business and know the business your businesses in right and so always be you know and that's the thing right there that I would give you know the as far I would put the spotlight on that know your business be able to speak to what's going on be able to speak to everything right and the thing is if this is something that you're dabbling in when it comes to your finances and stuff you can't dabble in this kind of stuff right so I would have to say that right there understanding that and also the type of certifications you know the type of certification that you have and what what opportunities that's going to present you to I got an email the other day from from a business in Virginia well why didn't you tell me that this opportunity existed and when we looked at it it was a uh Milwaukee Airport opportunity right and so for the and so that is handled by dbe and you know the Milwaukee the Milwaukee uh Rosies group uh and you know and and I so I had to respond with hey you know thank you for reaching out you know just to clarify we solely just focus on state opportunities for state jobs you know and I I gave her you know please reach out to this person and connect with them and get yourself acquainted with their notification program and so that would be the other one that that we've noticed that you know one certification is going to cover all and that's not how it works and for right now there's not one unified system that works for every certification right every certification program pretty much has their own notification platform uh and so that would be number two you know and so yeah that those are the two big ones that we see thank you Alex Rosie what do you see as the biggest um challenge that you see small businesses having having and certifying with the city um so the biggest challenge that I see on a day-to-day basis is poor recordkeeping um when you are applying for certification we ask for a great deal of documents um you know we have the three years of federal tax returns but we also ask for things like profit and loss sheets um your initial cash contribution when you started the business um and and you know what we run into over and over again are businesses that just don't keep Good Records um and you know the basis for being a good business owner is being meticulous with your record keeping um understanding that you need to keep your records for a minimum of seven years um just in case you get audited but by the IRS but also because um you know when you want to get certified by the city of Milwaukee or the county or any other certifying agency they will probably ask for documents that you know you you received five six years ago and um you know it's a mad scramble to find those documents um and reach out to different organizations um to get them and um you know oftentimes they you know come back empty-handed because they just can't retrieve them um so yeah I would say that's pretty much the the biggest issue people run into when they are trying to get certified um and then another big one really is just understanding the criteria um don't be afraid to reach out to um you know the office of equity inclusion you know don't be afraid to ask questions for clarification um I think oftentimes people are afraid to ask um and they miss out on becoming certified because they you know they it's a little bit um daunting to talk to uh government officials um for clarification but you know that's what we're here for or if you have questions ask them don't be afraid um and just take the initiative when applying for certification good advice Roslin what are the biggest challenges you see well Alec and Rosie said it all it's it's the paperwork and just keeping track of your taxes you know everybody once you get your taxes done you just want to put them over in the corner and somewhere but uh you want to keep track of all your paperwork you want to keep track of all your um your records you want to have a office set up some where where you're where you can go and put all your papers together and you know and get them submitted so that's a big one and I also I didn't mention this earlier that um but every year for the dbes you have to uh get not recertified but you have to prove your personal net worth and your gross receipts so we call it the annual affidavit and uh once the person gets certified then we got to come back around on your anniversary date and let you know it's time for you to you know pull those paperworks out and get your taxes resubmitted and that becomes a challenge you know because they want to work on their business they want to keep doing that then they got to go back and and and and pull those paper pull those papers out so it's just just keeping track of your records that's the biggest challenge once you get those records in uh we we our certification analyst John Franklin uh we say it takes three months we have to say it takes 90 days but he can turn someone around if they if all the paperwork is in that's required got we got um we we let them know we got it on our brochure what all what all documents are required um uh we got the websites where you can go to and download everything that you need if you even if you need assistance and helping you get stuff done we can dispatch a consultant to help you with that or you know um someone within our department can help you so um it's just a matter of you taking the initiative and not you know procrastinate so I think like we all do a little bit yeah I just I don't want to forget there's there's some reciprocity between the state of Wisconsin and the dbe certification is that correct say that again there's some reciprocity you were shaking your head Alex The Who a dbe or an MBE they there's a reciprocity to the dbe program there is I I I lost my unmute button so it's called It's called The substantially equivalent application and and so we the state of was Wisconsin has an arrangement with the dbe program that if you have the dbe certification we will gladly work with you on getting your MBE certification and so we have a number of folks from that program uh and I see Amy Shaker in the head I believe you took advantage of that program yes you did awesome thank you for believing in the state program uh but yes there is an arrangement and it's for three years uh and so you know that's another one of those caveats that many people don't know many business they don't know right um and so yeah there is an arrangement and that makes it much easier so if you you have one it's it's just a little extra work and you you have the other and I'm going to say thank you true Malo for putting that through my email um uh from our sta uh she true works on our staff with a lot of the certification so thank you for sharing that um I also want to say quick too when I got it was so much easier once I got my dbe to move over into the MBE and wbe because all the paperwork was already in place the similar right doesn't need as much as the dbe so it was Michael could you change Michael could you change the viewback thank you so there there's similarities between Alli certification but there are differences like like raslin you were talking about and Amy you were talking about you have to show you know that you could run the drive the truck or or do whatever um licensed um thing that that you do so there is differences but a lot of it is similar Shane what's what's the biggest complication you see so with all the above right we're going with all of that and if everybody thinks I mean we started out at more of a a city level so local then we got the state um then you get into the federal certifications um everybody was asking for this much information we asked for about this much information and uh it gets very intrusive and people don't like it so when you're coming into uh wanting to do federal work the biggest thing I can say is be patient um we have a lot of different areas for each one of these certifications at the moment um so like Alex was saying there wasn't just one place where you can go and apply for everything SBA is in the process of changing that with the new program that's getting user testing uh pretty soon we're starting it out with little things um so with that and being patient on the amount of time it may take on different levels there's a lot of usually what I see is there's a lot of back and forth between the uh the applicant and the program office like okay well we need this or we didn't include it or you did include it but we need clarification so there's a lot of back and forth to be prepared for that um some certifications go quicker than others um sometimes they don't so it just depends with it but just like everybody else said make sure you have good records and you know what you're submitting as well if somebody is asking for your operating agreement or your let's say your profit and loss do not do not attach your taxes for that um I've seen that I've seen that happen and here's the here's the biggest thing for everybody to know I do not look at certifications I do not approve certifications so please don't get upset at me if something comes back it's not me I'll try to help you the best that I can so uh that's the biggest thing is just pay attention to your paperwork and what you're submitting and be patient thank you thank you Shan Jason what do you see as the the most challenging for small businesses yeah I think in addition to everything that's been said around the recordkeeping and having all those documents available um is that folks are afraid to ask sometimes when they don't know what it is and there's a team you know for us we've got a a full-time Supplier Diversity Program manager at the chamber who's here to help get businesses certified there's a national team that's available um that folks just have to ask um I've see so many get hung up on I don't know what they mean by this document so I'm just going to stop and put it away and they don't come back to it uh because they they they're afraid to to ask that question um I think the other one that I will say I think the biggest hurdle um and why we see folks not renewing uh their certification after three years um is because they also expect it to be a magic wand that will get them a contract just by having the certification and it's important for folks to remember that the certification helps open up a door it doesn't guarantee business you still have to prove yourself as a business owner you still have to have that capability statement be able to talk about what you do um and be able to do that pitch that way and I see that as the other big hurdle is that folks think that by getting it they' they've secured the golden ticket um and while it is a helpful tool it's not the only Tool uh there well it it it an ason decreases pool of competitors right instead of having a 100,000 you might have a 100 competitors abut and that's a big different big difference in in who you're competing with so you know certifications have a definite value Amy what what did you see as the the biggest obstacle you had when you went went through other than Shane I mean we'll just ignore that part of the conversation it was actually John Franklin oh hopefully no one's watching and no one will be sharing that piece but that if I can ask dots his eyes and Crosses his teas on making sure that when you're going for your dbe certification that you're not just um you know just the base of a company for someone else run from behind the scenes so that was definitely I think my biggest hurdle was the fact that I was a woman going into a a male dominant industry and saying I can do this this is what I can do and I run this this is my show this is nobody else is but mine um and I think after getting my dbe certification it was proving that white buffalo as a dbe could show up on those projects and be sufficient and effective to their companies where um like Jason said it's like they think it's a magic one as soon as you get that certification they should be hired automatically right it's not like that you have to have the work ethic behind that certification for people to want to bring you back and that was you know it's trying to find the right employees the right trucks to put in place to work with people um you know not everybody has the same personality so trying to find people who can fit the personalities and work well together is is a you know a puzzle piece you put together as well and you know making sure that everybody works efficiently together so that I think is some of my biggest hurdles in other words this isn't easy it isn't for everybody but there's a tremendous opportunity here and with that we're we're just about done I would ask you each to get to share your wisdom 30 seconds worth of wisdom Alex give me 30 seconds of your wisdom dedicate time to what again to your business and and give yourself some Grace and some mercy right there's a there's so much going on take a break Focus recharge but when you when you enter the certification landscape or the ecosystem you got to put in some work right arm yourself with the knowledge good advice Rosie what's your advice uh so my advice is really just temper your expectations uh certification is a wonderful resource to get your foot in the door um but it's just the beginning um but it's a fantastic Aid to expanding your business thank you rosn what's your advice um educate educate educate yourself about the industry you're getting involved in especially if you're getting involved in Highway construction educate and network that's the most important thing if you want to get in a competitive Advantage you need to know the right people you need to get involved in um what the things that are going on I'm promoting the annual event DB Summit um yeah and uh just just make sure you're well informed about what's going on in the industry homework do your homework yeah Shane what's your advice your wisdom um know what your business does and does well and that's what you want to do your business cannot do everything that the federal government needs um do your market research utilize WPI uh to do that market research to find Opportunities and find out how many are out there for your business before applying for some of these certifications that's going to be your best bet Jason what's your wisdom I would say just just do it and get certified I know we talked today a little about some of the hurdles or some of the paperwork things that are needed but it's a phenomenal tool in your business you know toolkit here with the certification so um give it a shot try one of them start somewhere uh and just do but know you've got fantastic Partners those on the call and around the state who are here to help thank you Amy what's your wisdom you've been through this from the other side my words of wisdom is you see these people on the screen get to know them they have conferences all the time go to the whole educate educate educate get to know the people who can help you move forward like say these are only you know six of the hundreds of people that show up at this conference that are willing to help you whether it's the dbe summit whether it's a WPI event there's people they're there to help you utilize those those conferences to educate yourself on your business to move forward to meet and greet people that you wouldn't have actually ever get a chance of meeting and that is you mean that was our biggest thing was always going to the conferences because really I got in front of people I've never would have been able to get in front of ever you know right down to the governor so these are these are conferences you want to you know utilize and use to your advantage and when you go you got to be ready and you you got to you got to have I my thing this is my wisdom grow your business solid be ready Network a lot Network all you can meet all the resources you can go to any event you can Marketplace is coming up that's a big one come December um the dbe event if you're into the road construction I also push look at National events where you would meet people that that would some of the larger primes or some of the larger agent Representatives outside of Wisconsin that that might have opportunities for you it's very important that you start meeting and building your circle of of business uh Associates so with that we're at time if anyone um typed in a question we'll answer that after the fact with that I want to thank you all um for joining us on this panel um and Michael I turn this back over to you