Empower your team with airSlate SignNow's solution for sales growth revenue for teams

How to create outlook signature

[Music] every entrepreneur has been there Growing Pains obstacles make grow Gams it's the challenges that cause us to level up I'm your host Alicia [Music] Domino the quicker they start turning to make money you make money Zoom rails make monies we're all happy I have no problem that if a salesperson was the highest paid person in the company actually want uh that's you know if you're making money I'm making money and you're maintaining the relationship that's all I can ask for this is big and every company goes through it when you want to scale your sales but you're aware of all the ways it could go wrong your company needs sales professionals who can reliably get the job done without losing time and while reliably making you more money than the cost of hiring them the problem is is the sales lifetime of a rep in your organization is often short and the turnover is very high it's typical that most sales people leave organizations within 3 to 9 months so how do you get more sales in the door without having a revolving door on the sales team that's the question we're trying to answer today let's get into [Music] it you start to think about it like this there's got be a time or some key indicators that would let me know when to invest in a new sales rep and not only in just the First new sales rep but what's the ratio going to be of sales to employees that you need in order to achieve that growth when do I add more sales reps once you've been doing this for a while the amount of time that you spend in training someone and how long they're likely to stay or how long they do stay is a genuine fear for most company leaders not only because you care about your team but also you know you're never really going to get that scale if you can't keep a bench one of the things you might wrestle with is how long do I take to onboard what are the activities that I reliably do to onboard somebody I think people really wrestle with the question of training and how much training is too much training to provide at the outset that it won't be worthwhile that they stay or what kind of a ladder can I give people that makes them feel like here's some preliminary training to get out and do it but try it and then we'll refine and give you more knowledge as you stay with us longer and of course as an ex- teacher I can say that who they were as a high school and public school student they probably are bringing to your Workforce but is there support for them to be a good learner in your Workforce so what works in terms of training and how do you scale that across all these different learner formats and then the questions don't stop once a rep is onboarded then you also have to start thinking about retention too what's the right pay and commission structure to keep a rep around for the long run should you offer Equity as part of the package ultimately I think figuring this out takes time you don't necessarily need to know all the answers when you just get started after all the rule in entrepreneurialism is fail faster isn't it and the reason why we say fail faster is because mistakes are learning opportunities as you'll hear my guest in this episode despite all his many accomplishments doesn't have it all figured out either but he's preparing to enter the US market and has done a lot of thinking about how to scale his sales team I think hearing about his decision-making process will help you with your own [Music] I'm Mark mski I'm the CEO of Zoom rounds uh we've been a payments company for four and a half years I started it in a small room in Prince Edward Island by myself and then quickly my two other co-founders miles and Marcel joined me and now we're completely self-funded and 45 people ready to enter the United States amazing and so that's your goal your next big audacious goal is that you want to hit the United States and move out of Canada well yeah we actually have I what I consider the best platform in all of Canada for moving money and we went to the United States to to do that you have to sort of make relationships with banks and infrastructure down there and we did it with ferve uh FIS Erv not to be confused with a vaccine company who's the largest like technolog like Financial technological platform in the states and so we're what they call a Paya so we spent about a year doing the Integrations the compliance and all that and literally come Jan one it's a pedal to the metal to start selling in the States because now we have everything technically set up to start operating there so you've grown you were a staff of one now you're staff of 45 you've hired sales reps along the way how do you know when it's time to invest in hiring a sales rep want honest opinion I've just I've really I have one sales guy that's my founder uh we took a product Le approach like I'm technically like if if you looked at like my resume over time like I've been in payments and financial services for about 15 years I started in sales but I moved to product um because I thought i' look at how most people sold and I thought well this is just regurgitating what someone else told you and no one really understood how to pitch value and you know I have a background in economics so I'm always interested in like okay what is the value proposition where is the pain point where does my product stand above someone else because I can make your life easier and I think for sales is I really Hammer homes like they have to almost be the smartest people in the room because they have to think on their feet and they have to start listening and pitching value like it's easier to say Hey listen I'll give it to you for 10 cents cheaper than the next guy great Bing Bang Boom done um but the reality is that there's hidden costs and that cost that people see is like what's your time that you spend you know how much time you spend putting around peg in a square hole where is your loss due to inefficiencies um so that's why I kind of i t sales into product especially in our industry where you're in the middle of the most important aspect of a business how they get money in how they get money out how they pay how they so you know I take a completely different approach to sales for like it's almost the product is the sales man it sounds like you're talking about a consultative selling process are you yeah it's it's kind of that like I like listen I struggle to Define it at times too because even when we started the company my co-founder he was in sales but he um you know he didn't know anything about payment so it was like I have to be explaining this is how it works and you have to understand it and eventually like the key is that don't take what I tell you and just tell someone else you have to start putting things in your own words because it will flow naturally and then your job is to help the others connect the dots on where our value is for their problem and that's really like what we Tred to do if we have a better product makes it easier absolutely I mean everybody likes to be really proud of and feel passionate about what you're selling and in Canada let's acknowledge the elephant in the room in Canada we hate to talk about the word sales yeah of course but at tangible words we really want to talk about Revenue growth and sales and embrace it because it's what drives our economy and it's what drives jobs and everybody living life you know we're stuck with capitalism for now so what I what I'd love to know more about is like what are the metrics then that you look at to know that you're doing well because you mentioned you know providing value cost benefit ratio where you losing time what are some of those data points that you've been following in these years of success so I thought of this like we said okay who's the most important company in our space that was stripe what do they do right what do they do wrong and how do we compete and since I'm product Centric and I believe that having a good product reduces downward pressure on pricing the most important metric for me is profit is you know I know a lot especially in Tech and fch Tech as well Revenue uh and evida are the most important things in the world but for the first few years of our company the most important thing for me was profit because if I don't have profit I can't hire more developers to build it and the more developers I put on it you know I have a stronger product which then again further reduces downward pressure I solve more problems so for the first like few years of our company I was interested in acquiring profit more so than revenue and to do that it was like our product right now fixes this problem who can we sell to Target and then invest further now we have a wider net of whose problems we solve and then we target those and it just sort of keep shifting and shifting in that direction um like sales is the most important thing and luckily for us because now we're at the point where I think we maybe spend like less than $500 a month on marketing um but we're not suffering for opportunity our actually biggest problem now is moving deals like past sales to like Integrations and going live that's where our biggest backlog is is capacity and operations basically yeah and so when what I'm looking for right now like and obviously this will shift as the company grows from like from as we you know finish our rise that we're in the middle of right now literally before this call I was working on something on a term sheet uh and then the next point is like to like then become Revenue focused because the reality is the market then once you sort of gone past being self-funded and now you're raised um as much as I'd like to think most important metric in the world is you know profit I think there's a shift in the company that goes to revenue because then you're at the mercy of the market you kind of play by their roles but to get to this point I had to be very profit focused and so you're profit focused you only have one sales rep which is one of your co-founders um other than the work that you're doing as you launch into the United States in January will you need to hire more sales reps yes um I think my my goal with hiring sales is like I want them to be very smart and sharp I also want to give them the best tools possible and that is the product right and as we the US is a way more competitive market um than Canada um so we thought long and hard about how we structure it and structure it for Success whether it's having sales Engineers because we have a partner portal that allows us to sell directly into SAS businesses and then the other is sort of like the direct and sort of targeted markets with our existing sort of like here's our value prop in these industries and hopefully we can find key people who have a book of business or some sort of knowledge where it's going to be more natural how they speak about it like how their Cadence is enforced it's like hey I might know someone there or I can speak very clearly because I know your problems even before going into the conversation so we have like very clear guidelines of what we're looking for so your your guy your focus on hiring reps is somebody who already has an existing Network in the space that you need to work in and who can follow your consultative selling process if I can use that term I I I I don't I don't even care care if they have sales experience what I care is that they can understand and learn and grow um like and that they will start in sales engineering positions like it is like that self- started mentality so yeah like we're looking for like people who have who at least can have a foothold and start uh more so then you know if they have a book of business we would rather have less salese but more specialized than just like a room full of people and hope some of them make it have you set any retention goals on these new people that you want to hire like what are we talking yeah going to hire six and the idea is like they'll have very clear targets and like their Industries and like their verticals because it will overlap with their existing knowledge is there a ratio you follow on that note like for their you know you're paying them this much and you're expecting them to make four times or how do how do you figure that out so I have a there I have an Excel spreadsheet nice uh that outlines sort of like okay it's because it go I believe it works on a curve and this is what I've tried this before and you know you bring in one salesperson and then they come in and you know if their salary is let's just say 6,000 month if they bring in by like month four they bring in that 6,000 great they start paying from themselves by month five if they're trending up by another thousand that's good you want them to start hitting about two times what you pay them by six months and at that point it comes down like okay if they're bringing in depending on the type of client you can assess if it's like okay what is my additional operational cost for that right okay well do I need one extra person to support that okay so we bring in an extra person maybe month six if they're sort of trending it they're get them start doubling what we pay them by the end of the year they should be at four times Revenue but by then you know it's not like I'm going to hire at an interval of every time they double the revenue another person there's a downward trend on on the operational bandwidth as well and and also then you have account like if you want to be a sustainable company you have to incorporate tools that alleviate pressure on operation as well uh the client support like we have like automated onboarding tools automated um you know problem solving like like so there's like there there's a formula behind how you have to think about it um which includes operational costs to carry them as a staff member or to deploy the product yeah it and then the reality is it can all go out the window in five seconds well exactly how do you make sure that they stay for the first six months before they're earning you know even above what you're paying them for the first five so I believe we do have such an advanced product that can generate more Revenue per client than any other one in our industry given the nature that we've combined multiple Services into one like we make more per client than anyone else because they use more services uh so we know that it's like in demand so it's really about making sure that we explain this to them and show as like hey your potential to earn here is far greater than anywhere else and you're going to have an easier time selling because it solves more problems and is that because it sounds like you're sort of giving like a trailing commission for them if they do stay is that your model where they get a sort of base salary and then for long as long as they stay and their customer that they sold to stays they get a trailing commission yeah so it' be base plus commission and then they got to go live right it's like this only counts if someone goes live so you got to be you know I don't want people who are just like I'm can't give me paper signed and then move forward like you are still the person they trust right even though we're going to some Integrations and they like Thum rails that's fine but you have to sort of also be invested to get the information help streamline that process as well right because the quicker they start turning to make money you make money Zoom rails make money we're all happy I have no problem that if a salesperson was the highest paid person in the company actually I want that uh that's you know if you're making money I'm making money and you're maintaining the relationship that's all I can ask for it you know selfishly I know that the lift to decouple from our services is far greater because it like the reality is some of our biggest clients if they wanted to leave us they would have to integrate five different Services uh and that wouldn't talk to each other there's not a central portal and that's not really something anyone's done like we have a very very very good retention rate so it's that's sort of you know put all those doctors together yeah I'm more than happy to pay a salesperson uh more than anyone else in the company if they perform so as long as they're uh client that they sold on boards and deploys and they get their base salary they're going to get a commission for launch every month every month they'll as every month that they pay they get more commission so it's just going to grow for them and grow for them so it doesn't matter that it tails off in terms of how much they make per because now they're selling four times so they're making a lot more anyway yeah so even on the commissions like let's just say like especially in payments like there's profit based every month for the transactions so they should be making like you know let's just say 20% of profit for the first year you know 15 for the second 10 for the thir uh for the third and then it kind of fourth year it's say 5% until either the the sales rep leaves Zoom rails or the client leaves right um and that just continues on as is like and that way it's like you know for maintaining the relationship staying accountable to the industry and all that like making sure the client stays here and everyone is on the same page so they're in charge of customer success in that sense too of retention they're in charge in the sense that like even though we'll have we have customer success people the reality is the salesperson's always going to be the first person to get the email so as long as you afford it like you just I just don't want it to be like I'm not getting paid anymore I don't care no it's like everyone has a vested interest uh and especially if someone is constantly selling it they you know we'll give them all the tools whether it's the prodct or the support in the operations team to succeed but like they still have to at least have some skin in the game and when will like how much time will you spend with them in those first three months or will somebody from from your company spend with them getting them to ramp up like how is that how do you know that's going to be successful that they're going to know what they need to know in order to do the job independently so a lot of it is like we have like we have a process for like the first like two weeks it's like you'll be on Shadow with myself or the other uh my other co-founder miles or even our existing Integrations team from Ops who' like do the Integrations with clients like they're gone live so you're going to see it cuz you know half going to be the personal skills and like problem solving the other half is going to be how are you going to understand our prod and put in your own words how you going to understand the technical stuff right and I fully aware that like there's not a direct competitor for us that is like oh it does this this this like we are kind you an island to ourselves like kind of the first through the gates to do this type of product within open Banking and instant payments um so we try and make sure they have as much knowledge as possible we've even created something we created a live demo account when I say live it actually moves real money and real time but you can use your own bank account and you can see how it works and you can play with it because at the end of the day you're going to have to show this to people and so start playing it with yourself and then you can kind of get a sense and a feel um you know it's sometimes like when someone's like hey I got a new card game to show you and you're like oh okay well how do I how do I play skipo you're like well you can start explaining it's like well this is not confusing okay let's just play hand and SE and that's the whole point is like we're going to give you something uh s so that you can start playing with it and then you can see it and then start developing your own Cadence and your own softw and then we watch them like show us the demo we ask some questions we have sort of a questionnaire about okay what would you say if someone came to you like this if I tell you this is my industry what would you think the problem is and trying and just like work them up through it um eventually it's like you know there's you think you have a big opportunity bring us on and calls we're here to support if you have calls you want to start taking by yourself that's fine but we try and sort of you know it's easing process to get out of the nest but sometimes we'll take time but we have you have to do it will you give them a bdr or will they do their SDR bdr whatever you want to call it work and account closing uh for now like right now like if we hire some now it' be like yeah they'd have to do their own bdr but our plan is in the states to St to bring one in um we kind of have like one tied to operations already um because we kind kind of see operations as everything from onboarding going live like especially on the technical side and marketing is actually part of Ops in our team because of how the messaging and everything has to be so tight it whether it's because we're self-funded or just that it really is sort of it wouldn't even I wouldn't even it's not traditional in any meemes uh the way that we do that having marketing part of Ops but you know for now focus on profit and trying to not waste money I think it's all kind of tied together and you said you spend $500 on marketing a month is that included in your Ops budget or is that an additional no that's just like that's just like I think whatever we give to Google overpaid or or LinkedIn yeah and do you find those those like um paid Media Services are working well for you no that's that's why I think it's because like we spend a lot of time looking through keywords and like okay what is no one doing and we do something a little bit different so we try and I don't know try and outmaneuver others um but the reality is like the biggest thing that we found that worked well is like is LinkedIn it was like in like telling our story I think one thing about my co-founder miles is that he's very good at getting people to root for him he he's very very good at getting like uh he's a very likable person I know maybe I'm the kudin and there's a balance of the two uh you know but but he's very good at like that storytelling aspect and positioning himself as being very likable and like this is really like in Sharing like the journey and like our Milestones um and yeah it's uh you know and that's always been like a really big boost for us hey when we said we you know when we we talked about like how we you know hit a milestone in like in processing billions you know it was one of our most like posts and it generated more interest in our company from people who like reaching back out or wanted to learn more uh because it gets shared and gets eyes like it's really I like I said like linkedin's probably you know especially during the co era which our company is a product of uh it was the only trade show in town so it that's where people's eyes were and how frequently was he doing that or is he still you know I think we talked about the ying and the Yang I I I told him uh I think the phasa said if everything's special nothing's special so you have to hold some stuff back and like you can't post all the time and because you post all the time people get sick of you like how can you miss me if I'm never gone which is tricky with how the algorithm works right because you got to get eyes on it and you got to be in there for people to get eyes on it yeah yeah but there's certain people when I see their posts I don't read anymore because it's just there's not it's but so I said just make sure that you know it counts so it's like once every like once every month there's usually something um that we post and we have a marketing person who tries to be more clever about sort of the content we create that would potentially catch eyes uh you know especially in software and fintech oh it can just be so stale you know maybe because you know I I have a bit of the DIY mentality from when I would run punk shows in my teenage years uh I I kind of think we do things differently and like we can do it ourselves and doesn't have to exactly look and feel like everyone else because then it just gets lost gets lost uh in The Ether and uh so yeah so we we try different things so that people can recognize us and it's worked I guess like I I I don't think you know the fact that we've self-funded this company with one salesperson um over the last four years to like about 8.5 million in annual reoccurring Revenue pretty proud of you should be that's fantastic and I mean let's talk about um you know do you agree that people aren't always motivated by money in terms of sales reps and how you like do you have a plan for how else to motivate them well the Smart Ones would be motivated to turn some of the money into Equity um I think some of the smartest people I've ever met in sales went to companies where they thought they were in like a transition phase startup to becoming a real company and they needed someone to put the product in front of hands and position their comp structure as Equity plus you know whatever it takes because over time those little bits of equity and companies that you basically help get Revenue to whether they sell it or not that is what really can build generational wealth as much as like listen like being a really good salesperson and making a quarter million a year uh is fantastic but my biggest regret is that I worked at a company prior and it was only after that I found out that they sold for nine figures but like a big portion of that Revenue came from me a big portion like like enough that if I owned a small piece of it could have been life changing for me yeah and that's why I was just like yeah like it's a good feeling to feel like you're the highest paid person in the company but when that company goes you're not the highest paid person anymore and that would be my life lesson and that's what I would tell any salesperson is like if you you can see the you can see that and you can want to be part of this then turn some of equity that's great I'd be more than happy to do that will you be rolling out an equity structure that they can buy into at a certain point in time or when do you think you'll assess that is it a one by one no well it so right now like in our company it's like there are three big shareholders like the three founders but then there's a period below of just like 10 or 12 existing employees who gained Equity through just you know quality of work been here long time know you know so and even in our sales structure like I have it written out already like this is what it would be it's like if you can hit this target goal this is your goal like obviously you got to pay for yourself but you H stretch pools you know you can take path a or path B uh you know and obviously we're open for conversations on a path C but I would like that to sort of be like hey if you sell a lot and you want to make sure that hey this is going to be worth it for you because obviously like we should not like I'm not going to make any bones about it completely honest like this company is built to be a valued in the market and and I don't think this will I don't want a job for the next 20 years I want to build something that is valuable that others will compete to purchase um and so when a salesperson knows that I don't want them to think oh their revenue would go away from comp structure it's like no you have a chance too to be part of it when there is you know the transaction of transactions at the company and what uh recruitment tools will you use to hire your reps I'm interested in that as well well right now I have no idea and I say this because Yelena who I'm going to give a shout out to who's been with the company very early on is our HR person and she went on mat Le two weeks ago uh and her strong suit was hiring and she understands like our Founders and the profiles of the management team of what they're looking for she would be very good at doing that so I don't really have an answer on that I know that right now I'm like I'm kind of going through my existing roex of people I know and kind of asking for help I know that as we were like doing our rise the investors that we've been talking to have all said this is something they could help with which is great because it is something where they're also invested in success of the company and their version of success of not how great the product is it's how much revenue it generates and then all else fails um you know what is that I'm gonna H hire other people to do parts of my job and just pick up the pick up the briefcase and start selling right on and uh best what's in your what software is in your stack other than Zoom rails obviously what what other software are you guys using that you rely on heavily well we use like we use like HubSpot right now which is like we tried other crms and we should have just went with them right away that's the only thing I would say is that we tried a bunch of different things that tied in um but I think Hub SWAT is the one that works best for on the sales side you know especially like we have other stuff like we have like SI for risk management we have crms for oper like and we had our own we had our own custom one with like monday.com that tried to tie a bunch together and it was okay it it wasn't bad um but then there was like no sales or marketing effort to it and then we moved to another one and then it was like okay well then it really lacked the operational side and the wrist side uh that depth so now we're like okay we're just going to go to HubSpot we'll bite the bullet on the cost and you know it's it's something you just don't have to worry about anymore did you know that we're a HubSpot Platinum Solutions partner no idea okay we gotta have that conversation after we've done this very cool and at the end of this year at the end of 2024 where are you going to be what are the things you're going to be looking to have seen happen oh this is The Big Year this is the year where I don't I shift Focus from I wanting the best product I can possibly build to just becoming a revenue machine so every year we've gone like either 150 or 200% growth I would want like 400 this year I know that's a big number given that they the economics and the market right now are not great but if we're actually I said we've probably put about 5% of our effort into sales for the last four years most of it has gone into product and you know kind of kind what we need to get the product to and how we need to get that with sales but now it's like okay if we're going to start at if we're going to put 25% of our resources in it i' would want the same return right if we were putting five you know I one another you know every 5% should double right so uh and that's where we're at because and especially as we enter the states which is a 10 times Market than Canada that's that's my goal what would be the leading lights on like okay now it's time to hire um sales rep 789 that's a good question my my big problem is that pipelines are can just be complete fugazi nonsense hey like I I only care what gets signed and pushed through in live but if I'm starting to notice that the traction we're having through our partners and the traction that our sales guys are having is greater than their time bandwidth it's like okay it becomes a time question I'm also starting to notice that our product solves more problems in specific industries that we're not targeting that's when it would probably be time you know you you know some people don't mind working especially in sales when you have like an UNCA commission working hours that are beyond the traditional 9o5 that's fine and others don't and that's that's a personal choice as long as everyone performs that's fine but as we can like but if the time bandwidth that they have and there's still money on the table that's when we have to make that as like okay it's time to bring in someone else amazing and you use HubSpot and some you mentioned stripe this is my last question for you by the way you mentioned stripe but somehow stripe got the go in with HubSpot on HubSpot uh before HubSpot payments it was like the only software that you were allowed to use with HubSpot quotes were you part of that conversation or bidding on that or no absolutely absolutely not I I wish like stripe is like stripe is the goat of payments as far as I'm concerned they uh the original plan for Zoom rails I've wrote out three things that stripe did well and three things they didn't do well and these are the things I'm going to Target like that's the big question I deal with every day is like I canot spend them on marketing canot spend them on sales uh and this goes for most companies too especially when you're startup right so where's 's my spot like where can I out maneuver where can this product fit that they don't and that's sort of like the ongoing uh board game that you're constantly playing in your head is like okay first rung on the quest ladder is like you know the company kind of like you in the same geographical area and then you go to the next the next but stripe is at the top of the pyramid so that's the bar that I judge success in [Music] payments some of the best relationships I've had in business have been the really open and honest ones to be like hey we're not getting this all right we don't know all the answers can you help us figure it out vulnerability isn't something that people grow up with and are naturally good at I think it's something you have to work at you have to really consider your ego you have to do a lot of reading about leadership you have to think about how to put other people first because it's not our natural inclination certainly not as kids right we're always trying to think about our piece of the pie and if it's bigger than Samy's next to us but when you get into this position of leadership it is your job it is your calling to really be creating a space that other people want to work for you you know as Ryan holiday says and ego is the enemy you are clearing the obstacles for other people to feel supported and be successful in their roles ultimately everybody wants to feel good at work and I think when you're hiring salespeople one of the best ways to make sure that they can feel good and successful at work is that you're providing them the tools and the training so that they feel like they can be successful in this role time and again I've seen too many people quit and leave sales organizations because they came in and inherited chaos and the salesperson maybe the sales leader wasn't particularly good at sales themselves and they thought hiring a salesperson was going to be the ultimate answer as in I don't know how to sell this thing maybe you can get out there and figure out how to do it that rarely Works ultimately you need a blueprint no person is going to be able to come into an organization and figure out how to sell this thing that you made up so I think it works best when a sales leader knows how to sell things and then they are able to relay that knowledge to somebody else and say these are the tools that I use this is the way that I do it these are the things that resonate this is what people are buying when you can toell even just that very simply the training doesn't need to be so expansive if you're hiring a good frit person who is also committed to those same goals of growing the company and providing the service that's going to really help people out in the marketplace and I would advocate for starting with a one: one ratio you know you've been out there selling and when you're ready to hire and you know that you can sustainably take a risk and expect it to take at least six months to get that person in the right fit and you may even go through a couple of salese you probably want to make sure that you just have the revenue to sustain the experiment of hiring that first person and seeing what mistakes you're going to make as a leader because as a small business you're typically going to make them nobody comes into this role perfectly ready to do it so having that Revenue length ahead of you to be able to be like I have 6 months maybe nine months to do this I have capacity in time because I'm not involved in operations anymore let's say and I have the capacity in time in order to help this person learn this Rule and to coach them and to make them independent ideally you get that person up and running in 90 days where they're starting to run demos and uh at least tea up deals that are that you can help them close I think 90 days is a great Benchmark for somebody as independent and able to now hold Co calls without the original sales leader and really you're spending those first 30 days taking them along to meetings with you maybe the next 60 days triing a few of them leading independently and giving them coaching and feedback and then 90 days doing more of that and then heading towards independence and I think sofware tools like HubSpot that allow you to continually listen in and provide coaching on recorded calls can also be very powerful for that sales leader to make sure that there aren't things that you forgot to train them and that you're having consistent touch points to touch base and help each other grow whether you're the leader who needs a little bit of coaching in the way that you're training or the way that you've been doing business or whether the person is the new sales leader and they need a little bit more coaching on something that maybe you forgot to explain as a sales leader or maybe something they just don't know yet I think if you've got the Revenue space to manage the experiment of hiring the new team member and you have some training or a path and a timeline as a metric for training of the things that you're going to definitely teach them the scripts you're definitely going to let them use the way that the sales process definitely works that's a really good place to start to alleviate the fear you need to have that money that process of how the sales work and I think you need to also know what you're looking for in another team member we use tools like Crystal nose to help us identify good fit people and then we tweak and refine based on experimental time and seeing how people fit in I think it's also really useful to know what your values are as an organization because sometimes there are the skills to do the job but there's also the cultural fit within the company and those are often latent things that people don't describe and once you uncover them in your company it's very empowering for two people to find each other and be like yes I want to work here I want to do these things with you in this Marketplace find more episodes of the company growth podcast on YouTube or wherever you listen to podcasts and if you've got a company growth story you'd like to share reach out to tangible words we'd love to hear your story and use it to inspire others to beat their own company Growing Pains until next time thank you for listening to company growth podcast