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where are we Hawaii the state of clean energy stone who are we where the Hawaii Energy Policy Forum where's think Tech and Hawaii energy yes and that's Sharon moriwaki over there who is my co-host and for these shows every Wednesday our flagship on energy every Wednesday for 25 p.m. and today two special guests less tanayama and sherry proper thank you coming down welcome to the show you guys thank you happy to be here so I really have one opening question who are you and how did you get into the studio she twisted her I'll step in on that this is a vice president for international facilities management international association that's I FMA if you look at his shirt notice it's a dead giveaway I FMA and sherry is the director of strategic initiatives at the University of way at West Oahu whoa okay we'll talk about the status of cleaning industry energy the workforce I'm talking about projections on its growth and you know developing that workforce is so important to Hawaii its depth you know Sharon so much torque goes on about meeting the goals you know and how wonderful it is to have clean energy but this is where it happens where it happened with a rubber meets the road where people learn about it and do it do it okay yeah so let's start with You les what is exactly what is its month ifma while we discovered ifma a few years ago when we decided to embrace one of the organization's we belong to boma we belong to ashrae their candy SHINee people and we've developed a lot of as a designer chiller plants and always have invested tremendous amount of money millions of dollars and what we found is over time they went out of calibration for one reason or another and we needed to up the level of those maintaining these pieces of equipment so that we can sustain the energy efficiency efficiency maintain it you know because we're doing good job at designing and implementing it and operating it but with handing the ball over to the facility but their level of understanding and I knowledge hasn't kept up with the technology its high-tech equipment now Jill is young it's no longer the flip phone now we have to understand how to use the other features yeah so it's the same thing with the chip and it's not pushing that button anymore it's automated there's a lot of lectronimo computers software all that yeah so we revisited one of the world workplace events that happened to be in phoenix arizona and Burgess and all the people were not only embracing their the information was tremendous so we decided to jump in and become members and find out more and we found out there's accreditations that's available by ADA foundation they actually have colleges throughout united states with degree programs and I said wow what a concept because today's FM like I told you before he is no longer that guy in the back array in his back pocket it's more in many cases rocky us it's a guy with the pie and he has to have a strong understanding of finance and budget and accounting along with HR and IT now never have I tea before yeah we are plumbing before not IT and air conditioned which is so complicated energy management and now their sustainability how do they keep up with it all yeah well if you if you're responsible for a building that you know is worth a couple hundred million dollars whatever the case may be you have to have somebody up to the job and that person has to understand the technology the building and how it all works together you know I was active in boma the real estate my real estate law career yeah I was I was I was a program director for a long time in the 90s and I remember this transition you're talking about it was really a transformation from the guy with the the rag in his back pocket to facilities management and it was hard work and you had to learn a lot and you had to go to school all the time to keep up what's going on yeah and I think Bowman is probably a good good place to connect the dots you know the way this technology has developed yeah well and they're one of our partners we just had an event where boma also engaged with us with a three-day education event it was a money-making venture and we created three days of education in air conditioning and we sold out all three days and it was for the benefit for ifma Hawaii to support you each was so low in their program okay let's talk about this now okay you have a connection with West Oahu yes we do um my wife is the education chair for if my hawaii and we sent her out and said find the information of how we can get education improved in Hawaii for our facility managers and she came back with a bunch of programs with f MA which our credentials professional credentials that you can achieve to understand the components of what you need to know and I said okay that's great that's what a working professional I'm I see my friends in the facilities there on the peak of getting ready to retire who's going to replace these people and then we find out that fifty percent of today's facility managers throughout the united state is on the verge of retiring how we fill that gap like now we can't we've another 40 years of them working their way through the rain we are updating I'm only gonna do Sharon her busy push yeah she recruited me said let's teach them so she protect information about it most our academic program that has been implemented throughout United States at that point we had only nine programs and universities giving baccalaureate degrees in facility management so number 10 okay fast forward to mr. wahoo gonna friend new big campus lots of lots of buildings lots of facilities lots of issues around efficiency and you're here with us to talk about it yeah so what does it deal mean to you sherry well when lesson jan convinced me to attend one of those if my world workplace conferences and i was able to see firsthand how this career field is really evolving and changing and knowing how you h West Oahu is also evolving and changing I thought this is a really tremendous match we're in the business of educating people and this is a great need here in Hawaii and a little bit more research really opened my eyes to see just how big of an issue it is in fact the ifma organization did a survey a few years ago just a couple of years ago of 4300 facility managers worldwide from 45 different countries and interest only that the average worker in that group among that group of over 4,500 people was 45 and a half years old so and there's hope yet and that survey also showed that eighty-three percent of the people holding those jobs had a college degree so that's where the industry's you like that that says a lot and then another journal article that was done around the same time just a couple of years ago also indicated that there is a shortage of people preparing themselves to fill those jobs so I worked with some of our extraordinary faculty and we have supposed to the other kind oh yeah age West Oahu I'm referring to the ones who have extraordinary expertise in this area take it away so we have started a new concentration we have at our campus concentrations more commonly known as majors and in our business administration degree program bachelor of arts and business administration we created a concentration in facilities management and we'll be sure to cover the 11 if macore competencies in that program through that that concentration academic pathway she started it starts this fall yes ok so I can sign up to I have to be matriculated student going for yes I do it tell me well that's a very good question and if you want a bachelor's degree you do have to matriculate but we also have another option for working professionals and that is the ifma credential certifications that less mentioned or you can get post you can get both and we will definitely encourage our students to to do the professional certifications in addition to getting a degree I've heard it said that in the industry the certificate is at least important as important as a degree yes so if you get post whoa yeah well very exciting but you know when we sort of scope to show out we we thought you would tell us about quote a problem end quote so who wants to go first well the problem is we don't have time we got a panic about this issue about educating our people today's facility manager in and I'm speaking generally it's not adequate in my opinion they need to understand so much more we need our engineers that design the systems to be more adept at doing energy efficiency designs because understand they're not the people in the ditches like I am figuring it out and understanding why its inhibition there in there in there are three towers doing a lot of the designs but we're trying to educate them and they have responded and they and they have to give you an interface that you can understand they have to make a screen that anyone can understand what I'm not then J to make it much more efficient we're talking we're demanding about efficiency yeah there isn't a simple way of making it simple yeah okay so it requires Elise iphone4 technology understanding you will operate I 46 yeah does that make sense yeah well I have a certificate in that myself all right so um uniquely we're operating chill plants off on my iphone 6 is that right wow you heard it here on think technically important and there's a million-dollar chiller plant the things got use five stories tall and it holds hundreds of thousands of gallons of water I can operate over sofa and a jit just to make it clear i if you're not nice to me today I actually can't operate this building's gonna be nice dude okay so we have a generation if you will of facilities managers who have come into facilities management from plumbing in other words they you know they were the first generation to you have to operate these complex systems and buildings and now we have to make sure that they're caught up with the technology that is happening today is that exactly and no doubt they do a great job at what they do and they've learned on the job they've learned by doing but as we look to the future we can see a great need on the horizon and you know it's it's happening now and we want people to be prepared so you're trying to wrap around not only technologies that exist today but technologies that you know we're going to come down the pike in the foreseeable future speaking of tomorrow and tomorrow's future um the other thing that I'm very concerned about and it's dear to my heart is the kids today going away and went to college and that's coming back or not staying here we're all concerned about that list yep and if we have a good portion of our facility managers leaving town or retiring maybe we have a chance to replace them with our own so good careerism absolutely and I like to engage sherry to speak about the different pathways and I think it's remarkable what you can come out of this program with multiple options I've got unbelievable option okay so so in the next segment of our discussion then right after this break we're gonna make me a case study okay I'm gonna be a student in your program I'm gonna tell me about the options the pathways what I can learn and how much moolah I can make when i get out don't forget that okay we'll be right back after this short break you're watching think tech Hawaii offering lifelong learning from passionate hosts and fascinating guests ready to explore and explain Hawaii's place in the 21st century great content for Hawaii from think tech hello I'm Stephen Katz and i'm the host of shrink wrap which comes to you live every tuesday at three pm on think tech hawaii calm and then it's repeated again whenever you want if you go to the website on a show we will be talking to all different kinds of therapists psychologists psychoanalysts psychiatrists people who talk about the mind the brain and about different ways to find happiness I myself a marriage and family therapist and practice here in Hawaii and I hope you will join us because I've got a lot to learn you gotta love to learn and it's a great ride thanks a lot see you soon bingo we're back four o'clock rock here in Hawaii the state of clean energy with my co-host Sharon moriwaki of the ymc Policy Forum and less tanayama who's vice president of international facilities management association Hawaii and sherry proper who's the director of strategic initiatives at the University of Hawaii at West Oahu whoo what a group a so we're gonna have a case study okay I am 40 oh god if I could be 40 40 and I you know I've been doing stuff but now i have decided i'd watch this show actually and I've decided I want to go into facilities naman maintenance whatnot and I come to you sherry I find you I when my way through the campus there and I find you okay sherry tell me about my options okay great well you have several options if you are pursuing a degree pathway right now we have the bachelor of arts in business administration with a concentration in facilities management that will include coursework in several key areas primarily in business but also some elective course works course courses in engineering and industry specific technical needs that program is a kind of like our cornerstone program we also are working on kind of a flip option that would be particularly attractive if you have an associate degree from one of the you age community colleges in a second I can I can get credit for my time in the SE que si si si absolutely absolutely so that other option that we're working on it's not available yet but we hope to have it in the future would be a bachelor of applied science with a concentration in facilities management so that would be more required coursework in the hands-on area with the electives in the business but the goal of both would be to produce graduates who have the competencies in all areas especially those that are required by if ma for a degree program a degree pathway so we would cover in either option communication emergency preparedness environmental stewards stewardship and sustainability leadership and strategy strategy operations and maintenance and so on just so a a complete breath of information that really fits our school because our programs focus on the liberal arts with professional and applied discipline is essentially a liberal arts program with it but it's weighted toward science well and with a lot of applied focus as well um so another option for you though is you this is pathway number B yeah so if you're an existing professional and you just want to learn more about facility management and get that breath in a different way we will be offering the if m'a professional credentials as a facility management professional FMP and the sfp sustainability facility professional that's the certificate you guys were talking about four yes yes yes and through the wonderful support of sponsors and supporters like if my hawaii and hawaii energy and the Office of Naval Research and the Train corporation will be able to do our first one of those at this fall and what I'm being told by industry folks is that they really want us to do the sfp sustainability facility professional first that's where the need is greatest that is where the need is greatest and that is that has a very strong focus on clean energy and energy conservation and will teach people how to conserve our consume less energy and their facilities how to use more renewable sources how to be more socially and environmentally responsible as you manage the facility and so we're really excited about that will be offering that in the prerequisites not for the the professional credential option how long should take me to get the professional credential option about 40 hours of coursework no spaceship that's a three with three semesters well no sorry um not credit hours but clock hours so so that's a like a you know just an um standalone of course that we will probably offer on a Friday Saturday three fridays saturdays oh so it's with one semester yes yes do I have to work hard you do of course you do what exists there will be a test in order to receive the actual credentials so that you can put sfp after your name okay and will there be homework you will have some homework you can't go to college without some homework but will there be field trips ah we wil we're working on that we have a number of industry folks who would welcome students to come to their facility must be involved will he be teaching because I thought I know me at all undoubtedly he will be involved I will come hey give you my word so um cago scholarship we are working on that answer is yes um that's one of the focuses we had this past week and resounding response from not only boma you mentioned they supported us by allowing their people to be invited to this three-day event along with ash tree which is the airplane Engineers Association and we got pemko pampa is the plumbing and mechanical contractors association the union that installs equipment because Greg Sarah kako told me in a wonderful email sit you know we install all this equipment shame on us if you don't learn about what we owe up yeah I mean we want to be part of the solution Oh anybody asked me is this the kind of program I mean either pathway a or b that a union person or a union would like to see its members attend yes yes because you know from cradle to grave in all aspects of energy efficiency yeah it requires whether it's the operator and user but also the designers and the installers to make sure it's done correctly and you know give reason why and purpose to what they're doing now now you mentioned you know field trips and I mean I guess you how can you appreciate the vagaries the technical issues in a large property large facility unless you go to see them exactly you can't it can't be you know hypothetical it's gonna be real so you can take me around you can take me to see you know some of the downtown buildings you could take me to see the government buildings whoa no well we would like that we we hope that works out yes definitely um that that's a really great example of the public-private aspect of this program and how we are working with our partners to provide the most robust experience possible for for students whether the full-time degree-seeking student or part-time degree-seeking or the working professional who wants a little more training so yes we're definitely looking for more partners who are willing to provide those experiments can establish you will establish partnerships with the building with the federal government the state government county government because I they all benefit absolutely seems like you have a lot of demand so how many courses or how many programs are you going to have say next fall how many are going to be up and running well we have just some of the introductory courses this fall and I'm really delighted to say that in addition to the extraordinary faculty that have worked on this program already who have full time jobs in in other areas at the University we have just recently hired a new faculty member who will start with us in January dr. Jeffrey Rogers and he has developed this exact kind of program at another very large University on the mainland clover so um that's a the name i can say that joke eh haha there's not a competitor there there and where again we over there and their way over there rochester institute of technology so we're delighted to have dr. Rogers coming to us in January so he will be the lead faculty member who will take over and determine which courses what sequence what additional courses we need to create and add to the program but what's really exciting is dr. Rogers brings with him a lot of knowledge and experience he has a PhD in systems engineering and master's degrees in engineering management and biological systems engineering so should I look I don't know but I'm sure it's going to bring addition to me well now you know but what I would like to see and when I expect you are doing is that if ur will be active in providing faculty for this program because they're on the ground they're there they know a how it works for a practical point of view and B they know the latest products involved because the products reflected the new technologies sometimes the first time you found out about the new technologies is when you know you find out about a new product right from some company oh gee you're exactly correct because he comes from if my you know it's how he discovered the opening and the opportunity so that's wonderful the other thing that if ma provides as a member of you you have tremendous access to a number of information one of the biggest things is job net you can post jobs and also look at jobs specific to facilities management and I went through it preparing for today and I've seen jobs as high as 60 to 70 thousand dollars parting and you know that's not bad yeah that's a kind of job we'll talk more about it that's kind of job that likely to keep our kids hear that kind of talk well I could keep me here and Sharon too well the other thing I hope if my is they have what they call communities and what the communities does is you have communities like in institutions all our universities you have the utility communities as well as banking and hotels um you can collaborate with them throughout the world yeah they have similar problems young can talk about them and this is what if my brings to the table well you know what else I assume you're gonna have couldnt there are organizations around that are not only familiar with the technology not only familiar with you know the systems the you know the way to do efficiencies but who actually stay up till two o'clock in the morning trying to figure creative solutions to these efficiency problems and i'm thinking of hawaii energy but because yng come they did come today but they come usually every wednesday and they tell us about some incentive or some solution to make things more fair to get the the word out about efficiencies the pencil for example is race darling who oh there we go this way he runs are like energy high rate he could be a great teacher this program and if you know you know my I'm going to introduce you to him right after change business card how about what I'm saying really is though there's a lot of talent in the community it could be involved in this a lot of people in boma and I hope also for example who know a lot about it end is that practical and creative so you know solution making that you can capture for this program so when they get out of school they're more than just book learned they know they know how it works on the ground that would be really valuable and if i were a building and employer you know an asset manager what have you i would want that in your graduates they would i would want them to demonstrate to me that they had on the ground knowledge yes definitely we want to combine the book knowledge that works toward a degree with that hands-on experience and seeing with your own eyes so yes we definitely want want to include that as part of the program so how do I apply here I call you sherry i call you less i call you together I what do I do absolutely oh you can call me in I'll be referring you through the program through sherry in regards to credentials you can call me in regards to membership and understanding what if Mark can provide not only here but worldwide and when I speak a worldwide I'm talking about bringing information worldwide to you and sharing through the world raises such an interesting point you know we always talk about trying to hold the kids here the graduates here but this program would also train cuz these are national international issues these technologies you know this need for efficiency the whole energy revolution its international also i get my degree from you it's not just that i can work here on bishop street i could work anywhere yeah the world is my oyster and you've made that possible i'm really feeling good about it let me see if i can stimulate something a little further you know there's another campus within a campus at what's the wall may be sure he can talk about that yeah right after this break we're gonna reveal the campus with the campus the lesson says interesting technology within the energy within the energy would be right back you'll see Aloha how you doing welcome to you by gtalk cordial detects are here we're here every Friday from one o'clock till about 145 when we talk tech with many many great guests i got the end of the security guy who helps me co-host and I got papi chulo who comes in once in a while to help us through the show so please come join hibachi talk every Friday Angus will be here too so remember like we say at the end of every show how you doing Aloha namaskar and hello i am a new Hittle and I to host a show on climate change it's called climate change beyond outrage and in it we go beyond outrage to look at solutions to global climate problems facing people nations and the world join me every tuesday at one o'clock hawaii standard time aloha namaskar and goodbye we're back for live in one point came up in the breaking of the brakes are actually terrific they're the best part of the show and I'm so sorry you can't watch the brakes but you know you get to be an expert to have a degree or certificate or pose that makes you an expert in the court you can go down and testify in cases and controversy involving energy efficiency issues and you make big bucks hourly rates are astronomical the lawyers themselves are jealous yeah ok now the serious stuff ok this is the kick the course within of course well then piss me off within the campus within the campus ok well one of one focus of this program whether it's the academic pathway or the professional certification is the triple bottom line paying attention to the social aspects of managing facilities the environmental aspects and the economic aspects and in order to do that well you really need to understand each area and for the social aspect it's who are the occupants you know what are their needs and so forth so in social engineering social engineering yes yes and we're just really privileged to have right next door to us at our campus Hawaii tokai International College and we've been doing a lot with them in all kinds of areas but you know that's just one example of bringing another cultural perspective into managing facilities and you know for another example would be we're very close to albani and ko olina hotels and so we have a lot of visitors from around the world in that area of the island and so part of managing buildings is really paying attention to people place and to the planet so yes just bringing all of those prospective perspectives together and looking at the the job from a really a high level perspective and paying attention to all of those things not just what i need to do today all right but a bigger picture so its first of all it's doing the job but second of all it's um it's advancing the interest of the owner of the facility and third of all it's the community it's the greater good you know its energy in general energy efficiency we all want that and to do that advances there the greater good productivity also it makes I think for the worker it's not just pressing a button anymore it's I want to do this better and so you know it's constant lifelong learning I think also great career because you know that what you have at the time you get the degree or certificate is one thing that that's static but you know this is on a change technology you now change is so much faster but it did before you know your career is gonna be rich in that kind of change and that you'll always be any boy you know it's very interesting that you mentioned that if you do a search for facility manager or property manager jobs it is amazing what they list as the responsibilities now and how that has changed from Justin or two years ago and I actually did that in preparation for the show and and just you know random jobs will pencil right now listen to things like real copy ok plan direct and supervised loss prevention maintenance special building maintenance projects ensure energy efficiency and all operations reduce energy waste develop and implement strategic plans manage employees emergency management disaster plans I mean yes you talk about job security if you have some knowledge in all of these areas you're going to be highly employable yeah and cuz you would jump in other words it's not like you're spending 20 years on the ground of you know doing you know the basic mechanics now you're kind of an executive in this and then that's the you know supports the notion of employability everywhere you become the trusted the trusted the person entrusted with the property this is very valuable to the owner you know it's critical to the owner that he can feel good sleep well at night that his properties is being handled Parmalee about does all this translates to big bucks right so what kind of money can i make coming out of the program hey it's okay nobody's listening well it was mentioned a lot of the jobs will show starting salaries salaries in the 50s to 60s and with a pretty rapid rise in in salary increase so it must show some statistics that hundred well almost hundred percent of all graduates from the facility management degree program gets hired most of them get at least four offers so um one hundred percent is a nice number yeah that's pretty good and and it's not only here it's elsewhere so you have choices what speaking of choices there's a reason why the percentage is so high a high in regard to hiring it's because oh because we have multiple inward pants we also have multiple pathways out to different areas so even if you're not the head honcho sylheti manager there's IT departments that is a personal manager right landscaping security all that's within the program right mm-hmm yes are you coming out with this vast knowledge and vast opportunities multiple multiple bad but you know one thing that strikes me is that that people always ask this question now I mean it's like it's dirigir can women have the same career as men can women make the same money as men can they achieve the same level of authority as men what do you think I think yes and I'm sure of it because at the if world work place conference you see just as many women professionals there as men so it is really a career and is open to anyone who has the interest okay his crews when I my observation at boma and niall too for that matter there were more women but they had this kind of mothering instinct about the property different different characteristic you know I think I I agree with that I think this is a great opportunity doesn't matter what you are I can add to that our good friend Eric so know who you also know we went to that conference and we sat in this big arena and right in front of us was like 15 girls and one guy so Derek mean the sociable person he is asked why you and what do you do it because overall facility managers for offices throughout the nation for sprint yeah and he goes oh he looked at the guy I want to be will I give you so you know but this race is also the notion of you know you can only cover so much in this class you're not gonna be able to tell them you know every technology and you're not gonna be able to tell the technologies haven't come down the pike yet you only know there are other technologies coming down the pike so it is to me it raises the issue of continuing facilities management education mm-hmm it takes a degree but that's not the end of it you don't want to be a good professional you have to keep keep in touch how do you offer that are you going to offer that yes well we will be offering the two if certifications and we will also be preparing students to take a third one the certified facility professional but that does require work experience so we can't quite see some of the more traditional students through that but we will help them get prepared so that once I do have the work experience they can get that as well and we definitely will encourage students to take for example the building operators certification and other professional opportunities that they have in that area but you're absolutely right this is every year I should go back for a week or two all right you can currently think I mean so in that relationship with if not something where you can't send the improvement program where you use your perfect timing yes if my provides a number of things and one of the big things that I'm rea ly proud to delve into online is they have a knowledge beats ton of information is coming out real time from throughout the country from fellow facility managers about problems and products and technology and even designs you know are white papers demonstrating how equipment I'll being designed in so that's just one way the other way is like I say these communities and world workplace is our big event we have these communities come together like everyone in the hospitality will huddle in a room and talk about their problem common problem yeah and that's really powerful you know I keep thinking of Honolulu seawater air conditioning okay as a kind of case to case in point about the changing technology so we have for example down here and other places probably a Waikiki to these large buildings with great demand for air conditioning of us part of what Hawaii is these days especially in the schools actually but see what her a condition comes in and since you know we're going to give you a cool water it's going to be at the temperature you want and the quantities you want that will even put it at the pressure you want so it will put it up your 30 stories you know no problem at all but in the process your chiller for which you just paid a million dollars is no longer necessary okay and we have different technology now I would call that disruptive because that you know the landlord and the entrusted manager you know they thought the chiller was a good idea but here they're being completely disrupted and now we have a whole different model that may save money and so you know I guess I put this question to you technology moves so fast these days not only is it move fast but it boots big sometimes I move disruptively sometimes how do you cope with that I mean isn't that kind of a threat I mean that this kind of profession may be subject to enormous jumps in technology disruptive changes how do you train your people to be flexible well I think that's one of the benefits of knowing a little bit about many different areas so that a cost-benefit analysis in a decision like that would include many different aspects not me I help help the owner absolutely decision help the owner bux involved yes help the owner with that decision by providing you know more information to make a more informed decision but also to take into consideration how the various options would impact the stakeholders the occupants the community the environment of the the financial bottom line but many different aspects public policy absolute yeah this is really an important job and it's right here and I guess you see how many students will fill the room on this I mean how many do you expect in the program well it's it's still early we're very hopeful and optimistic that it will be a very popular program it's one of the reasons why we housed it in our business administration division because that is already our largest division at our campus so it's it's in a good place and we will leverage the existing courses that we have in business administration to move the students into facilities management so don't have a good at all you know the exact answer yes a famous I think it won't you ocular I I think this will be a good photo sharyn we have one minute to close can you wrap up for us I think I think the the model that they're presenting is for clean energy energy efficiency but it really is a model for all the new workforce that we're really developing a different way of thinking flexible workers and clean energy is is that industry that's new so they're able to test it but I'm just so happy and pleased that this partnership emerged and hopefully many many more and we're looking for more partners who are willing to offer internships to students and to work with us on the development of this program and my email is s proper at Hawaii WT you got it and we're at I FM a.org if you want to find out more about if m'a and we also have a local website which explains everything that we're doing locally at I f MA dash H org I knew you'd say that that's Tony homage Cherie proper thank you so much for coming around thank you hello you