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Contractor billing format for Procurement

um U disagree vote no Kim please call the row the motion is to disapprove Senator Boswell I Senator Douglas I Senator Thomas representative Chester Burton the disapproved contract 24 on the PSC green list pass she passed she yes pass pass representative mul representative poock um just I'd like to explain my vote right now so let me just make sure we're clarifying cuz my my I guess I'm going to pass to because I would prefer to hear specifically what their point is on what this contract's about obviously they're in Texas if I'm not mistaken is that but whatever I need to do as far as go but I I'd love to hear from um the people on this contract so if I need to pass I guess I'm passing representative Hart uh yes chairman M Meredith uh I vote I and the count is four yes to no or to pass formal vote is 4 I and two pass so the motion fails we need at least five to u to pass a motion given that is a motion to a motion to defer this to the next month motion to defer is there a second second second by cheser burton all those in favor deferring vote I all oppos vote no Kim please call the row Senator Boswell no Senator Douglas no Senator Thomas representative Chester Burton yes representative mcol representative Pollock yes representative Hart yes chair chairman Meredith um just let me make a clarification before we vote if this motion doesn't pass because I want to make understand what happens this motion doesn't pass the contract proceeds without action by this committee so everybody's okay with that we're neither a yes or a no in that situation then I vote I uh motion fail so the contract will proceed to finance so thank you thank you B avable to us this morning appreciate you being here next item on the pool list with University of Kentucky is number 35 on the PSC green list [Music] good morning gentlemen good morning good morning you would please identify yourself for the record uh Barry Swanson I'm the chief procurement officer for the University I'm Craig Collins I'm the Chief Financial Officer at UK Healthcare thank you for being here if you would please raise your right hand do you somly swear to tell the truth the whole truth and not the truth so help you God I do thank you with that co-chair Hart and Senator dougas have questions about number 35 on the PSC green list all right uh see um I understand that anytime you build a new technology I understand that there's there's going to be some cost this the cost of this to me seems astronomical uh and 90 it's $95 million to be paid to one company over 18-month period uh I guess my my question is kind of twofold first could you take a moment to explain to us um the musthaves or what this is going to do or or the the benefit that the the UK's Health Care system is going to get from this and then uh I would like for you to maybe uh explain to us the bidding process and what set the law apart do you want to explain the project sure I can start with the project so this is uh um just recently in the last two years actually in 2020 2021 we implemented the the Epic system as our health uh record uh uh system of uh record for our patients and for our providers uh since then we've acquired uh both King's Daughters in Ashlin Kentucky and also uh St Clair Healthcare in Morhead uh both of them now are part of the University of Kentucky Healthcare and so this project is to extend uh the use of our instance of Epic to both of those organizations it also brings in then uh the enterprise resource planning tools for both of those organizations and that tool is basically the general ledger it's the payroll system it's the supply chain system uh for them to be really operate their health care organizations along with that we're going to put an identity ma uh access um system a management system to that and that's a security system that will overlay the Health Care Organization for you for the University of Kentucky so that we can keep track of what's going on make sure that we don't have people invading our privacy or into our health records and that will go across the entire system for healthc care and so it's really three major projects that we're putting into place that will benefit both of those organizations but there's also benefit then to the university because then we can share records across the uh the organization for our patients as they transfer through those different organizations it'll also give us a chance to be able to connect to other organizations within Healthcare organizations within uh the Commonwealth with a common platform of Epic there are many others that use it and there are ways that we're able to share Healthcare records across the uh the Commonwealth so that's the the benefit that we see uh and really uh advancing Kentucky together with our partners in the in the Commonwealth so really as I look at this and I look at the number 95 this isn't just for one no project is for three okay it really is for three and it's uh when we look at the the distribution of cost it will be across the majority of us for those two new organizations and there's a little bit that will be a part of the uh the University of ky's healthc Care Organization all right thank you for that cator Douglas you have questions comments I do Mr chairman thank you very much um $95 million I I I certainly support our post-secondary schools here in the Commonwealth all of them one of my big concerns in the healthc care space is our dwindling dwindling dwindling Private Practice um positions and the increase Inc corporate medicine here in the Commonwealth most people don't spend much time thinking about that I I do a lot I I guess when I take a look at some of these and I and and I talk to some of my colleagues in medicine what they're constantly telling me about is or or at least asking why are we funding the public sector to to compete against private physicians and I I haven't gotten a good I haven't gotten a good answer for that yet um I know a lot of my colleagues who were in private practice are no longer in private practice because of things such as this and and I'm not sure that this is to the betterment of healthc care distribution here in the Commonwealth what feedback have you gotten be group together from the private sector and and could you share some of that feedback with us today regarding what the private sector are saying about the um the the the disappearing private hospitals sure I think um so I'm going to speak from my opinion and my support as uh as part of the University of K Kentucky Healthcare but I think some of uh what we uh are like like to do as an organization is to really go out and build affiliations and build Partnerships with other organizations and other positions within the Commonwealth and so some of those ways that we do that is through our outre reach activities it's also through our affiliations with the market cancer center with the uh the stroke Network and different affiliations that we can then take resources out to local communities and really provide uh support along with some of those private uh physicians in their communities and be able to have access for their patients that they really need that critical care that might be provided in Morehead or at King's Daughters or back at the University of Kentucky so it's how do we build those relationships with those providers and sometimes these tools help with that in our Outreach we take epic with us uh to really record those activities on those patients and be able to work uh in collaboration with those providers and many of them have access to our e Epic Systems so they can see their patients results too may I Mr Mr chairman one more question or at least comment um all of this sounds really really really good but understand I again will underscore that that I I I support our institutions but I hear I hear one thing and then and then I understand that we're we're building on to a very beautiful very large hospital here in Lexington and there's been talk of closing some of our clinics in our Healthcare deserts and and that concerns me in the healthcare space and I'm not I'm not sure how this is helping us us with that so I I I guess my big concern is whatever or however we process the future of healthc care here in the Commonwealth I think I think we need to take a a really a holistic View and are we best serving our people of the Commonwealth and not just our institutions I I just want to make sure that we're doing that thank you Mr chairman let me um answer part of that for Center Douglas we have a failing Health Care System it's on the verge of collapse and I think things we're trying to do right now are really just Band-Aids to kind of hold it together I can't even say it's duct tape it's Band-Aids is try to hold it together best we can you know the electronic medical record wasn't certainly Innovative concept I think it was premature in the application of it systemwide because it wasn't a good system out there I don't know how many new systems you folks have been in but my small rural hospital I think they're on their third one since 2012 and we're spending millions and millions of dollars on the administration in healthc care and not seeing tangible results it's all about return on investment and from emotional standpoint i' say let's bury this thing and send a message but from a practical standpoint I know that if you don't do this you've got two other hospitals that are responsible for that are now going to have to transfer information to you in a very nonproductive manner that's end up costing more than probably the 95 million is and that's not say that I embrace this concept at all but folks we've got to have a wakeup call um average American can no longer afford health care and we're going to make the system collapse and it's on the verge and to some people they celebrate that uh but to others if that happens we're going to have a a national Healthcare System and uh when this first proposed back in um Bernie Sanders running for president the Office of Management budget said to support that every health care provider in the United States would have to take a 40% cut in reimbursement if that happens there'll be no rural health care anymore so that's a separate issue all together and that's the part of the emotional side of it and we've got to do something there's got to be a wakeup call and I don't know what's going to happen but specific to this contract as to whether it brings value to the system I have to swallow hard to say I think it does it gives a return on investment that otherwise going to cost us more money so that's kind of where I am but um it's it's tough we spent so much money over the last decade on Information Systems without without I believe a true return on investment maybe we'll eventually get there as we evolve into a good system but it's not there so far and still of buying equipment to take care of patient needs we're doing this but again I know I'm on soap box getting back to the substance of contract I think it has to move forward so that are there any cator Boswell just have one question so is this a fixed contract at $95 million this is uh with them they they take a little bit of risk with us in some ways and that we're hoping that we'll come in under this amount uh we are uh are trying to determine how do we uh source and resource everything and in our past uh implementation of the epics system back at Lexington we did come under our project budget and so we had savings with the with the vendors at that point but this is our Sor not to interrupt you but I'm not sure how are you're going to accomplish that somebody's given a contract for $95 million and you know if it's a construction project you know when they put the foundation in you know what they put the framing up the roof on you know as you go along what percent of projects complete versus what is the total payment but I mean it's just is that see these numbers it's just hard for me to understand how you can come up with this exact number why couldn't it been 94,500 you know so some of this is how we staff are able to really support this project so we're hopeful that we can find other means to help support this that would be a different expense than what the deoe resources would be so it is not a fixed fee at all it is one in which we are able to to go through the process and if we can find resources and since many cases we'd like to hire some of our own resources so we retain them uh but this is to get the project up and running and on its feet and then we'll continue to monitor uh the spend as we move forward I would just like to say one thing I would hope that in one year from beginning this time when this comes up next year I would like to see I won't be on the committee but I would like to see a report of what this cost okay thank you thank you coacher I just one question and I apologize I probably shouldn't asked these together but uh I assume that you had multiple biders on this and I was just curious of what set the ly apart yes um you know the committee I think is familiar with the the process we have in Lexington we have a pool of of uh Consultants that that's established and from that pool as specific projects come up that pool is accessed and and and uh solicited for projects like this and so there was a process uh to establish those those Master Services agreement and then Craig can talk about how we uh competitively bid I think there were six six six firms that competitively bid and deoe was awarded the contract uh at at the conclusion of that so Craig will have more specifics and I do sure so back in uh back when we did the original implementation for uh for Lexington we did have seven different contractor or Consultants that were a part of that pool and we did go out and interview them we went through the process of of having them all come forward and read the com competitive bidding process through that uh and deoe was selected at that point uh as we carry on and we're we're actually expanding now basically the system to these two other organizations we felt it was best uh since they know us they were a part of the groundwork of really building the foundation for the system uh that we would uh uh assume that they would come along with us uh for this next implementation for the uh King's Daughters and for uh St Clair thank you so much with that Mr chairman if there's no other questions I'll make a motion to approve there's a motion or second second second by representative po all those in favor the motion vote I all oppos vote no Kim please call the row Senator Boswell no Senator Douglas I vote I but but I will be keeping my my my my uh colleagues in in the private sector aware what's going on thank you gentlemen Senator Thomas representative Chester Burton pass representative mcul representative poock yes representative Hart yes chairman Meredith I motion carries gentlemen thank you appreciate you veryable to us committee members just want to remind you we've got about 30 minutes left in this session still got a lot of contracts to cover so if we can keep our questions short and concise I would appreciate it um with that let's move on to the next agenda item on the pull list with Department of Community Based Services and there's numbers 4 through n on the PSC Amendment Ivory list majority approval okay got you yes please run to the table i' appreciate that good morning appreciate you being here if you would please identify yourself with the record good morning Jenny Thornhill I'm the assistant director for our division for prevention and Community wellbe charity Robert charity Roberts try it again th charm charity Roberts I'm the preven I'm the branch manager in the division for prevention and Community wellbeing thank you for being here if you would please raise your right hand do you somly swear to tell the truth and hold truth of nothing but the truth so help you God yes thank you and again appreciate you being here and um um for anyone who's going to be testifying over the next few minutes I'd ask you to also keep your answers as short as possible uh give me the U delivery not the labor I'd appreciate it with that cator Douglas I believe that you have questions and co-chair Hart coair Hart I'm happy to thank you very much um welcome ladies um this is federally funded one of the things I couldn't find out is what percentage is Federal funding and what percentage is general fund because it's both so the con the contracts are both but the addition with this amendment is 100% Federal so the addition with this amendment is Family First transition act funds which came through the Consolidated Appropriations act in 2019 uh to help with implementation of family first May May Mr chairman more question um we see these contracts every year but I'm not sure if I see a lot regarding the the G the demographics and the geographics of who we're serving and I I guess part of what part of what I look at or what what I get concerned about is are we funding lineages are we fing linear lineages or are we funding different groups who who are are are going through this because I'm I'm not sure what we are accomplishing other than making it easy easier to continue in a cycle when you reference lineage you're meaning the providers no no no I'm I'm refes I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm suggesting the same families longitudinally because that's that's what we're looking at here with with u uh family first and that is keeping families together correct correct okay so I guess my concern is are we is how we are using the funding and what population are we serving what populations are we serving are we all are we are are we continuing to serve people who are in a particular geographic area who have the same demographics and if we are then our programs not working so the these programs are a family preservation and reification Services programs so they are available um they are available Statewide um with all due respect because we're we're going to be running out of time I understand that I understand that their availability you know I'm always arguing that that even even if you put more healthc care providers out there that that doesn't mean that more people are going to seek health health care so my concern here is I want to make sure that that when we were putting this kind of money out there that those people who have taken advantage of the program in the past aren't perpetually longitudinally the recidivism yes of their engagement um and I can speak to outcomes that we assess um so we of course assess outcomes at the end of Services of children remaining in the home and then we look at it at six-month and 12-month increments um where they're staying in the home but I don't know that there's been specific study regarding recidivism of families re-engaging within programs so we have no idea what this program is accomplishing longit longitudinally we do not in terms of recidivism and repeat repeat families I can I can say since Family First implementation we've increased uh prevention service geographically in addition to serving additional families apologize I apologize for interrupting you but but again that to me that it's the same thing as saying if I put more doctors out there we're going to have better health care and that's not true because we don't know if that's going to increase the rate of people who seek that Healthcare the money the money is going to increase the availability unfortunately I understand what's going on I the charge that you're trying to that you guys are doing is what you're supposed to be doing reach out to as many people as you can please please please understand that the charge that we have here sitting in a general assembly is to make sure that the programs that we approve work that they are making a difference and and and I don't I don't I apologize if this sounds rude I don't mean that in any different in in any uh bad way because we have different charges we in the general assembly are trying to look at programs that are out there and assess them to as to whether they work as to whether they are making a significant difference as to whether they are making a change and and if we don't have that data it's really really difficult for us to assess whether a program is making a difference I know we're we're limited on time if you will just allow me to elaborate just a little bit in terms of um repeat involvement we a requirement of family first is um to complete evaluations of specific interventions so you know with family first that we have to use specific evidence-based practices um which we are doing in conjunction with our office of data analytics and two universities so part of that is looking at um reduction of M treatment reduction of repeat Mal treatment um reduction of re-entry into care so those are evaluations that are in progress but we don't have that data yet um so the things that I spoke to initially so at the end of services we have 90% of those children remaining in their home and those months and 12 month you know recis reism rates they are still in their homes we we don't have much of a reduction um in that high percentage rate um and excuse me let's cut to the chase in your professional opinion both of you you think this expenditure is worthwhile that's sufficient return on investment that we should approve this contract absolutely since implementation of family first we have reduced entries into into care and we reduced um out of home care costs by 40 million um out of Home Care population dropped from 10,000 I would suggest again is is follow up with Senator Douglas and I think certainly this is a conversation that we should have with Family and Children Services to make sure they're comfortable with it as well but again we need to move on Center can can we can we proceed yes Mr chair one uh well co-chair Hart has first question uh most of my question got answered the only question I really have remaining is can you elaborate a little a little bit on why the need for the increase in each one of the contracts sure absolutely um so in 22 we received additional state general fund appropriation specific to family first again in 23 and 24 and we used that to again spread geographically serve additional families um and at the result of that we are serving add additional family so it i' say it increased by 14% but what we are finding is difficulties in retention of Staff which affects our ability to serve families or affects our ability um to reduce our weight list so that families can access Services immediately um so the addition of these funds to address those things to um raise salaries serve additional families um be able to access clinical staff especially in rural areas and attract them to those positions where we have salaries that are com competitive um additionally Aftercare services so that we're ensuring sustained outcome um and then also um pre-engagement work so that we are able to reduce ambivalence of families engaging in services so our providers are not spinning their wheels trying to get folks engaged when they could be working with a family that is on the wait list and ready to go all right thank you C Boswell I just like to know how long this program has been effect was this something that came out of covid how long is this program is primarily of federal funding which basically I would assume they said we're going to provide federal funds if the state kicks in money how long has the program been in effect so family preservation has been in Kentucky for TW yeah over 30 years over 30 years um thank you other questions or comments if not uh iend a motion to I'll make a motion to approve all the contracts Motion in the second all favor vote I I'll oppose vote no Kim please call the row senator bosw Senator Douglas I Senator Thomas representative Chester Burton yes representative mol representative Pollock yes representative Hart yes chairman Meredith I motion carries and thank you invisible to us and again I encourage you to follow up with Senator Douglas and also reach out to the chairs respective chairs of children Family Services because I'm sure they would like to some AB when we have the outcome of those evaluations we'd be happy to share them thank you very much next item on the pool list with the council of postsecondary education is number one they've asked for this contract to be deferred is there a motion to defer second motion is second all in favor vote I all oppos vote no Canim please call the row Senator Boswell Senator Douglas I Senator Thomas representative Chester Burton yes representative mcol representative Pollock yes representative Hart yes chairman Meredith I motion carries we're moving right along now next item on the pool list we at Departments of Community Based Services and number five and six on the routine Mo MOA pink list if represent here please run up here as fast as you can and that's State you're back so soon then you know the routine please identify yourself for the record once again I'm Dana Fran with division of prevention and Community well-being branch manager Jenny Thornhill division for prevention while being assistant again I'd ask you raise your right hand do Sol tell the truth whole truth nothing but truth hope you got yes thank you Senator Douglas thank you Mr chair thank you ladies um we're not trying to beat up on you explain to me how this is different than the previous contracts we were just talking about so the same funding stream that we're using here um funding two additional contracts um these are moving the first one got Center of Owensboro on the screen um Joy closet you want to talk about so yes Joy closet is it's brand new it's 100% Federal funding um it is really just linking families to concrete supports financial assistance they also have a eagle fly program Mentor program for children that are aging out of out of Home Care kinship um uh those type of situations um it's providing in those listed counties on the contract there a lot of those Services again that are tangible items um assistance and then the mentor program really helps young adolesence ad adult adults as they come into 18 you know job skills seeking jobs education sorry I'm trying to talk really fast um no no I I this is an agency we already have contact with they provide services in Western Kentucky to um out of Home Care population so this is moving into the inhome population that dcbs is serving or that we don't yet have contact with so that we can hopefully meet familes needs avoid crisis down the line so that they do not become involved with dcbs and child welfare well thank you very much so so we're going to continue to fund so that the persons who are having these children don't have to take care of their kids I I just want to make sure I've got that straight so these are support services available so we're going to continue to fund so the people who are having these children don't have to take care of their children this is not a criticism I'm a doc I I am painfully objective I'm just cutting to the chase that that and I'm not being mean I know it's providing a job for somebody but the bottom line is that is what we are continuing to do even though we don't want to we don't want to talk about it that way and and I appreciate all the work that you ladies are are putting in because I know you're in this with your hearts and I know you if you could do it differently I have every every feel that you all would do it differently and I just want to say I appreciate you all for for the work that you're putting in I really do thank you Mr chairman any questions comments sen bosel so you know that one of these course it's my area but I'm very concerned that as we go into the future some of these funds are going to drive and I don't want this all revert back to the state of Kentucky I think we'll have to look at some of these programs so that's that's what concerns me dly noted that being said is there a motion to approve yes chest Burton I'm sorry thank you you in your description you mentioned mentorship can you just kind of explain what that looks like so they bring in volunteers uh make sure that they're approved and what they do is that they help them with whatever path that individual is choosing if they want to do secondary education if they want to look into job training or job skills or preparing to get a job preparing to get out into the world on their own obtaining housing things of that nature to get them to set to set them up because once children hit that age of 18 some of them do not stay with that placement that they're in and they need support system a lot of those children becoming adults do not have that super rich support system thank you other question comments if not entertain a motion so Move Motion motion and a second by C burton all fav the motion vote I all oppos vote no Kim please call the row Senator bwell I'm going to votee I explain my vote I do I think they think there's a lot of duplication of services but uh for now I vote i s Douglas I vote I but in in explanation of my vote I realize that we've had a system that that was created and has been perpetuated that has allowed this to happen and it is very difficult to uh withdraw that system in a in a fast or timely fashion but I do think we need to consider how long we perpetuate this system that really isn't helping thank you Senator Thomas representative Chester Burton yes representative mul representative Pollock yes representative Hart yes chairman Meredith I motion carries and ladies thank you for being available to us appreciate it thank you next time on the pool list Department of local government is numbers 10 and 13 on the uh routine Mo MOA pink list representatives are here please come forward identify yourself for the record Matthew Stevens general counsel appreciate you being here again if you would please pleas raise your right hand and do Solly swear to tell the truth hold truth and nothing but the truth so hope you God I do the first um is with the uh number 10 on the mway pink list and this is a $100 million appropriation to U Louisville Jefferson County Metro Government and my question is uh the very broad description is to help Revitalize downtown Louisville but what's that mean in Practical terms what are we doing yes sir so this is uh from House Bill one as amended by Senate Bill 91 the Kentucky General Assembly appropriated 50 million in each fiscal year for a total of 100 million to specifically identified projects so those projects were identified in the budget bill or or house bill one uh as the Bader Community Care campus loued campus Louisville Gardens downtown vacant building revitalization and Butchertown Sports District I guess my interest is is more the flow of the dollars and accountability you we got several different projects in here are each one of these going to bid be bid separately and if they are they going to come back to this committee no sir so th this uh contract is for the uh appropriation to the city of Louisville uh during our application process for the money they give us details on uh the projects and they will bid those out separately the city of Lille so we have a list of projects that they're going to be working on correct yes in house bill one is there any possibility of deviation from that list um point I'm getting to I don't want to give anybody a $100 million blank check and say well we say we're going to do this but we decided we're going to do this instead no so it's my understanding working with the city of Louisville that these are the projects that the money will be used for and how do we validate that um so our staff will do monitoring so that they will look at uh receipts invoices uh look at how uh companies were procured go down the list so you're looking you're looking at the bidding process as well yes okay um can I go through that list again very quickly uh the Bader Community let start there the beler yes so they're going to give you U they're going to do request for proposal to do watch to the Bader so the Bader uh so let me just uh read from our description the Bader was originally opened in uh to the public in 1973 the center of downtown Louisville nearly six acre multi-use Park is hosting uh several uh festivals concerts and Community Gatherings this money will be for new construction design fees of the badier um uh equipment inspections and surveys renovation work construction related to access to and from the beler in downtown and the riverfront so there'll be multiple bids for this different phages of the contract you folks will review that yes sir okay all right um that's why I need assurances of you know we're giving somebody $100 million I just want to make sure it's going for what it was intended for and want to know what the checks and balances are but that's a all I have specifically that one question Chester Burton thank you can you also you have Louisville Gardens in here can you also give a description of what that looks like so in our uh description that was provided by the city it's a Redevelopment of the louva gardens into a studio that will house uh sound stages for music film and digital production projects uh is expected to feature up to 40,000 square ft of state-of-the-art Sound Stage Space Museum production offices outdoor filming options uh will generate d uh direct skilled Tech and professional jobs in production and wide scope of employment in supporting and related Industries okay you can stop there so it looks like something we got like an entertainment venue when you say sound and production and yeah that it will house sound stages for music film and digital prod production thank you other question regarding this contract n rain a motion to approve motion is or second second second by represent Chester burton all in favor vote I all oppos vote no can please call the row Senator Boswell I'd like to explain my vote please we've already voted on this because it was part of the budget reserved trust but I do think there's a lot of fluff Senator Douglas pass Senator Thomas representative Chester Burton yes representative mcul representative Pollock yes representative Hart yes chairman Meredith I'm an I I just want to explain my vote as well I'm right concerned this last budget process we've had several contracts that just say appropriation in the budget and it appears that we're not given the opportunity to review these in any kind of detail and I hope we take a look at this during the next budget process and hopefully give some more definition of this but with that I an I in motion carries and thank you for being available to us this morning I appreciate it I'm sorry you have one more my apologies U number 13 on our MOA pink list city of Jackson cator Boswell thank you Mr chairman yes as I look at this project U sir chair may I address this contract so this contract was pulled late uh yesterday evening after business hours um I didn't I wasn't uh able to get the information uh for this project uh so I'm not going to be able to answer any questions so would you like to defer well I think that I think you probably be able to ask because just bring us up to date about this is apparently part of the flood relief program right yes and and as a result of that this you know these projects uh several agencies are involved in the project to get information I would need you know more than an hour's notice to to get it uh but I I'm not familiar with this project to answer questions pressure makes diamonds yes well the concern I had was is simply that taking an old building you're remodeling it it's going to be an average cost of $350,000 per unit and I wasn't sure who's going to own the units after this is all over so if we need to defer if you're not able to ask those questions I would say this is that a motion it's a motion to defer motion to defer sir second second by coachart all favor the motion vote I I'll oppose vote no can please call the row Senator Boswell I Senator Douglas I Senator Thomas representative Chester Burton yes representative mcul representative Pollock yes representative Hart yes chairman Meredith I motion carried M Stevens again thank you for being available to us this morning next I'm on the pool l department of education and our our numbers 38 through 45 and 47 through 52 on the routine MOA pink list and apparently takes a village good morning my name is my name is Karen worth I'm with the uh Kentucky Department of Education good morning my name is Beth Engel I'm also with the Kentucky Department of Education Office Career Technical education Lauren Graves I'm the policy adviser for KD office of Career and Technical education thank you for being here if you would please raise your right hand do you Som swear to tell the home truth and nothing but the truths help you guide do I do thank you that you yes Senator Douglas and and Senator Boswell will have questions Senator and coair Hart wow yeah let's yeah let's do it this way first let's do 38 45 through 45 this is represent of Hart co-chair Hart and Senator Douglas so let's start with those first all right I just have one uh question I noticed that the funding level ranges from like 57,000 to 658 th000 how do you determine who gets what how much goes where I mean because that's a that's a that's a wide range sure so there are two factors to that uh one is based on enrollment and that's weighted full-time equivalent and so that's 60% of it and then for the other component it's performance indicators with that so it really depends on enrollment and their performance indicators okay so so I guess whoever applies for these funds they would you would I guess rate them or well it's distributed throughout for the Cent centers yes all right all right thanks C Douglas thank you Mr chairman uh thank you ladies I I always enjoy seeing you here um chairman Hart uh coach here Hart actually asked one of my questions so that only leaves me one more could you explain the program for the people of the Commonwealth sure specific the CTE funding formula program okay so a few years ago there was a historic investment made into Career and Technical education by the our elected officials and everyone was so thankful for that uh CTE funding received an additional $70 million or so for CTE or Career and Technical education in Kentucky so the department of Ed's office of Career and Technical education was tasked with how do we distribute that money out to the local school districts and the legislative body decided upon with the recommendation from the office of care tech ed to look at the CTE funding formula which was 60% of those funds will be allocated to school districts that have Career and Technical education based upon the enrollment within those programs and we call that the weighted FTE the full-time equivalent the other 40% of funds would be distributed based on incentives earned through the programs of Career and Technical education do students earn industry certifications are they successful in passing the Ender program assessments that are articulated are they getting CTE dual credit opportunities are they experiencing work-based learning so all of those accountability incentives are kind of the guard rails that the legislative body asked for for the CTE funding formula and that is how the funds are distrib Ed among the districts thank you very much that was that was nice and concise one one one last question though is there any fouryear followup of the of the students who to uh um complete the program you know that is a great question yes there is absolutely followup on these students that data is housed with KY stats it is reported by the local districts and the area Technology Centers and I do believe some postsecondary education institutions where we follow up on students to see how successful they are and can say that historically and it is proven by data that students that participate in Career and Technical education outperform students typically who do not participate in current technical education they are employed at a higher rate seven years postgraduation they are employed with higher wages postgraduation seven years out so yes we absolutely track that thank you very much and thank you for a worthwhile program that's that's refreshing thank you Mr chair you questions or comments regarding that series of contracts you do question yes feel free so there's a lot to talk about career in technical education but what concerns me going forward is that I see certain parts of what I consider um Career and Technical education lacking and for example in the trades I see very little work in the masonry category brick masons for example I just recently visited a school they decide to have a pretty much all concrete block it's very difficult to find brick mason so as we go forward I'm hoping that we we concentrate more on the real trade electricians masonry Carpenters Plumbing Heating because this is where we really need and I'm not seeing that myself thank you any questions comments n motion motion to approve motion to approve is second and the second by cator Douglas all in favor vote I all oppos vote no Canim please call the row Senator Boswell Senator Douglas hi Senator Thomas representative Chester Burton yes representative mul representative po yes representative Hart yes chairman Meredith I motion carries uh we'll continue with the discussion on the contracts 47 through 52 Center Boswell I believe um these are your pulled contracts thank you Mr chairman well as I look at this these numbers 47 through 52 um and they're all federal contracts I I read this and I I just really have I just kind of like shake my head as to understand exactly what's involved here so just for example this says that it provides evidence evidencebased school safety and climate plans can you explain to me what that means sure I'm happy to um first I'm Matthew Courtney I'm the policy adviser to the office of continuous Improvement and support at KDE um these are six Awards um out of 28 total Awards to public school districts in Kentucky that come from this stronger connections grant program which is part of the bipartisan safer communities Act of 2022 which was the Federal response to the ubaldi shooting um under this program um all six of these contracts um these districts are using their funds to work towards the legislature stated goal of a 1 to 250 Mental Health professional to student ratio um so that would be the evidence-based School Safety Action that these six districts have chosen to take here to hire mental health professionals um and then you'll see there's some additional budget items in the contract those are all in support of the work of those mental health professionals thank you that's helpful um you know just my concern same on this is some of these other contracts as we go in a future it's clear evidence to me by the new uh federal government people are taking over with some of these things that some of these programs are going to be going to be looked at pretty seriously and I think Federal money is going to start to drive so that's all thank you any questions comments if not entertain a motion second second second by represent po all favor motion vote I all oppos vote no Kim please call the Senator Boswell I explain my vote I think was to go on to the Future um we need as a state and as a legislature we need to help we're going to have to help the federal government to start looking really seriously at some of these programs and everything can't survive and this might be an example of something I think probably should not survive Senator Douglas pass don't want to kill it Senator Thomas representative Chester Burton yes representative mul representative Pollock yes representative Hart yes chairman Meredith I motion carries and um Karen we'll ask you to remain at the table because we need to cover series of contracts on the um yellow list M MOA Amendment list 56 through 75 uh representative Hart has questions yeah just real quick uh there um you look at all these contracts as a whole it's it's like a $291,000 increase uh can you just explain what the increas is being used for what the need for the increase is I'm Crystal Roland I'm the director of program standards in the office of teaching and learning um so this is part of the comprehensive literacy State development Grant and 5% of that Grant amount is for administrative purposes and over the period of the grant we found significant cost savings so we've been able to allocate those dollars across our participating local education agencies um for their use and completing program goals okay and just one quick real quick question are we moving the needo forward are we getting a positive outcome like we're hoping for with it so part of this grant sustainability is part of that driving force so we're really supporting districts and creating structures and processes and equipping their folks to do this work forward we do know that there small measures along the way that they are looking at and reflecting on and then they revise their literacy plans and share that with us along the way um so ultimately longterm we see an impact here but also for districts they are um bringing in new processes to reflect their work and their goals um so that they can make those shifts that they need to ensure a continuous Improvement at the local level all right thank you Mr chairman if there's no other questions I'll make a motion for approval a question comments not there's a motion is there a second second second by representative poock all those in favor vote I all oppos vote no again please call the row Senator Boswell I Senator Douglas I Senator Thomas representative Chester Burton yes representative mul representative Pollock yes representative Hart yes chairman Meredith I motion carries and Miss worth I think we got one more set of contracts of Department of Education these are nine uh 1011 under the um memorandum agreement for $50,000 under yes sir and representative Hart has questions would please identify yourself the record in routin Jennifer gin director of communications of KDE gpus and Grier Jones interim Director of Education policy and previously uh Awards director um under the division of communications if you would please raise your right hand you saw way to tell the whole truth and nothing but the truth got I do thank you coach chairart uh I'm just curious I mean uh there's three contracts that's about $1,500 per contract uh are we paying districts to write one article multiple articles is one of my question and the other question is I I don't quite understand why we're paying districts to write an article because I would think it would be an honor to write an article uh these are actually for the teacher Achievement Award winners for the 2025 cycle uh in the past we have had a sponsor that who would um pay for an award to the teachers who were selected that sponsor dropped out this was a one-time funding by KDE to keep it going uh so these are we had to do the contracts with the districts and the districts provideed to the teacher Achievement Award winner we're going to uh they help write articles for us we hope to use them in our teacher recruitment and retention marketing campaign that's coming up um so it is going to the teachers we just could not provide it to the teacher directly to go to the district Okay and like uh you mentioned it's just a onetime funding to keep the program alive well I guess you find another sponsor the the plan is to work on finding another sponsor it just gets a little tricky when you're trying to ask for money instead of giving it uh as our agency but uh that is the pro that's what we're working on yes all right thank you I think mil any comments question motion I'll make a motion to approve motion to approve second by representative poock all those favor motion vote I all oppose vote no please call the row Senator Boswell hi Senator Douglas hi Senator Thomas representative Chester Burton yes representative mol representative Pollock yes representative Hart yes chairman Meredith I motion carries and I believe you're uh dismissed thank you folks please bear with me we need about 5 10 more minutes we'll be done um next is the behavior health development and loal disabilities it's number 19 on our Mo MOA yellow list representatives are here please come forward [Music] if you would please identify yourself for the record I'm Patty Clark I'm the director for the division of mental health within the department for Behavioral Health Developmental and intellectual disabilities Jord I'm the program manager for the children's mental health and Recovery Branch within the division of mental health thank you for joining us if you would please raise your right hand do you somly swear to tell the truth hold truth nothing but the truth help you got yes yes thank you I request this contract be pulled and it's um kind of straightforward uh under the description it says no increase or decreasing funds however there's a decrease in federal funds of 29,000 but we're going to add General funds in of the same amount and you folks have been here throughout the morning you know we've got some concern about Federal funding disappearing and then expectation that the general fund is going to pick this up so is that this particular situation that Federal funding has been discontinued so our general funds going to have to inherit this expense no sir we had a small overrun of about $30,000 on this contract um in the overall 2.9 Million contract that resulted um from the the misalignment if you will between the the uh Grant cycle the state um fiscal year and the federal fiscal year that required us to and also last year's Contracting procurement process that required all new contracts to be done by February so um as a result of that we had to overestimate the cost that we we were going to ask for and so uh we contracted for those federal funds and when we came back uh realized we needed to cover some expenses so this is this is a one-time cost of about 30,000 all right thank you and you're welcome God bless you is there any questions is there a motion to approve motion to second second by Chester Burkin all favor vote I I'll oppose vote no can please call the row Senator Boswell Senator Douglas I and I and I will I will uh hold you to the one time since I'll be chairman next year absolutely right Senator Thomas representative Chester Burton yes representative mcul representative Pollock yes representative Hart yes chairman Meredith I motion carries and ladies thank you for being available to us this morning I know you've been here a long time one last item of business folks and that's we an exemption request it's number 11 uh on your agenda this is public pension authorities request U um we can't extend contacts Beyond Bay annual so this allows this to happen it's routine is there a motion to do so so move Mo second second all fav vote I all oppos vote no Kim again please call the roow senator Boswell hi Senator Douglas I Senator Thomas representative Chester Burton yes representative MC representative poock yes representative Hart yes chairman Meredith I motion carries before we adjourn please know that um our next meeting is Tuesday January 14 2025 and we're not sure what happens on the house side we know what happens on the Senate side U Senator Boswell will be leaving thank you for your service on this committee and Senator Douglas will be the new chair co-chair of this committee so I want to thank them for for their service um also just like to take a moment to thank our staff they do an incredible job for us and it's truly one of the best committees I work with and appreciate the job you do with that I think you want to make a comment well you kind of uh already made it I just wanted to thank Senator uh Boswell for his service with the Community Committee and we'll miss you and I don't know if it's congratulations or condolences but we're glad to have you as the new co-chair Senator Douglas to deible I'm sorry Mr chairman did we did we defer 62 in pink because I think we might have missed that one no we deferred that one okay good that's Jackson right yes yeah and Mr chairman with your permission may I just have a short ofine I'll try to keep it as quick as I don't know we have other meetings we just long as it's not as short as Douglas's and shorts are that's okay well first of all first of all it has been a privilege to serve on this committee Mr chair chman U I appreciate all the work hard work you've done but with your permission I'd like to app just about this government contract for B just for a minute I've been a member of this committee for almost two years I think this whole process is flawed and it needs revamping how so first of all asking the members of this committee and the staff to review these contracts with the depth needed in such a short period of time is untenable even if we challenge a contract most will be paid anyway I'm primarily a businessman I'm used to scrutinizing contracts in detail very few details are given even though the staff does a great job with the information they receed some of the contracts mention that other bids are received but we have little or no information on the bids if the contract is a renewal what was the actual cost of the previous year who is negotiating these contracts on behalf of the taxpayers is anyone going to try to tell me that a $4 million contract can't be negotiated 3.9 million how many of these contracts are given to Major political donors seems like there's very little scrutiny of federal contracts we must change this in order to help a doge committee to cut out wasteful spending and it Senator Ryan Rand proba said recently that begins at the state level it seems like when we have money we spend it this money belongs to the taxpayers in conclusion Mr chairman I think changes need to be made I've several ideas about how to improve this process and save a lot of money but for example the attorney general has a contingency for law firms when they receive which they receive a percentage of dollars they bring into the state we need to either hire a contingency firm or our own Personnel to examine every contract just for example now we have we have a law basically a bill that says we can only allow $125 an hour for legal services that every meeting we've had this year we have issues with law firms that were approving contracts with law fees that greatly exceed that after contracts there be no additional fee should be allowed in contracts involving uh construction managers um and we need to eliminate set rates for engineering architectural construction manager fees lastly we should require additional information on every contract now we don't we can't obviously take everyone of this contract and put all this detailed information but I think we need to uh have a way for this information to be submitted in a contract review or make maybe put online so that when we have some of these questions we'll be able to maybe get on online oursel and maybe get more details and that way we can save some time when we come this committee um so anyway um I had some other things but I think I'm G to stop right there again thank you so much uh for U allowing me to serve on this committee and thank you Mr chairman thank you all and with that um we'll end with a very Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to everyone and appreciate everyone's service and particular our staff again