Industry sign banking illinois ppt easy
um and to all of you thanks for coming it's a friday and you're talking sba business loans you are a special person by the way you you're here and you're ready to go um on these really important programs so thanks a lot what i'm going to do is i'm going to provide a quick very quick policy and political update because we love to talk politics here and it's always good to know the context and things are changing rapidly so i'm going to give a very brief um update and then introduce mark and for a little bit of presentation and then to your questions your questions so here we go i'm going to share my stream and hopefully is everyone seeing this wonderfully designed powerpoint that i did that's probably not impressive but gets it across okay so if you're here if you want to know about sba programs you are in the right place here is the rapid update about where we are at congress is considering a next round of covet relief you probably have heard it as arp or the american rescue plan which has been put forward by president biden what we expect at least what the intent is is that congress would pass this relief through hopefully and then it would be followed by uh more of a recovery package in other words it's called i think building back better which would look at a lot of transportation and infrastructure and we want to be represented in there too but that's later for now what we expect and i haven't checked cspan yet but the house is expected to vote on the american rescue plan this afternoon they want to move that over to the senate as fast as possible what is the american rescue plan what's in it well what's in it is we have it's a total package of 1.9 trillion dollars and it includes things like relevant to today 1.25 billion in additional funding for the shuttered venues operators grant includes some additional uh monies for loans and similar business support programs but also because there's a lot of organizations on this call but we also deal with artists every day and many artists on on this zoom too for individuals what we are looking at in the legislation is an expansion and extension of the unemployment insurance benefits that the federal government is now providing we're looking at upwards of 60 of the art sector is unemployed at this point consider that and so those individual provisions are very important too probably a stimulus check i think is in the bill at about fourteen hundred dollars as you probably heard the minimum wage the parliamentarian rule that that's probably not gonna stay it's going to the senate where they're gonna use a special process to try to tr try to move that through quickly on a simple majority so we'll see where that goes the goal is to pass it by march 14 because that's when unemployment benefits are set to expire and millions of people are on unemployment so we're seeing progress it's moving through it might be a bumpy ride but it's making it and we'll continue to advocate for you on the state level in springfield i want to just emphasize one thing that is last week the governor issued his proposal for the fiscal year 22 state budget the state is looking at billions of dollars in unpaid bills and a very large budget deficit however we were glad to see that the illinois arts council agency did not receive any cuts it has level or sustained funding at 3.3 billion 3.3 million dollars when we get to the billions that's when we're hoping for federal support to come to state and local governments wasn't in the last package we hope it's in here some of that money would go to the nea and trickle down to the states that could be another source of funding for the illinois arts council for covet emergencies so in summary things are moving stay tuned to the alliance for updates and for action alerts today we are going to focus on one part of the package small business administration and the loans ppp etc that they're doing and now i'm going to turn it over to mark ferguson deputy director for illinois for the small business administration i'm first going to say that i did hear rumors that mark has arts in his background mark is that true yeah it's true uh for you and everybody on board uh i guess you could say i came from a creative background i don't know how i ended up in finance the high world of finance and uh business but my dad was art director for ebony magazine for almost 30 years and uh one of the leading scratchboard artists in the world you know if you're familiar with the medium scratchboard my mom was a senior editor and vp of a publishing company so how i ended up here i don't know i just got creative with the numbers i guess i don't know mark we artists and creatives are everywhere yeah i know you do but i'm gonna i'm gonna hand it over to you you're gonna walk us through uh ppp uh svog shuttered venues which is huge we've got tons of questions on that yeah idl you name the alphabet soup i'm going to hand it over you were going to go over that really quickly and then we have a ton of questions a minute in advance and we'll just have a conversation but okay anyway well what i like to do is just do a quick uh just a real quick presentation because i'm not sure where everybody is you know or what they know but i've been kind of short that uh everybody's pretty smart you know so i i anticipate that this is going to be something uh this will be really really good but i'm going to just go through this real quick you know we have our economic aid package you know that it came out uh president trump signed it back on december 27 2020 and it's just gone to an effect and it's the new um well it's the new economic aid package in it and one of the things that everybody's interested is that it also includes the vsog now as we go where are we kovit 19 loan programs pppeidl now we've got some other grant program details with targeted e-i-d-l advanced svlg additional sources you know if you guys are like me you're probably kind of zoomed out because i am i was telling casey earlier she said are you comfortable with zoom i'm like you know i'm a teacher i'm a college professor minister businessman this is all like this is all we kind of do zoom go to meeting webex whatever so i'm a little bit uh if i if you're like me i'm a little bit um kind of zoomed out a little bit especially with uh sba programs and services because we've been working non-stop so if you don't know we've got the patrol payroll protection our paycheck protection plan we have debt relief we have the eidl and now we have the svlg the shutter venue operators grant and some of these are pure loan programs the others are grant programs and some are hybrids it's like the eidl you know and the pvp can be considered a hybrid also the payroll protection uh the top uh takeaways that is different from the cares act of march 27 uh 2020 is that now a borrower can select the cover period between eight and 24 weeks prior to that it was either eight weeks or 24 weeks after we had the flexibility act i know can you guys keep up with all these acts i'll tell you june 5th the ppp flexibility act of 2020 allowed us to go out to 24 weeks well now as of um the new package that we're sitting here with today you can now have a covered period for ppp going from eight to 24 weeks in any time in between so that would probably be based on what your cash cycle would be okay um you know second draw is designed for the hardest hit businesses and those hardest his businesses are you um this is part of my creative side that you haven't seen me do in a little while but i've got to put it back out there it's fridays with fergie that's me fergie friday's what fergie was meet the deputy ask me any questions i try to get some managers on with me um they work with me on my team to answer any press questions and we just talked things out we've learned a long time ago that people don't care how much you know until they know how much you care and we do care we understand it sometimes you just need somebody to talk to you want somebody to listen you don't want us to talk at you so we're probably trying our very very best to be accommodating like that so let me just go ahead tell you some other top takeaways from the previous package to the package we have now once upon a time with the ppp you couldn't take away your expenses remember under the ppp 60 was for payroll protection the other 40 percent was for allowable expenses well that's still true but now we've expanded the expenses to include uh ppe supplier costs other type costs you can look them up on our web page um that you can now include in that 40 what you have to remember what still remains the same is that if you satisfy that 60 for ppp 100 of the pp loan ppp loan is forgivable so that's not still that's still a great deal i always tell people if you haven't got your pvp you better hurry up and go get it now and the other thing that happened last year that you probably remember is that with the eidl we have what we call the economic injury disaster loan that was a direct loan by the united states uh sba that came out of the office of uh disaster assistance that's the other side of the shop i work on i work on the ofo side commercial working with businesses disaster is simply that disaster we're the next wave that comes in after fema so to speak but with the eidl we had this advance and one of the things they came up with which i thought was pretty cool considering that back then we were building the airplane and flying at the same time so it's like captain you know peach fuzz going around with a broken you know compass like uh where jack sparrow okay or somebody like that um all kidding aside what had happened was that folks we were running out of money so we took that ten thousand dollar advance that was only for the grant and what we said we're we're gonna acknowledge and put it make it available to those who needed money for employees so for every employee you got a thousand dollars so if you had five employees working for you and you applied under the eidl in the advanced grant instead of getting ten thousand we gave you five thousand why again we're running out of money simple as that for those of you who didn't get any money at all but still apply well you know you thought you're out of luck you're not out of luck the reason why i say you folks are not out of luck you remember that song don't call us we'll call you well we're going to call you and people are being notified right now those of you who had applied for an eidl loan and the advance and only got a partial advance you're being notified right now that if you still suffered a 30 decrease in your receipts from this time from today from the time you applied from last year we'll go ahead and if you're in a low moderate income neighborhood which you can go ahead on our web page and punch in your address to see if that's you will give you that extra say five thousand dollars so if you only gave you 5 000 prior to that for one person or for each you know for each person now you can get that extra five thousand now for those of you who didn't get anything at all well mark you know i didn't get anything i got shut out well okay that's fine guess what not to be dismayed or disappointed we'll give you another 10 grand for that and that is a grant ladies and gentlemen you don't have to pay it back that's gone now for those of you who are saying well mark can i apply for that today you can apply for an eidl loan today but you can't apply for the advance why you know why we don't have the money we don't have all the money here here's the sad fact of the matter once we take care of the partial payments and once we make everybody whole there's about 16 million of you who are still lined up to get to 10 000 that's a lot of cheese i don't think we're going to have a lot of that money available so for those of you who are in flint in like flint like that great job for those of you who are not well we'll get over it okay we've got to just keep moving on uh with that being said what's the first straw to ppp your first drawing your ppp is simply did you get monies back under the cares act okay and uh with that first draw what we're talking about is that are you going to be eligible for the second draw and that's going to have a lot to do with whether or not you're in business on february 15 2020 whether or not you can prove that you had a 25 reduction in gross receipts or revenues we're going to get into i don't even want to talk about it but this whole earned revenue gross revenue we'll get to that shortly at any rate we're allowing for people with a first draw to apply but here's what's really important is that the second draw ppp that was um just created under the economic aid act of december 27 2020 you will now have until march 31st to apply for ppp now this is going to come into play especially for all of you as i said um i used to have this pro i would do fridays with fergie and i always had my creatives on there mark when are we gonna have something for us i said it'll come it's coming it's coming they were alluding to the svlg but you want to keep your mind on this date for the ppp of march 31st 2021 okay let me uh keep rolling here um i don't want to get into the increase because that's that can get a little touchy you know sometimes at the government we don't keep it simple sunshine okay we we make it very very tough on everybody new ppp standards for the first straw includes health cooperatives destination marketing 501c6s those of you who were beating me up relentlessly last summer that you were my chamber of commerce directors i said i can't help you i can help you now still eligible or your soul props your not-for-profits your veteran organizations that sort of thing what's the second draw the second draw simply if you got a first draw and you get another draw you got a second draw and the only difference there is that you have to show that like i said you have to show you had a 25 reduction in your gross receipts you're still going to calculate your payroll the same way take the average monthly payroll multiply it by 2.5 that'll give you your maximum amount 60 of that has to go to the payroll 40 can go to eligible expenses however you want to do it um those of you who are in the restaurant business or the food accommodation services business that naics code is 72. instead of us taking your average salary monthly salary for all your employees and multiplying that by 2.5 we do it by 3.5 gives you a little bit of bigger draw and then you're going to have a new form to go ahead and do your second draw so when you see this sba form 2483 sd sd means second draw i hope i'm not boring i'm trying to go through this real quick so you can get an idea of where we're going you couldn't have previously drawn a ppp loan under cover periods here's the deal for those of you who did have a ppp loan already and are going to get another ppp loan as long as the covered periods that eight week the 24 week period don't overlap everything is fair game here's something else that you need to know also in order to qualify for the svlg you have to have satisfied or at least have some kind of completeness done with your first straw ppp loan by december 27 2020 that's where you hear you cannot have well matter of fact that's the only exception where a small uh venue operator grant and a ppp can coexist because after that date you cannot have a ppp on your on your draw first or second doesn't matter and you cannot have an svlg at the same time but again we're still talking about 25 reduction and you're talking about 300 employees or less um this is the ppp application you know you can go to lender match all of you from what i understand from our hosts all of you are very very sophisticated you're kind of familiar with this process so i'm not going to bore you with the details on that um of course that the portions of the ppp that are not forgivable okay you'll be subjected to anywhere from a two to five year loan it's two years up to june 5th 2020 after that it's over five years but here's the deal whatever is not forgivable is subjected to a one percent interest rate over say two to five years depending on when you got everything all right um right now we're having issues with forgiveness i'm sure you got bud
ies out there that are saying man i'm i'm done with my pvp and i want to i want my loan to be forgiven but my bank is not accepting anything right now well the banks are being banks i guess and they're not they don't have their platform set up yet so they're got their attorneys involved saying that well we're not ready for to accept forgiveness well we didn't write the legislation that way we said that whenever our borrower is ready to have that debt forgiven they can go there but please keep in mind that if you look at the last sentence here borrowers who do not apply for forgiveness given this payments will start 10 months after the last day of your cover period so you do have 10 months beyond the last day of your covered period at the end of that eight weeks or the end of that 24 weeks whatever you opt for or whatever cover period you opt for in between i'm hoping that this is kind of like bridging some gaps with you guys uh the other thing the eido advances are no longer going to get 10.99 remember we had this whole issue about oh you're going to give me money and then you're going to charge me forward to through taxes yeah that's the idea that's what we want to do well no we're not doing that anymore we're also for the expenses that 40 you can now take that and deduct it as you would on your regular uh profit and loss statement so those are some of the things that we've done with uh going from the cares act to the flexibility act of uh june 5th to now the economic aid act for hard hit businesses um oh boy let's see the e-i-d-a loan is uh there's some couple of different things i'm not sure how many of you are interested in that but with the ewl you're looking at 2.75 interest can go as much as 30 years for not-for-profits for-profit it's 3.75 the one big thing that you have to understand between the eid l disaster loan and the ppp is that the ppp loan is determined based on your payroll and eligibility and whether or not you had losses the eidl loan is whether or not you've been impacted by covet but it is a loan and is subjected to the five c's of credit okay so you're getting a real bonafide loan there anything that's over 25 000 will have to be secured with ucc filings as well as your uh personal guarantee uh let's see here uh with the new targeted um eidl what's happening here is not only are we going to be given folks that advance that qualify prior to but we're also trying to get the monies to lower income community folks that suffered a 30 economic loss so we're trying to get it into the communities that were hardest hit but we don't know anything about you got to remember in 1953 when we were created we were created meaning the sba was to level the playing field between big businesses and small businesses after all you small business people are the folks that run the economy all right okay this is again talking about the eidl and if i don't have to talk about it i won't okay but we are finally acknowledging the itin number to go in place of the social security number in some instances but uh for all intents and purposes um you still want to use your social security number or an ein number when you're applying for any government assistance and please have your taxes in order okay meaning that be prepared to go ahead and have to apply for a 4506 transcript and have your at least your 2019s file your tax returns and and yes can i be rude and interrupt do you want to jump into questions yeah i would i'd like to i'd like to jump into questions is that okay no that that's fine i'm i'm glad you got rude with me because i was getting a little bored with this too you know i'm i'm getting a little tongue tied this is this is not boring but um first of all thank you um with what you presented and how you presented it we do have questions lined up so what i thought i would do would you not have conversation there are two burning questions that we got in the most i'm just going to cut right to the chase and get right to them and as you as you indicated it deals with revenue so two-part question so first of all when it comes to that basic eligibility or it's kind of referred to as the third priority but just to get in the door um it refers to uh revenue of course well more says what revenue is that just to get that 25 just to get in the door what what do you have what revenue loss do you have to show your cluttered venue you know and i have to cop out a little bit jonathan and i'm gonna have to we haven't determined gross revenue in earned revenue we haven't made a decision on that based on the guidelines however you know if i'm going to be conservative and you know error on a conservative way i would look at it as receipts receipts being both uh earned and unearned income so because i think um so i'll just actually get to the priority period so the two the 14 day priority periods 90 percent uh loss seventy percent loss right it simply says revenue um in the legislation it just says it says revenue um and so there was a there's like 24 hours where the the sba website specifically said earned revenue which has a huge you know impact on on nonprofits it was then moved back to just revenue so i think there's some confusion out there about um which is it which is is it going to be because again it has a big impact on nonprofits and jonathan that's the reason why we we know it moved one way and then it went back to the other way it's because we are we are not sure okay we are not sure that's why i said if we're going to play it safe with revenue why would you say receipts matter of fact i think it's even on our web page where we kind of refer to receipts you know for right now now you can always go to www.sba.gov svo grants to get updates but that hasn't been determined and okay and myself as well as every officer with me we are just waiting and waiting waiting for them to just give us the application and at least give us a uh interim final rule of something on how to determine that revenue because that is the most burning of all the questions if i had the answer huge i took i tell you guys believe in me i tell you in a minute in a heartbeat now the other uh the other burning question is uh if that was what with respect to revenue the other burning question is when um you know when when do we expect the application process uh to begin obviously a lot of organizations are hurting out there desperately need this money at the same time we also want it to be done right um but what's your sense of the timeline if you have one my gut tells me within the next week or two that's my gut now is that from on high no but you know this is what i've been hearing coming out of headquarters that were very very close and it seems to be focusing for some reason like march 4th i don't know why i don't know why march 4th is such a great date but um you know i i really don't know but i'm hoping very soon because as you know under the ppp that doctrine or that the the submission we closed that off on the 31st and i think that's our concern right i mean right and so if you have that going on and then with the binarist administration putting out this edict back on the 24th that we're going to level the ppp for folks that have uh companies that have 19 or fewer employees and that's all they're going to write ppps on that and it's going to be from february 24th to march 10th you know that doesn't give people like yourself a lot of time to determine to really determine am i going to do a venue grant or am i going to do the ppp because i can't have both at the same time yeah and so so for that so so so what i've heard is there's no resolution on whether it's earned or or gross uh when it comes to revenue yes we're not sure uh we're not sure when it's going to be going to be open uh the application process so part of what makes that tough for people on on on the call is that it's an either or uh with the ppp and the svog and so but i want to get into a little bit of nuance on that so i'm going to ask you a couple questions on the ppp versus svog so here's the first question um in the case of a 2020 ppp so an organization has received a first draw ppp before december 27 2020. in that case um can they apply for a shuttered venue yes they can okay so the second hey we could do this like yes or no like so so yes so yes i mean if you want me to elaborate a little bit no no no no no no jonathan but but but yeah so if if you're in organizations you've received one in 2020 before 2027 you still have that choice right or a second so this next question i have is okay so now after december 27 so basically right now can you res i'll skip the receipt can you apply for both a ppp and in shuttered venues at the same time can you apply for both the same no because there's no application for the svlg but even when there is my understanding is you can't apply for both at the same time well you're not supposed to and you're not supposed to be speculating um but meaning this here here's a here's i think this is what you're getting at if i go ahead and i hedge my bet and i apply for the ppp right now mark but then the application comes in for in the next week or two for the svlg can i now apply for the svlg and take the best of the two deals no you cannot do that you will not get a choice no yeah yeah so it's either or and that's not i'm not here to i i i'm yeah no i hear you i'm not going to give my opinion on that so and and that and that brings the issue up to the time crunch right because because now organizations are really in a position where they have to decide really svog or ppp right one question that did come up that nuances that a little bit if they apply for a ppp and they're rejected can they then apply for an svog or shuttered venue yeah i believe they can okay i can i'll table that but i'm pretty i think i believe they can okay so those are the most important things the the have you know having to decide really between ppp and svog when we're looking at this year i'm now going to go to um some of the questions that we have because we have a lot of good questions in i'm going to start right at the top um here's the first one somehow i think uh somebody needs to give me a blindfold and a cigarette and put me up i don't have any you know um so do you know if the sba shuttered venues application process is it going to be asked what will you be using the funds for that you receive so so as with the ppp they say hey 60 has to go to payroll is your understanding that that's going to be the same thing with the shuttered venue i don't know if i don't know if the percentages are going to be the same but the shutter venues act was supposedly designed to do the same thing ppp does only for those who are in the creative arts in that in that spectrum of industry and that in that line of work in other words what we're going to do is that we want you to use the money to pay for expenses such as your payroll things of that matter but here's the real catch to it you don't have a hybrid it's not a loan perhaps a grant and if you don't comply then it becomes a loan your svlg is a grant 100 grand yep so i'm sorry is there expected restrictions on i know there are there are uh expectations on what the funds will be used for but are there restrictions on how the funds are to be used to what they're go what they're to go towards well we have the restrictions um unfortunately we don't have the guidelines but we do have the um faqs in the faq state for your normal expenses your payroll you know mortgage interest things you know your regular now what percentages we don't have percentages for that and i'm not sure if they're going to put percentages in there so we can we can probably drop that in chat too there's uh on february 21 the sba issued a new faq so perhaps we can drop that in the chat or or provide that um as a follow-up um next question um so for first draw ppp fund so this for this individual situation here um and we may not have enough specifics but let's give it a go so the first person received a first draw ppp sounds like it's a sole proprietor those funds ran out and so then they went on unemployment um so there's now that says they they did get an eidl loan but what they're asking is if they if they're able to get a second draw ppp would any portions of the eidl be forgivable my first inclination is to say no okay okay because the eidl is a loan and it is a loan that is used for hankovic not reared its ugly head you would have been able to pay your bills but because you couldn't pay your bills because of covin this money coming in from the eidl should be used for your working capital purposes okay now with the ppp coming in on the second tranche or something like that can you refinance that you might be able to make a payment or two on the eidl with those proceeds but you won't be able to refinance the e-idl loan if you give my drift yeah yeah so i can't take if i have a e-idl loan for say and then i get 150 from bpp i can't just go and say okay i'm just going to refinance my eidl it doesn't work that way we won't let you do that is is there any word in terms of you know the pressures coming up march 31 is coming up is there any word about that deadline being extended and they just released the bill uh yesterday i'll look into it um but any word that you hear about extending that deadline that ppp deadline i haven't heard anything but i now as quietly as it's kept you know we there's a lot we're running out of money again on a pvp yeah i mean it's going faster than ever now you know i know the new legislation um you know provides 7.25 billion um that goes that can go go very fast yeah that that's you know that's pretty much a drop in the hand i can get you some figures on that but last i heard i thought um we were close to 200 some odd billion already taken care of or accounted for under the ppp and i think under the under the bill we only had like 258 or something like that yeah with some change with some change making it up to the 325 yeah and we have a we have an faq on our website yeah they've made and uh i'm going to go back dive in the bill and uh the latest bill it's been it was marked up uh and i'll put on top of our iq the status of that deadline we'll see if we can pick up any movement legislation that wise um so now shifting to the eidl um do we do people wait to hear about the eidl or is there a way to check on the status of it you meant me we'll contact you you mentioned should they wait to hear on that or is there do they need to check the status some way to check the status of it it depends now or we if we're talking about an existing eidl and the lord knows i'm not going to make any bones about it jonathan you know we've had our problems with the idl they're people who have been just now getting funded from june july okay on the loan portion we're not even talking about the advance i'm talking about the loan portion now and this question is on an existing eido so say one more time again so they're they're wondering about the status of i think i believe of an existing eidl that has not been it has not been dispersed sounds like that's the case do they wait and if others are in that situation they don't have to wait i mean if you you're going to have to wait to be contacted if you applied for the advance okay okay then we will contact you for that for the advance for the advance but if you're talking about just your overall processing or your e-idea alone if you if they want to they can just send me and that's you know mark.ferguson at sba.gov just say mark i don't know the status of my my um loan and um i'll have some of my folks look into it meaning i'm not trying to open this up for you know everybody oh it's too late now mark man all right man it is out well i do have i do not jonathan i do have uh i do have my people that will go ahead and do it for me yeah okay and uh we can get it all i need is when you apply what appeared to be the problem if you have any kind of uh correspondence between uh oda or the office of disaster assistance along with the application number we can try to figure out whether it got hung up somewhere because you got to remember a lot of people a lot of times these things get hung up because maybe someone passed away or you got impatient so you made two loans
under the same social security number or ein number or something which flags us for you know fraud right you know so there could be a lot of different reasons i have one guy that i just got him resolved um he forgot one number on his bank account and we finally got him straight but i had another one with another bank where the bank sent back his 10 000 advance sent it back to the sba to oda because he had the money get deposited not in his business account but in his personal account okay so they thought they thought it was they thought the bank thought it was fraud sent it back and the reason why i know because it just came up they said well mark can we get that money back i'm like i don't think so but i will ask the story double check your numbers well yeah it really you know because you know when when i saw the questions and i'm sitting here and i'm going through some of this and we're going through faqs you know faqs is you know i guess you can quote me um faqs in my opinion is just a way of making amendments to what we didn't think about upfront you know yeah or or not faq's ift or uh interim financial uh interim uh final rules i'm sorry ifrs and the faqs too though is a way of answering questions that we did not address in our legislation we want to address it in our legislation that's when we come up with the interim final rule yeah yeah so i mean i i think it's it's it's relaying it's relaying two things and and i know you're not the decision making here but um you know i think the biggest concern is if you're a non-profit organization and they go with earned that's going to open the door up for you more because those charitable contributions aren't going to be you know you could be holding your own or not experiencing as steep of a loss and so then the non-profit is kind of penalized in that case for getting donations and gets kicked out of that priority period so i think that that is a huge huge huge factor it's a huge factor it's a very huge factor jonathan but i can tell you i think you and i we've discussed it in previous uh discussions that um you know we here at the sba are going to do whatever we can to even a playing field with small businessman okay and we're going to always if we're going to i like to think if we're going to default we're going to default to common sense and to helping the small business person as opposed to saying no this isn't going to be so just like when we had the outcry when we were giving out the um previous ppp and were 1099 1099 people for this added income or telling them no you cannot take off the expenses uh or you cannot deduct expenses with our money that we just gave you for your operation you know what i'm saying and we we thought about it and it got repealed so it's one of those processes you know jonathan it's just one of those processes man where uh you know we're kind of learning as we go along too to be perfectly truthful we're not the big bad sba you know bold or anything like that but what we're trying to do is just level the playing field the best that we can and do what's right yeah and so we as a sector mark just definitely here to provide you guidance on that too the alliance will keep advocating there's one other question that yeah i want you to keep advocating yeah you know you keep me on speed down and say hey mark you need to take now that you know the deputy yeah hey mark you know you guys should take a look at this or that so i could at least get it brought up yeah and in in our legislators as well we're being in in direct contact um with them i do want to circle back um though with um you know we talked about nonprofits in that case but i've noticed a lot that when people hear shuttered venue operators grant that there's a misperception that they think you have to own a venue you have to own a space in order to get it but if you're a performing arts organization you don't have to own a space to get it is that that that's right right if you're a performing arts organization you don't have to own this space but you should have a space where there's like fixed seating if you want to if you want to get into the gray matter of it like for example um i can't be a performer that goes from venue to venue to venue with that mobility factor in it okay but i can be a performer who does not own my own space but i'm renting it from arts alliance and they have a fixed venue and i'm always there i got a lease with it or something like that so you don't have to own the space the way i read the regulations and you um and with the the fixed seating and you know we can provide clarity on a lot of this stuff afterwards as we get it um the fixed seating though is just museums right no it's not just museums it's theaters it's um you know it's a little bit of uh everything what they what they're trying to do is to try and discourage the mobility aspect meaning that i can't be a performer and apply for this grant and go from theater to theater to theater they want me to be more fixed and i think it's addressed a little more in the faqs in there in the faqs they talk about that and i think they make mention of like a wedding planner yeah okay a wedding planner provides a great service does this does that but they also said but that wedding planner does not have a fixed venue does not have ticket sales does not have this or that or the other one was a circus a circus that is mobile like ringling brothers used to be they went from town to town to town that wouldn't qualify because it wasn't fixed it wasn't bolted down now if there's if there's an outdoor theater a performing arts organization that performs an outdoor theater they erect a stage in a local park uh the patrons sit on the lawn are they eligible for an svg is it going to be there i mean is this already there or they just erect the stage they erect the stage for a temporary basis and they tear it down when they're done if they do it that way then i'd say no they're not eligible however if i'm a um a local traveling troop and um and it's outdoors and i get a real sweet deal on some land and i make a forum and i do it and it can be seasonal if i do it at least four times a year i can qualify for the grant and um but you know what you know the the major question or the issue here jonathan is mobility mobility of the troop but also mobility of the venue um i'm gonna um again uh uh jump back here a second i mean one of the things that that the um the sba has put out there is that floor plans are are something you got to be ready to provide i think right um that's something um but there's one very specific question so we're going to go from kind of the complex vector very specific one eidl loans can they be used for upgrade of hvac systems in buildings the ideal loans they're not supposed to be eidl loans are specifically for working capital purposes working capital meaning that you got to pay you you you got to pay your accounts payable and my next question is then applying for an svog when the system is is ready to go um and applications are ready how do they apply i've heard of a gov website can you explain that a little bit what organizations need to do to be ready with with the same the way and that's also addressed in our faqs it's at the very end but you know because we don't have the application but what they're saying is that they're going to keep abreast of using grants.gov and when you apply for a federal grant you have to have a sam number okay so you usually have what is i think your duns number that you have to have to get your sam and once you're in there that's about for right now that's about all we can do for you right now so those of you who are getting ready to apply um um you should have at least that you should at least have your sam number in place so people will need a duns number and as follow-up we can sba has provided a link for explaining that and how to get it but yeah yes yes sir matter of fact um keep your eyes if you go to www.sba.gov slash i hail my director my boss robert bull steiner has done a um robert has done a um webinar on how to apply for sam just for the svlg for just for folks like yourselves but organizations need to be aware that that's something they're going to have to go through and that's something yeah yeah look at that right now right that's that's right there did beau just call so you can get no no no no that was uh that was one of my team members calling me but um but basically that's something that organizations need to be aware of that's a step in the process even though the application is not available yet for svog there is something they can do if they don't have a duns number and they need a great a sam dot gov um account that's something you you can get ready for the application and the way to get ready for the application is to get yourself registered and sam okay and we can provide we can relay that right right information on that too my understanding is if you've applied for say a national endowment for the arts grant you're probably already in the system you're probably yeah you're probably yet i mean this is the way uh grants.gov handles everything too see normally through sba we look at it and that's the other thing you know folks have to remember the svog program is handled by the office of disaster assistance myself and all of us here in illinois we're not in disaster assistance we're on a commercial side we help you grow your businesses you know that kind of way but what i wanted to say is that um the because the svlg is being handled by oda and it's similar to grants.gov they're the ones that are in charge of that so i guess what i'm trying to tell you guys is that as soon as oda gives us more information we'll be able to be more exacting with all of you folks so basically um so so what i see to step back um it'd be great if if we could provide all the answers here but there's this is i'm seeing a fluid situation where we need answers sba's is not there yet um the issues such as earned revenue right is still outstanding and we we definitely conveyed our opinions on that but it's still it's still outstanding one thing that i think is needs a lot more clarity and you know we can we're pushing for this is the idea of um of fixed seating is one and what it means to be a venue um because our again to emphasize our understanding is that performing arts organizations they don't need to own their own their own venue but it seems like the urn versus gross the the fixed seating and the the venue thing is something that really needs to be defined more and so i think what what we'll do is i can follow up with you mark and with others [Music] we can talk further and as we get more clarity on that we can put resources on the alliance's faq page or refer them to sba but it's a it's a really tough situation for a lot of non-profits a lot of creative for-profit businesses where we're you know we're clinging on we're clinging on to yeah and jonathan i've been reading some of the notes in the uh chat and everything and your folks are absolutely right you know it's um you know you need the clarity of an attorney okay you guys want to know exactly what you can and cannot get away with or can or cannot do and i just don't have that clarity because we put it like i said everything is given to us as a faq yeah yeah okay faq okay is that the guidelines no yeah okay is there an ifr addressing it no interim final rule right interim final rule yes okay no and so that's one of the reasons why i was like huh you know okay we can go over this and i'll do the best that i can with it but you know having been a product of you know higher education including lowering the law if you get my drift uh i'm not very happy yeah with how the thing is being introduced but then yeah i'm but at least we're doing something to help because when i had fergies with fridays i had a lot of people from your community from your industry that were saying mark what are we what are you doing for us yeah yeah i got nothing for you yeah and and the one big thing that i think everybody has to understand is that that svog supposedly should be doing almost the same thing that ppp does for businesses only now it's going to be for you folks in the entertainment arts sector well we and as i said too the the real issue with traveling troops and set venues hedges on mobility and then when you get into that now you're getting into doing am i drilling you know seats into the ground do i own this building this kind of thing it gets a little gets a little ticky well mark we're over time it's a testament to the energy and the interest in this issue that a lot of people are still on even though we're over time but mark hey these are intense times um and this is a complex issue and you've taken time this afternoon to answer some tough questions and i want to thank you um for the work that you're doing i want to thank your sba colleagues for the work that you're doing and seeking to get this right um you know we at the alliance will we'll keep we'll keep pushing you too just as well you know what i'm asking you jonathan and i'm asking you and all the members of the alliance i have no shame in my game i'm mark.ferguson at sba.gov yeah three five 312-3535 three oh if they have specific questions i'll go look them up and i'll put them in the forefront i don't have a problem doing it because you know what the better i can communicate what it is that we can do the better off we'll be i mean i've been lending money for 40 years but not quite this way yeah and probably not in the billions of dollars either i imagine well you know we are we we've done 14 to 16 years worth of work in a matter of months well hey hey mark thank you relay our thanks to everyone at sba um i'm gonna hand it back over to uh casey but before i do if i may um we'll keep pressing for answers on some of these fuzzy things look to our faq we'll we're we're gonna push for answers that we can get and push for the most open answer i want you to push oh yeah whoa no no no oh yeah oh he's my leader too he's my boss and he pushes for you know we're we're real big on total transparency we either got it or we don't okay it's either black or it's white we don't like tiptoe to the gray matter well i um anyways just a quick message before i hand it back to casey yes sir a lot a lot of people um on this call are really struggling to stay in business oh tell me about it i know and to all of you out there we're thinking of you we know this is not weekends don't come for you because you're stressed and stress doesn't take a weekend we'll keep keep keep will keep fighting for you um and casey i know we're over time but i'm going to throw it back to another genius casey smith to take us out and i mean that sincerely well thank you so much jonathan and thank you so much mark so appreciate your candor so appreciate you like coming in and being real with us um i know this is super frustrating and it's certainly something that at the alliance we're gonna keep pushing on we're gonna we are gonna keep pushing on we are gonna keep uh holding folks accountable but with the compassion that also it is individuals that are doing this work who are also living through this pandemic which is really um been tough for all of us so with that um we will have a recording of this so we'll we'll send it out to y'all we'll also include a bunch of links and other resources in that email you'll probably be getting that i'm going to say tuesday i'm going to give myself the deadline of getting this to you all by tuesday if your question didn't get answered we are going to take those questions down and and get written answers um so if you have a question be sure that it's that q a i'll stay on for a couple minutes just to give you a little bit of time if you have something that's come up in case casey so for everybody on the line too make sure you get your questions to kc because i'ma hold you to get me those questions on tuesday so i can go get some better answers right because we do we do know with everybody just not this crew but all the different crews out there are going through some hard times and our heart goes out to all of you thank you mark thank you thank you
