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Initial assurance agreement

hello everybody and thank you for joining us for this contract administration practice community session so Jim I'm going to hand it off to you to get started with today's session while I try to push some buttons on the backend so Jim over to you Thank You Matthew welcome everyone to the call as you see on the screen my good friend Doug Freeman hasn't been able to join us yet and so if he does he'll ring in and we'll get him involved a couple of things just reiterate what Matthew said do please ask questions and do please raise your hand and participate these sessions are way better when you are engaged and involved and we certainly want you to feel invited to do that so what this series is based upon is our construction contract administration practice guide put together and put out by CSI and so we will go walking through the practice guide chapter by chapter and that's why we introduced it as an introduction to construction contract administration so I appreciate you being here and I look forward to our walk through the practice guide Matthew let's go ahead and get started with the first slide so Matthew is helping drive so we can be sure that the slides stay on track and we move through this and an expeditious matter manner so what we're going to talk about is the chaos of construction I think that often it may be like running with the Bulls except maybe the contractor thinks it's running with the architects or engineers or we may think it's running with the contractors or they may think both of us may think it's running with the owner so I guess we all get a chance to be the bull in the story and let's take a look at the next slide and you can see that this is a complex and complicated environment there are typically a triangle of the three the designer the architect or engineer here the owner and the contractor but there is an assortment of other parties that are brought to the table in the process once construction begins or even before so there are consultants perhaps to each of us that are the the triangle in the middle the owner sometimes has consultants as does the contractor and of course the designers do and may have a series of consultants and then sub consultants associated with those so that there are communication paths through particular parties there may be indirect communication paths through other parties as we move through construction and then while we're in construction fabricators material suppliers manufacturers representatives the list can get very complex particularly depending on the size of the projects so that we are basically in that run with the Bulls from the time the Notice to Proceed is II issued on project 2 begins so let's take a look at the next slide and talk about how we can organize this chaos and how we can stay on top of the chaos well how about teamwork and and what can that teamwork do for us those of you that might be watching March Madness wow what games we are seeing and what opportunities we are watching for teamwork to be successful well what does that do it gives us better communications increased productivity on the jobsite project costs are better control perhaps the project's finished earlier certainly there is a momentum and a positive morale on the job site when teamwork is the foundation from which we're working and my experience has been certainly there are fewer claims and fewer delays on the project when we put ourselves in a position that we can take that at being successful great things can happen well let's look at the next light and talk for a second about maybe what are obstacles to that approach certainly adversarial relationships on projects that occur perhaps they're inaccurate documents we put ourselves often in a position of as designers using up time that unfortunately gets pulled away from the construction phase owners may find themselves using that project clock to make decisions that take a bit too long and maybe then create an unreasonable construction schedule perhaps there was an unreasonable design schedule to begin with particularly those that work in public work for schools where bond packages or fundraising has to happen that also can affect the the production schedule perhaps even create changes that weren't planned during the design phase and also during the construction phase we've worked on projects for private clients it may get acquired by another organization and so there are different set of rules that have to be implemented into the delivery of the project depending on where you are in the country there can be labor disputes whether you're in an area that uses union work or not those kinds of things can delay the project as well as something that happens with products either in manufacturing that there have been times in the past where we're hi I'm based in North Carolina we go through shulock shortages drywall shortages for example so that can be an obstacle to an effective and successful delivery of a project you can poor communicators or poor communication or poor communication process these are all obstacles that we can plan and implement ways to work around or to be sure that they in fact don't occur from the beginning and just overall ineffective management all three parties involved in the team whether it's the owner of the contractor or the designer it can be challenged by ineffective management within their own organizations or between parties so those are just a list of some of the obstacles and Matthew let's go to the next slide and see if there are any questions so far about where we're headed here no questions at this point so feel free to continue okay okay let's go to the next slide and talk about ways that that we can that we can work collaboratively to and as we go along in the chapter of the book here we break that down into three ideas that can successfully support the collaborative effort on a project the first understanding the documents the second administering construction based on the particular delivery method that we have on the job and we're going to just touch on a few of those delivery opportunities and the third being the fulfillment of our appropriate roles and what is expected of each of the parties to the contract we are going to take a look at those briefly as we talk today and then at our next session we'll go a little deeper into that third collaborative opportunity and fulfilling our particular roles so the first Matthew next slide is understanding the documents that were used and um just to cover sleight so let's go to the next so as we talk about our contract documents what what do we mean by that and in in beginning that discussion what are our contracting requirements well we have of course the contract forms the agreements that the designers have executed with the owner our client and also the agreements that have been executed between the client and the contractor if we're talking about a typical design-bid-build delivery system those contracts are a little different in design-build or construction management at risk but they are one tier of our contracting requirements the second is the conditions of the contract which will touch on here a little bit later also any revisions clarifications or modifications that have happened either in the bidding process or in the negotiation process or after contracts have been signed in the construction process which would be change orders to the contract so understanding and in having a grasp of those contracting requirements that part of the contract documents is particularly critical in a beginning and a starting point then would follow our specifications the the written requirements for the work that is going to be performed and those are of course broken down into each work result for example the roof the windows etc that are involved with the project so those specifications understanding them from start to finish from top to bottom is the really important part for all of the team involved with the construction and then the contract drawings themselves the drawings not just the plans to include all of the schedules etc they're included in a set of documents whether those are large graphic illustrations or just schedule will details so in looking at the contract documents and thinking about where you start in the construction process we this is a group discussion about the construction phase and our administration of the construction phase but I'll just take a second and say one one really important opportunity for all of us is to become engaged in the projects during their development and during the drawing phase of the project it's not something that has to wait until construction begins many firms have the opportunity for peer review for quality control or Quality Assurance procedures where our expertise from the field can be brought into the office and informed some of the decisions made in the design process itself so I always want to remind everyone that this this doesn't just start when the starter's pistol goes off in the construction phase but is something that goes all the way back to the marketing and sales of the job so that we can have input into those contracting requirements from the very beginning so let's take a look at the next slide and I'll add now we we are very fortunate to have so many professional organizations in the field that we practice whether it's instruction design or even for the owners that own facilities that develop facilities whether it's the and there should be more noted on this slide that I have left off and I apologize for that the AGC consensus Doc's CMA EJ CDC PE NC or a CEC or DBIA these organizations that have put together a foundation for us to start from when we begin to pull together our construction documents our contracts our agreements there are long-standing tested litigated annually or semi-annually or on some schedule revised and updated documents that all of these organizations support or pour their effort into to keep us from having to start from scratch it applies to so many things in our business of why would we start with a blank page when we are able to start from a point of such an informed past and move forward from there so and as we pull those contract documents together the first thing I just wanted to harp on here if you will is using those professional organizations that represent our practice and our construction and and begin with that learning history moving forward so Matthew all pause there as we go to the next slide and see if there any comments or any any questions about contract documents and contracts I haven't anything yet there was one question that came in that I'm holding for later on as I think it relates to a different slide but I've been pretty quiet okay well I will say this too and I share this with the construction administration class that I have I think it's really important to reach out and befriend many individuals as you build your practice and as you build your career in the construction administration field and one of those is having a dear friend that's in the practice of law because there are so many opportunities to discuss and talk about the finer points of what things mean before your having to do that under pressure or in response to some filing or litigation and I encourage you to befriend those in the practice of law to seek advice and as you move into your practices and through your practices so the delivery of the project also involves the drawings and all handedly we quickly think about the rolled-up blueprints out on the site in the trailer or in the building and and actually the drawings are made up of several different opportunities or components there are resource drawings where these may be involved with the project in the early phases or they they may be a part of your documents as you deliver them for bid or for construction but these resource lines usually show existing conditions whether it might be a renovation or an addition you of course have the contract drawings that are named in your agreements and those are used to establish the extent of the work Doug who is typically on these calls with us enjoy saying that the the contract drawings are documents that are intended that that are used to show the intent of the design and they are not a step-by-step set of instructions on how to build a building and so they established the extent of the work or the intent of the extent of the work are also shop drawings that are a part of the drawings that are typically prepared by those who will be more closely involved with the work either manufacturers or suppliers or the subs that are putting up work but there's an important distinction in those shop drawings and that is that they are not contract documents they're supplemental information they're important if they need to pass through your office under a critical eye but they are not apar for the contract documents there are coordination drawings and North Carolina those are required on state-owned property and are one of the most difficult things to obtain their information that's provided by the subcontractors and they determine relationship of project elements and who goes first and who goes second they are invaluable if they are done properly if they are done on time ahead of work and actually it can be an extremely useful tool for the construction community as well as us as we're walking around on the job trying to observe progress of work and they can be very informative they may have record drawings that are intended to capture any kind of modifications or changes that occurred in the field during the installation and construction and there are critical to our clients our owners as they move into the facility management phase of the work and their occupancy of their of their property and then there are now more and more often 3d representation electronic models of how project goes together which take it from having to visualize to actually being able to see it and I'm sure that many of you or on job sites particularly larger projects where this is actually up on a screen out on the job site and conversations are happening around that screen about conflict avoidance and ways that two things aren't in the same spot at the same time so these are a continued conversation Matthew let's go to the next slide of other resources and support that we use for the drawings and for the contract documents any questions yes we have a couple of comments and questions here question from Brian McClure's asking just our coordination drawings a lost art form at this point well that's a great question and I would sadly say I think they are in my experience and the work that I've done and it's a it's that they're typically in the state of North Carolina there's extensive explanation of what they are and the expectations of receiving them and whose to do them and how they're to be produced and it I believe you're absolutely right it's a lost art if we seem to get them almost at the same time we get the record drawings anymore additional comments here one of them here from Dean he just wants to remind everybody is huge he talks about construction management is not the same as contract administration and he has several of his students tend to confuse these two we have a comment or a question in here from Donald Donald's asking can you address lead time as a factor in the construction schedule and setting a realistic construction schedule I'm not sure if you want to talk about that here's a realistic drawings or if that's something you want to talk about as we get into the roles slides later on well let's talk about it in the roles I've had a great idea don't don't let us miss that now because that's a great question all right II just wanted some additional clarification here from Frank who is asking what category do construction drawings fall under what category to do the contract drawings and drawing so I'm guessing within the the six we have up here yes I contract or construction drawings is what I would say in that in that second aisle okay and then we had a comment came in here from Bradley saying thank you for bringing up contract administration benefits for projects by starting early I've been working on the owner/operator side in hospitality where early CCA implicit implication has benefited projects greatly for all the reasons discussed by you thank you for bringing up the benefits for projects with Oh looks like the comment is actually just repeated itself twice you know for some reason so keep up the good work it sounds like there and Charles brings in the question here of coordination drawings are now part of modeling if that's correct well I think that they as earlier was stated that maybe they're a lost art I think that they are well what what's a good word to say that they're being enveloped in the building modeling process because we are seeing more and more detail and and able to be rendered at such a exploded view and opportunity the they are I think being assimilated if you will into the modeling systems and you know if you're if you're fortunate enough to have that that ability in your firm and your client your owner understands that the value of that tool I'll go so far as to say you know integrated project delivery is certainly maybe even more advantageous than the coordination drawings by themselves so if you've got a team that's sophisticated enough to be using the modeling from design through construction and into facility management gosh I think that's the best of all worlds maybe okay well that clears up all the questions there for now so I'm going to move on and you can keep going Jim okay so just as an example again I want to reiterate there are so many resources for us to have for support in what we do in the design and construction industry one of the most important things I think you can do is become knowledgeable of these resources and support that's out there and use them I love to call myself a weird architect because I'm the end to this stuff and if you will and I feel like it makes me a better resource to my client when I'm able to start from a point that has been tested before that is not to say that it takes away from unique design I just think it makes that unique design be informed so let's go to the next slide Matthew and talk about a resource that CSI provides which is the construction specifications practice guide so the specifications are another of our contract documents that give a written description of what's supposed to be performed in the field it's broke down broken down into a very easy follow Bowl format in masterformat divided into procurement processes then general requirement processes and then to follow with actually what is going to be put in place out in the field with the work divisions themselves I enjoy the opportunity that I've had recently to get in front of students and talk about this division one general requirements those of you that have had interns or young people in your offices or who have taught will do teach and on the construction side where you have interns that are in the field with you the lack of general understanding of what kind of general requirements are out there to have to be understood and be implemented in the process of construction is can be pre overwhelming I certainly didn't know anything about the written part the paperwork part the the tremendous amount of work that is beyond just drawing or specifying a product and so this is an incredibly wonderful resource in this practice guide to help people who are starting out in construction administration not necessarily to these specification writers although it would certainly inform that but to be able to understand the implementation of those specifications in the construction process so you know where we have our specifications divided in those work sections first there's additional administrative information but then there's also product specific information great place to learn about the products that you're thinking about using and then in that third part gosh is just such a great tool to help us learn to understand what's being built how it's being built how it should be be built so that when you're on your site doing your conservation and somebody says well this is the way I've always done it having this tool and this contract document the specifications to look back on and say well gosh I appreciate that but here's the way we need to do it on this job because this is what the product manufacturer says we need to do with whatever system it is that you're looking at so again resources that are available to us that can make our life so much easier and make that team so much stronger and then Matthew the next slide is the final piece of the contract documents that are provisions any kind of clarifications or modifications again depending on the delivery method there addenda that even in the design-bid-build market are issued prior to bids being received so that pre contract things can be clarified and changed and they become a part of the contract documents sometimes there are modifications to a bid that may be inconsequential or clerical in nature that have to be made and those would certainly roll into the contract documents if they are something that occurs on a project and then finally after contracts are executed and the work begins either change orders or change directors field orders and those kinds of modifications that occur after the start of construction become a part of the contract documents so that is a really fast conversation and review of opportunities for being collaborative in understanding our documents I want to move to the second part now in the next slide and talk about how that administering may change a bit depending on the delivery method Matthew before we do are there any new questions there was just one that popped up well I guess there's a couple year now from Bradley just came in this is our mock-ups ever part of the contract well it not been my experience that they have ever been a part of the contract but I will say I do know instances where mock-ups were constructed prior to the contracts being signed and were referenced in the contract documents that the end result of XYZ will match and it and it denoted the mock-up included dimensions and photographs and and in that dealt more with exterior skins and appearance kind of issues not necessarily the hard structural support and construction itself I haven't had that experience but I do know that there is an opportunity to do that now mock-ups are very much a part of your construction administration process if they're done after the award of the contract and are used as a measure against what you will measure the project so when you have a mock-up going for brickwork and windows and flashing and waterproofing it is in your general requirements to find that it is a part of the expectation or a part of the quality control on the project I am familiar with projects that use an expanded supplementary general conditions that begin with the general conditions and master format and expand that to be very specific about tying the mock up to the expected end result in the project so it can be very much a contracted expectation if it's delineated properly in the specifications we have a couple of additional common scheme that have come in regarding this one of them came in from from Dean scene they've been required to furnish mock ups in the contract for construction to verify constructibility in the fenestration as well as Bradley as moment of that specifically they've been with to denote a sorry denote mock up in the contract they've been used for interior mock-ups to communicate execution quality to the trades so those are two examples that might be something people have done there we did have one request to go back for a second to the other slide so I'm gonna do that here momentarily so say if you had any questions about that or though something else you needed to write down feel free to do so while that's up we did have a note here from Dean saying agenda may be issued on a different timeline depending on use of AIA or EJ CDC which also include intent to award notice so an additional note to some of the conversation we had just had right and then Shea I hope that's been enough time let me know if you need to see it again or I can give you some information afterwards but I guess I'll advance the slides forward here and we can go to the next section right so again staying on this track of teamwork and opportunity to be successful obviously our involvement in the construction administration phase varies greatly depending on the delivery method of the work the the majority of the experience that I personally have had and that of Doug Freeman my cohort with these webinars is in the design-bid-build market where there is a single prime contractor it's the most common method that is used within our state anyway and projects are awarded on the lowest price and in this model our involvement as designers is that we are responsible for the construction administration so that we administer the construction contract for the owner during the period of construction because budgets are what they are around the country and times are difficult we in North Carolina have started to expand our horizons as far as public owned projects in the delivery method another is design negotiate build where we have created an invited list possibly for single prime contractors to bid these may be used more often in specific types of work where experience is much more important maybe in the correctional field or in some health particularly mental health fields there are state owned properties and sometimes these become as they cost of the work plus a fee where there is a guaranteed maximum price so again we as the designer are responsible for the construction administration for our clients in the construction management delivery method there are variations in that delivery whether it's construction management at risk and typically the construction manager is a contractor or whether it's construction management as an adviser where the and manager may divide the project out into different packages and manage the bidding of those packages for the owner so that there's a delivery method where it's the CM at risk or where the CM is an advisor typically the designer designs and management we may be involved more in sorry we may be involved somewhat in the construction administration of the project but typically that responsibility of construction administration really is construction management and is done by the construction manager as the advisor and they undertake many of those responsibilities I'm so glad that someone pointed out earlier the difference in construction administration and construction management they get used interchangeably and they are not at all the same and many people in our profession struggle with that difference construction management is much more a general construction project management at risk building phase involvement where construction administration is very much a administering of documents I hesitate to call it a more paper version a less hands-on version but I think that that's a rudimentary explanation of how that's different and we're observing where a construction manager is very engaged in in contracting and shopping for materials and labor and implementing with that team what is eventually taken under contract so that let's go to the next slide and I'll keep going through the various delivery that this is just one more slide and then we can take questions about this portion so North Carolina also is very interested in design-build now as another delivery method because there's an opportunity here for a one-stop shopping by the owner often the designers work but most often sorry designers work as a contractor to the general contractor so we are employed by the contractor to produce a project for the owner cost and time control or a must in scenarios where design-build is used and typically the general contractor performs the construction administration so these are methods where there's there's a history or a trust between the client and the contractor or between the whole team where in fact you three have worked together or we three have worked together before so there are opportunities where the owner mail actually do some of the construction administration in a design-build delivery method as well we haven't seen much of this in North Carolina but there's an owner build method obviously where the owner provides their own management services and overseas perhaps a designer performing CA but our role in that kind of delivery method might be greatly reduced but there's a layer of management that many owners feel like is eliminated there and this is more often the case with very sophisticated owners who have a lot of experience with the construction phase and then an integrated project delivery method where team members are engaged early in the design process before construction has ever undertaken and many of the activities and in the typical project phase or mu earlier in the process so that there is an opportunity for less coordination problems for Less changes that are calm inflated later our role in construction administration can be greatly simplified because a lot of the things that we may typically find in the construction phase are being resolved much earlier and I'll add one here last Matthew there any questions one of the things that has changed in North Carolina is we have a public-private partnership opportunity now as another delivery method where private money and funding and perhaps even land are constructed and leased by a public entity where that public entity involves occupancy of a facility for a long term period of time again because of budget shortages and different organizations this is a delivery method that's based on the need for money to be able to do what they need to do so after you're there any questions now or shall we go to our roles and responsibilities yeah there was just the one comment coming here from dialed CA as compliance with CDs oriented so let's just guess another way of looking at it from his point of view here but I'll move to the next slide sure sure so this is just a slide name and we can go to the next one and the next one after that but big and small we have to do it all and we have roles that we are supposed to fulfill as well as the other partners in this endeavor with us so I'll talk for a second about ours first as designers engineers and architects we certainly are there to represent the owner but in doing so we're expected to be fair and impartial as we represent the owner which causes many confusion but if you stick by the adage that honesty is the best policy that's another way to look at it but we are representative of the owner there to observe the project and endeavor to keep them from experiencing unacceptable or non conformant for non-compliant construction we certified we recommend and many of us don't like that word certify but it is a part of what we do in North Carolina we certify as Dean pointed out in some of the other documents each a CDC and some of the others we make recommendations rather than certifications and and those are related to pavement applications for amount of work in place or that the project is actually complete and in accordance with the contract documents which we interpret throughout the project remember it's not a set of directions on how to build it's a delivery of intent and so we have to sometimes interpret what it was that we were trying to share as a fault or an idea in the construction documents I don't personally like that myself I think that to be fair to the construction community and to be professional with our owners we ought to be able to show what we intended if we can't do it in drawings we ought to do it words and it ought to be biddable and buildable but that's just my little soapbox one of our roles is to review and decide on claims and that goes back to being on the fence and being impartial we've got to process the modifications whether those are change orders or additional information that contractors need in order to do the project properly we review some middles and we do inspections again a word that we don't like but it's what we do you can call it observe that's fine but if it moves to litigation we all almost always become inspectors we don't like it and we find it but sometimes that's just the way it ends up in our role we have limitations of authority and responsibilities and we've got documents within all these organizations that I've talked about that help us understand what those are as well as our other responsibilities and beauties so those are just a smattering of the designers roles Matthew let's take a look at the contractors I just wanted - one question here to verify is certified as listed on here essentially the same as a proof well it is in certify has a legal definition and it's a strong term but yes approved you can use that word when it comes to a pay application in North Carolina you are certifying you're promising that what the owner is paying for is actually there and in place and in conformance with the contract documents so help you good gracious so it's a it's a very definite and very serious word certified and then we have hope laws doesn't say we also have additional comment came in here from Chuck he wants to clarify architects do two inspections one that substantial completion and wanted acceptance all others are observations as exactly right that's exactly right we inspect twice well we're supposed to you're exactly right all right so we will move on to the contractors role and I'll take this time to remind you about the question we had earlier about the construction schedule and setting a realistic construction schedule yet so when we get to schedule let's talk about that so the contractor has two pages here in slides or the responsibilities and I'm keeping an eye on the clock so that we're sure we wrap up here on time so I apologize for going through these so quickly but of course it's their jobs to review the contract documents and field conditions and understand how to deliver the project in accordance with those documents and and comply with those documents and the way that they're doing that is supervising and directing the work being sure that the necessary labor and materials are there to perform the work and that they are the right materials for compliance with our specifications there they're able to be warranted they're new they're not used they're free from defects and when they're in place they're paid for taxes are paid before work started permits fees anything that's required by the contractor or pay sometimes the owner will pay some of those but typically they fall to the contractor and they're required to if we have allowances in the job pots of money to charge things against like fixing unsuitable soil that they keep those in proper order and accounted for so that they can be reconciled at the end of the job and that they monitor construction progress so let's go to the next slide and talk about that construction schedule so they're maintaining record drawings at the job and they're being sure that they are expeditious and the scheduling and implementation of the work one of the things that has always been curious to me we use a lot of time in the schedule for design and often the owner will change their mind maybe once maybe twice maybe twenty-five times but they keep the completion date the same and and I think if you have the appropriate team together and you've done the appropriate work to create a trust and a team work framework collaborative effort then you're able to say and it's not an easy conversation we've got to move this completion date particularly not easy if it's a school and they were going to finish right in time to open particularly not easy if it's a retail organization that wants to hit a shopping season or they're just interested in having cash to begin to roll into the farm or to the business but remember we're on the fence and we're supposed to be impartial speaking out for the contractor I think is really important especially early so in in my experience if if for example you're able to sit down and and this is getting to the answer to the question to me before you start the clock bring the contractor and your client together and say but let's talk about some reasonable times for you to buy this job out we understand what that means now you've got to go sign contracts with some 300 subcontractors or 50 subcontractors that's going to take a minute you've got to get some doctor humans back in your hands to get to us that's going to take some time steel drawings are not something that can be done overnight we understand you need some time to do that let me ask you can you give us a reasonable time to start the clock they gives you some legwork time to get those things pull together so maybe we start the clock thirty days from now would that be advantageous to what you have to do now in the front end of this project and let's then set a reasonable schedule so that you can move forward and so you've got every opportunity to be successful I've had that be this aha moment many many times with clients and and they get that they understand that if you involve them in the conversation and I guess one other thing about the schedule is if you have a client that's got an unreasonable schedule your your your professional enough to understand that if that client isn't willing to submit to some alteration of that then you may be pre informed of some issues you're going to have and be prepared for that you can talk to your contractor friends and understand what's a reasonable period of time for a schedule try to use that when you put your project documents together so I'll quickly say on this slide cleaning patching paying for and indemnifying us and the the owner and proceeding with forces that can get the work done on time thank you let's go to the next slide it ended up being three I see now so submitting those schedules and making payments as you're supposed to and and completing the job when you're finished so that we do our two inspections in the end of the project where it's substantially complete and finally complete and paying for everything and turning that over a lock stock and barrel with no liabilities or encumbrances to the owner with all the tests and inspections from the authorities having jurisdiction in place and completed that's all the contractor has to do now that's a joke that's a mouthful and I think in again going back to the teamwork and collaborative effort us designers us owners ought to have a full understanding and appreciation of what the contractor has to undertake in the way projects are delivered today and so I think them understanding their role us producing documents help them understand that role clearly and our clients understanding what their role is is an opportunity to be really successful so let's look at the owners role and in Matthew I'll stop and see if there's there any questions about the contractors and I'm sorry to go through that so fast and then Jim did you want to take the questions now or wait till the end well because there's only two more slides okay and we have a collection of one to the contractor bonus I had two for the owner that I've been holding off on so I'll let you go in and I'll show them at the end okay I don't have anything to do in two three o'clock today so I'll stay here as long as y'all want to so in the owners role first of all their obligation is for information and any services that might be important and it's accurate information that we need do you own the property have you got the ability to pay me is the site information solid and get this to me as soon as you can I want to know that you're insured like you should be and give me my documents and and then we can go to work so there are some assurances that are an important part of the owners role early in the project and if there are fees or if there are approvals that needed to be obtained before construction started whether they were easements or weather assessments were paid these are things that the owner needs to have taken care of clearly before the work begins and then the last slide are some of the other roles or the next slide or some of the other roles that the owner plays and several rights that they have it's Matthew you can go to the next one they have the right and they are the only ones that have the right to stop the work they can carry out the work perform work either themselves or through separate contracts if the projects not being kept clean they have the right to do that they also can occupy portions of the work if they need to do so in order to advance their opportunities and can partially occupy and use the project they also have the right to terminate a contractor for due cause if it comes to that and lastly they are certainly responsible for making timely payments to the contractor to move the project forward a paid contractor a paid contractor on time as a happy contractor and so are her subcontractors it's important part of the owners role so that's the conclusion of the responsibilities and roles as I said next month we will go deeper into those roles and that was a quick overview so Matthew all try to take home the questions great alright so the while we're on the owners I'll do those questions we had a question of the cumin at the beginning from Donald and I've been holding it and actually it was also asked again sorry by nichole yay and the question is essentially reference to the owners representative and we weren't listed on that initial diagram that we had the beginning of the presentation for the different team structure and I was wondering what their role adds to the overall team dynamic and essentially what do you think the owners rep part is within the AEC industry well I apologize for not being more clear and in the diagram those bubbles that said consultant and I will fix that before we ever do this again were intended to represent the owners rep I think more often when there's an owner's representative it's typically with a larger owner who has facilities personnel and they are the person in responsible charge who communicates back and forth with the client that's been most of my experience although there are some larger organizations that have a consultant who is an owner's rep and that's why I said consultant but you know I think their role and the way I would define it is is as the owner my experience has been they've been given the authority to make decisions perhaps they go back when it's money but and particularly if it's a large amounts of money they're changing in the contract but my experience is that they are in a direct line between the owner and the architect which is the way the information should flow to the contractor what I find is that they often have a direct line to the contractor and if that is if that communication is for example at your owners architects contractors meeting and it's out in the open certainly that sharing of information can work well I don't know if that answers the question so if I didn't please please ask again all right going through a couple of the other questions we had your then so kind of going back there was a comment here from Dean just saying one thing he's learned the hard way review some middles from subs and subs subs and suppliers before sending them on so this was a kind of a horror story there I think is probably good in the works at some point yeah a question here from Bradley does it ever make sense oh man man thank you let me arrest you for a second Dean when we get to the sub when we get to the submittals chapter I hope you'll be on that call and bring and share that horror story with us that'll be a chapter I'm not sure what it is but go ahead man great we also had questions came in here so Bradley has does it ever make sense to include a contract time allowance for change orders that's an interesting question we you know I have seen allowances for general conditions so if this contract is extended by X amount of time and typically it's a month if this is a monthly general conditions charge if we have to stay here another 30 days it's gonna cost you ten thousand dollars or three thousand dollars a day or whatever the number might be I've never seen actually the time itself but that's an interesting thought I have seen it though just be listed as overhead and general conditions call for an extension all right Dean just come in he said will do so he'll be happy to share his thing and that's gonna be unit six so we'll see him then going back to additional questions here from Michael we have can the contract or not provide a subcontractor list until he is under contract does that does not the owner have the right to review the subcontractor list before signing the initial contract that's a great question and in North care of you insane I want to be sure you know where my experience is from and it may be totally different in other states in North Carolina if you want to know as a architecture engineer whose subcontractors are you can ask for those specifically to be listed but you have to do that you have to show in the bid form and you have to call out you know electrical mechanical site you can go as deep into that as you want to to request those subcontractors and then include the verbage that you reserve the right to reject their bid that gets difficult because if they've got the lowest prior base and they are a licensed and insured and bonded contractor not accepting that bid can be very messy but you are able to require to to require them to provide you that information and if you put it in the bid documents that you reserve the right to kick that bit out and you can do that what I've also seen more often is that there will be an ad deduct alternate listed in the bid documents let's use controls systems for HVAC work so if I'm an owner that has a chain I want X company in my buildings because all the rest of them have it so you bid your job the way you're going to bid it and then I've got an alternate to get X so if I tell you I want X this is what it would cost me and the contractor has the opportunity to add money to the bid as an add in that alternate or a zero or a deed up I see it go many ways so that they are able to I mean some use that a doll from the process to try to get to be the lowest bidder because I know the owner wants it if it's listed there well right we have a three more or four more questions here can you address the lead time as a factor in the construction schedule and setting a realistic construction schedule well that's that's what i meant by getting them involved early having the contractor be at the table to talk about a start date using your contractor friends to give you some idea of what kind of time frame is reasonable for a particular project type so i don't know i don't know if that question is about something different there maybe already answered that one all right perfect and then we have does the contractor have to turn over partially completed portions of the work before the owner can occupy it to advance the owners schedule I've never taken over I've never had a client take over a partially completed portion of the work perhaps maybe storage of materials they the owner had to order and have a delivery on something that was done far earlier progress was impeded and so they took delivery of the item and the contractor allowed them to store it on the site I haven't had that kind of experience where the owner sort of forcefully took over a portion of the work that wasn't completed they push hard to get it completed so they could take it over but not not too early all right and we were wrapping up here is it better for the owner to hire the testing company well I love that question yes yes it is in North Carolina that's the requirement the owner hires and pays for the testing agencies but there are obligations on the contractors part should they for example fail tests then they pay for the retesting or improperly schedule a testing company to be on the site and they have to pay for those visits that resulted in a lack of cancelling an appointment so but but because the owner is paying for that service the results are held at arm's length and in North Carolina the belief is that they are more trusted results because that party works for the owner great and then the last question we have here at the moment another word quite a bit over time how do you integrate labor contracts that effect work stoppage issues do the labor contracts Trump owners rights to some degree I have no earthly idea I am sorry I don't know I guess that would be I wish Doug was on the line he could probably answer that Doug as an architect and an attorney I'm not sure I don't know what would Trump there I have to believe that if it's a single prime contract and the general contractor is obligated to deliver the project that would take precedent over a downline contract between that contractor and his sub I'm sure the owner would be at the table and be pulled into it but gosh I don't know for sure I'm sorry all right well it's always good when we can stump the speaker we didn't come with this came in here at the end is related to that question a horror story of the owner forcing the GC to hire the testing company and the GC hid work and their schedules from the testing guys so always some entertaining shenanigans going on in the construction industry but with that we are going to wrap up today thank you again Jim for a stain after the hour we look forward to seeing you there and remember to keep bringing your questions so that we can see if we can stump Jim again next time right on thank you everybody for sticking out the extra time I really enjoyed it thank you for being here