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all right so welcome to uh the demo day on the um eighth i think it's the eighth of january uh yeah 2021. um i i wish i could say that uh 2020 was was well behind us but it seems to uh have at least reached into these seven days for anyone who's been paying attention all right so um all right today i want to chat about the um an idea i've been working on um that i sort of had over the partial holiday that i had over december and that's the idea of a fully decentralized tokenized perpetual long contract against the price of ether um so yeah so we're going to be calling this token uh the df token for now and we'll be going into some detail as to how it actually uh ties into the fry token and just basically how it works all right so the first question is basically what is a perpetual long contract right so a perpetual long contract is essentially a long contract where you go long some security but then you through some automated mechanism provided you either buy a broker or buy an exchange or buy some other service you basically keep the collateral ratio of the long contract within a certain band um i'll when i demo the product i'll actually show some aspects of um of how the underlying parts of it work and how that's accomplished uh so the next question is do things like these already exist um yeah so as as with all things in d5 we are perpetually reinventing the decentralized wheel um but yeah so there there do actually happen to be a few perpetual long contracts already live on ethereum uh the one big thing is just that they are not they define native in terms of them being fully decentralized uh so there are some tokens from ftx available uh that actually like get managed by ftx where you can uh long and short uh different cryptocurrency tokens all right um all right so so the thing is like how how did we accomplish this right so one of the great things about d5 and i think we're going to start seeing this um increasingly is that uh we can basically just take uh what people are terming the d5 legos and sort of like put them together so um so basically the the first part of the system is uh maker dao which is the uh dio that manages uh the die stable coin so makerdale's main product is dye which it's its main goal is to track the value of a dollar right so die is supposed to always be worth one dollar right um die basically gets create but gets created by people who open what are called uh collateralized date positions or vaults um and they do this by depositing some of their uh collateral which can be ether or at bitcoins or a bunch of other tokens that the maker dial decides on by depositing that into the vault and um yeah so the maker die the maker dial system then basically tracks the value of that vault um and allows them to generate die against that collateral up to a certain ratio if they fall below that ratio then they get liquidated as long as they're above that ratio they can either pay the debt off or they can extend more data within the ratio yeah just uh just to clarify something it's the user can come with ether put that into a vault and then it's the user who then can uh generate die against that collateral just to clarify something there but go ahead yes yes it's the it's the user that that does this right so the the back-end smart contracts and the settings to that smart contract are managed by the maker dao ecosystem so they set the stability fee which is essentially the interest rate um and they decide what the interest rate on um on different collateral type should be what the debt ceilings are and basically what the process is of unwinding bad debt but the rest is all the user right so all of the rest of this stuff is user-based okay um so then basically another component that that came along after maker dao started was a project called d5 saver so defy saver initially kicked off as a method for um for people who have maker vaults to um to just have a better uh interface to it and to do certain things automatically so a lot of people who were long ether basically started opening vaults depositing ether drawing out dye and then basically buying you know more ether depositing into the vault again and then eventually d5 saver also included a feature called automation and with automation you can basically um set uh you can basically set the settings for a specific bulb as to what ratios you want to maintain of of debt versus collateral and d5 savers product will actually keep it within that within those bounds for you i think what i should do now actually quickly is just maybe show people the maker the maker dio um volt system and d5 saver what do you think logan i would say skip right to the d5 saver show the d5 saver graph and in particular that chart where the boosts and uh repayment happen that that i think is the key concept here okay cool let me do that thing quickly all right so um let me hold on let me just quickly hear screen again [Music] here all right so um get some other stuff out of the way all right so if you got a defy saver.com um defy server is a very very cool application that essentially allows you to yeah that essentially allows you to automate your to basically automate your uh debt position uh hold on for me one second please yeah so maybe just to summarize while stocks doing this unless your bank scope um well okay i'm back but i think summarize yeah so the component so far is make or dao which generates dye the way dye is always generated is a user or some external system comes and puts ether in to generate dye so then of course some users have started to come into these uh these cdp's or vaults they put ether in to get dye and then they actually just buy more ether so then they're long ether the uh risk due to doing that the main risk is that if you're not watching the cdp or the vault and and the price crashes too far then you could default and so what defy saver which uh skulk's about to show us um does is a defy explorer those are the same group right just different ui so d5 e5 saver is the actual interface and then defy explorer is the um then dbfi explorer is essentially the uh sort of a simulator in a way for you to look at what other people are doing with their cdps right so what this d5 saver system um does i mean it does a few different things but importantly for us it it basically um it it manages your cdp for you so you can be long but it will prevent you from defaulting by if the price falls it will correct me if i get this the mechanics you're wrong skulk it will uh take some ether buy die pay back some of your debt and then and then take the ether back out to basically refund the ether it's spent on doing that and then also if the if the price of ether goes up it will actually rebalance the other way so that you are sort of constantly maximally exposed so if the ether price goes up then it can generate more dye because of that so it generates the dye buys ether and redeposits it into the cdp yes that is correct that's exactly what it does so to just give you guys a a quick idea of the the um well this is obviously the interface to the back end but um so if we wanted to create a cdp here for instance uh um i'm not going to create this as this is on the mainnet unfortunately there is no destination of this to demo but basically if you went to these defy saver at the moment and you went to create vault then you'd be met with the screen you'd be asked for a collateral type you'll see that they have several different types of collateral i think most interestingly for most people would be that they have um they've got ether and they have wrapped bitcoins those are pretty much uh you know the two heavy-hitting collateral classes in uh the crypto space at the moment all right um then you'd be asked for how much collateral you want to put down so let's just say as an example we want to we want to um put down one ether there is a floor limit which is part of why i think what we've built on top of this is is going to be useful to some people there's a floor limit of 500 dies so you can't really open this if you don't have at least one ether and you can generate at least one dies worth of debt right then what they also tell you basically is that you can labor this 500 again you said one day but go ahead oh sorry not one day sorry 500 dies worth of debt right um so yeah so essentially um what we can do here you'll see if you if we mess around with these settings um essentially it tells us what our eth exposure is so our eth exposure if you if you deposit one ether um and you learn die against that ether and you redeposit it you buy more ether if we select a debt ratio of well if we select the debt of about 150 uh 1 500 here and we pretty much get um a leverage of about 2.19 right so now that's first of all that that's not really um as high as you could get on a on a centralized service but uh keep in mind here all the components of this whole thing is decentralized right so so literally the only thing coming in really from the outside world here is is the price of of ether because the dye is decentralized maker is decentralized and the automation process on top of defy saber is decentralized i would say let's move to the what what our contract does because i think without getting into that the context is is a little bit yeah okay so i just want to show the um all right so i just want to show that so this is the if you go to d5 that simulation right i'm going to say an amount like 100 ether for instance so this is a simulator simulation this is a yeah so this is a simulator of how this strategy would have performed right so so let's just say we leave it on the default settings we have here so just to explain what these are we deposit one we basically deposit one hundred thirds worth of collateral we have no starting date and we're going to run the simulation from essentially the first of april last day in march this is a little to say well i wouldn't say deceptive but it is a little misleading in the sense that if you did include march which was a very very negative month the results here do differ quite quite severely but you guys can go check this out right so i'm just going to leave it on the default settings for now right so let's say for instance we just wanted to maintain a collateral ratio of 200 in other words we have twice as much collateral as we have debt and we basically tell the system that if our collateral ratio drops below 180 then repay it back up to 200. so in other words pull out some of my collateral pay off some of my debt right um if it goes above 220 then we basically say okay well make more data go buy me more collateral and get me back up to 200 right i'm just going to hit the simulate button here okay that should have run now um all right so if we look at the simulate button here so so i'm just going to start at this uh you know i'm going to start at the bottom and work my way up here so at the bottom here we see these little green things that's every time the d5 saver automation had to kick in to actually like um change the uh to basically rebalance um the collateralized date position so that's either when it had and just uh i'll insert here as well that's where d5 saver makes its money so every time it rebalances which stock will continue to explain um they take a proportion of that of that rebalance and that's how this system uh survives yeah yeah so they they take a proportion of that i believe the proportion is zero comma three percent of the difference so if they basically had to pay off three hundred dollars then they'll they'll essentially take i think 30 cents of that 300 right and they also charge you for the fee um so in other words the fees that you get paid to uh yeah so the gas fees that you basically have to pay to um to get things working um yeah so essentially um if you look at the bottom here you'll see how the um you'll basically see how the strategy performed so we started off with 100 ether and that we run it from april to today essentially this leveraged position would be worth 640 ether right so this isn't a period of time when uh ether was rallying um you know which is why the why the strategy worked if ether was decreasing in value then we would see the same type of accelerated race to the bottom right that's part of why we're calling our token death is because if you go in the wrong direction with this thing it'll bleed you out unbelievably quickly but more accurately if you get in and the market goes in an unpleasant direction that's when yeah that's when you bleed out right [Music] exactly yeah so so the thing here is basically if you started off with 100 ether in april you would now have about 640 either so that's about a 6.4 that gives us about 60 that gives us a 64x us dollar return on investment right i mean that that is absolutely insane that is that is bonkers right now again the problem is basically if the market moves against you then um you know you're you're going to end up in a bad situation um with regards to that um all right i think move on to the death contract all right i think okay cool can you guys still see this presentation okay give me one second ah okay um all right so this is basically the stack i've dealt with the stack that this was built on all right so some of the benefits of um of this thing so what we did was can i make a suggestion here let's let's let's first summarize the the sort of the use case and and why we're doing this before talking about the benefits okay so what is the death contract in like just a couple sentences okay right so the death contract basically the df contract is a um it is a tokenization of that automated strategy right so what it allows people to do is it allows them to enter with small amounts to exit with small amounts there are some constraints to the whole idea of setting up a automated um cdp the first constraint is basically like you don't get economies of scale the smaller your cdp is your gas costs remain the same to settle it in and out right um and and if you have a small cdp of a few thousand dollars that is a significant cost that that basically um amounts to now d5 saver do go out of their way to basically make sure that those costs are under control but even then you still do better if you have a larger cdp um you know and it's aggregated with a whole bunch of other people right that's the that's the first benefit that we basically get um the second thing is i mean it simplifies it simplifies the concept right if all if all we basically say is listen this is a leveraged token um and if you are long ether if you believe that in five years time ether is going to be worth an incredible amount and you think it's worth very little at the moment relatively speaking um then this is sort of an accelerated way you know for you to basically benefit from from that kind of a move and that's essentially the two the two serious benefits to it and token makes that available to a lot more people yeah and then so i i would say that's the pitch to the user you know the the end user of this contract and then i if i can add the pitch to sort of our the fry holders our investors essentially is that the uh the the death contract charges its own fee for entry and exit so when you put ether into the death contract you get your death tokens it charges a small fee and then when you go the opposite direction it charges a small fee and uh and that fee will um and we can talk about this a bit later as well although i don't know if i want to make the demo day too long but the the the putting the mechanics aside for the moment it buys fry and increases the quality of fry so that's how foundry realizes profit from this whole uh venture so to summarize that whole strategy we're not trying to gamble as foundry we're just trying to create a casino essentially for people to gamble gamble so if we charge on the way in and the way out then people can take their chances with the the market price having said that i am a user of the death contract i think we're in a bull market so i myself am slowly putting in uh more ether into the death contract as as as the contract itself becomes more audited and things like this yeah so basically just to tie it into fry holders um what currently happens with the fee is it goes to an average title bulper um i am currently uh trying to figure out all the aspects of the gulper but essentially what the gulper will be doing is it'll take that fee that logan described so the the contract charges a zero comma nine percent fee when someone mints death and well df and when they when they redeem df right so charges on entry and exit and that zero comma nine percent fee basically goes to the permafrost for uh for foundry fire tokens now what that does is that lifts the price of fry that increases our our permanently available liquidity um you know and it's in a high fee pool which basically further grows our liquidity over time um yeah so so some of the benefits just quickly of this thing that the first thing is this contract is completely decentralized so every aspect of this thing runs in a decentralized fashion right there they're um they're once once it's in its fully final form at the moment we still have an escape hatch key um which we will uh burn once the um the audit is complete as well which will well we'll burn it but okay that it gets a little bit technical but it'll effectively be completely decentralized the other thing it's very pro-ethereum so if you are a fan of of the ethereum ecosystem uh this thing essentially keeps you as fully invasive as you can be in a decentralized fashion i think um it's very pro ether so the the token of ether you definitely have accelerated um exposure to price movement of of ether um it's pro dye and it's it's pro d5 right because it it's all the whole thing end to end is built with d5 legos right so some of the risks i do want to make clear is the first thing is the advert price movement um essentially what happens here is um if if the price of ether doubles then over some period of time you know the the price of of death would essentially quadruple but in the same in the same way in the opposite direction if the price of ether halves the price of death would essentially go down to 25 percent of um of the price you know of its price before the move yeah so that's the one risk the other the other risk is feed churning so in a market where where we're basically moving sideways um the result will basically be that um yeah that as it bounces up and down it consumes fees and that fee basically has to be taken from the collateral amount so it constantly is draining the lateral amount actually of the position um so in a in a market where it goes down or sideways you know it's definitely not in the ideal um yeah the other the other thing is i mean it's not as aggressive as a fully as a fully centralized long but i mean that that's a risk profile people can figure out for themselves another problem is basically liquidation if there is an event where the price of of ether moves more than i think about 25 or 30 in one hour which has only happened once in the history of ethereum then there is the risk of um of this underlying cdp being liquidated there's some smart contract risks if anything breaks in maker dial then this thing is at risk if anything breaks in defy server or it's automation and this thing is at risk and if anything breaks in our smart smart contracts then this thing is separate oh just a question do you have anything on yours sorry yes uh can you can you just go back and just uh explain that bit again about um when the market when eth goes up uh a hundred percent the death token goes up uh 4x or 3x 200 uh so it's accelerated um increase but it's a slow down it sounded like a slowdown decreasing the df token price is that right that that's what you said how do you mean it sounds like a slowdown no well i think what you said was that if if the price of eth goes down 50 the def token only goes down 25 was that what you said no no no no the the death token would go down to 25 percent so in other words if ether moved down fifty percent it will go down to two to twenty-five percent um okay so okay so so this is not exactly how it would pan out uh due to the fact that there's a lot of play in the um in the amount of collateral um that's available so it's not exactly going to pan out this way it's just to give you an idea of the of the order of the move so in other words if the price of um [Music] if the price of ether basically doubles then the underlying collateral to the death contract would likely also double but because the underlying collateral has doubled and because the price has doubled the price of the death token is now essentially four times higher than it was before that move conversely okay i didn't understand when you said down to 25 i i took it that you meant that it would drop by 25 which didn't make sense but what you're saying now is exactly the way i understand it so it's an accelerated uh move in both directions 100 gotcha thank you exactly yeah so it that's kind of why i've decided to to run with named df because um it it should make it obvious that there are some economic risks to this thing but you keep saying df we gotta just call it death i'm telling you well okay then the ethic contract yes okay more fun to talk about yeah we're almost out of time for this thing so i very quickly want to just get into the um to the actual like demoing of the smart contract um all right give me one second i'm gonna share again now just want to open up that back end i'll talk a bit more about scoff setting that up so the this project we're working on doesn't actually need an interface uh like most of our other projects because what we're expecting to happen is as we launch this uh whales that are used to arbitraging we'll know how to use a smart contract and then they can actually generate the death by putting in their own ether and then and then in fact move that token to dexes like uni swap and then just sell the the token on uni swap so that's uh that's how we can push this out relatively quickly we're still waiting on the audit though that seems to that's going to be i think the main hold up at this point uh yes yes the audit is the uh yeah so so we have an auditor looking at the code at the moment um he did come back to us and say that like the the preliminary view of the layer we built doesn't have any obvious problems but there are some deeper issues that he needs to inspect in that regard and he is to be clear there's not deeper issues he needs to look deeper in the stack four issues just to be clear yeah he needs to inspect the issues more deeply that could be there so so that's kind of like where we are with the situation at the moment okay so i will share this in the um in the show notes as well this link but essentially if you go to the um if you go to our contract um well like i said please don't just randomly go to a uh i think called levered ether on on uniscan on etherscan uniscan see too many of these names are now melding into one in my brain all right um if you go to the contract um and you click on the contract part you click on the right contract piece if you scroll down a bit you will see an aptly named function called squander my eth for worthless beans right and what the squander my east for worthless beans contract does let me just make sure i'm connected to something that has some ether in it okay um i am going to actually and this is real so i am going to mint some real death tokens for myself on my net uh let's just copy that um okay so so basically this contract already or this address already has some death tokens in it uh let's just have a look there exactly how many it is all right so it currently has three point four three four death tokens so i'm going to mint one e thirds worth of death tokens so while this mines i'll just quickly um describe what you're doing 0.1 ether i'm guessing that was intentional oh sorry yes i'm going to do 0.1 ether all right so um so basically while this mine is going to describe what this is doing in the background so this now takes my one ether sorry my point one ether it takes my point one ether it determines how much of the um of the excess collateral in the cdp would point one ether account for and then it issues me proportionally that amount of death tokens right so for instance let's say there was um there was a hundred outstanding death tokens um and there was an ether underlying then if i add 0.1 um ether to that collateral pool free as free collateral just to keep yeah that's three collateral yeah um as free collateral then i'll essentially um [Music] yeah then i should get because i'm adding one percent i should get one death token out let's just actually look at this god mind all right so um okay so if we just inspect this for those of you understand how how this stuff works we'll actually just see here that the tokens transferred we'll see that okay well some some ether got transferred so 0.0991 0.0 0.2 ether actually got transferred into the um maker system and what got transferred out back to my address was 0.929 death tokens so let's see if those actually got it signed man you're really having trouble with those uh digits there skulk what did i say zero point it's fine you said 0.9 0.09 but uh normally sorry normally my my excuse for lingual problems is that english is my second language but this is math so i don't know why i'd get it's wrong um okay so it's all right so you'll see that that i now have received a little bit of extra of the death tokens and just a note just a note on that real quick if you're going to do this yourself you will have to manually add the token to track it in meta mask so um we can help you out with that but just just so you don't freak out when you see that there's nothing showing up in metamask you just have to tell metamask to track a custom token i think what we will do though is just write a very very minimal interface to add the token to your uh you know to your meta mosque and to just mint and burn i think that might be something small but that's a little bit down the line our initial plan for this is to launch it by unique swap okay um all right now to redeem some tokens now i am going to redeem uh exactly one death token i'm just going to select 18 decimal point here and just make sure that i send the redeemed ether to my own account confirm that you might notice the gas view is pretty exorbitant yeah the gas is pretty exorbitant right so you by the way there's no front running risk on um on participating in this contract so if you want to set the gas very very low that's perfect that's no problem it will um it'll process when it's ready and it'll give you a fair fair fair amount of f tokens and you can't be front run all right so let's go view this transaction all right still mining that's a that's a steep gas price right there so part of the reason why we believe this is a uh a good product idea is just that it um as as high as these gas costs might seem the gas costs for actually um opening automating and um and closing your uh positions on uh maker dow are actually like considerably higher like for instance at about similar gas costs on monday morning i paid 541 dollars to close a specific position okay cool um all right so so essentially um okay so that transaction that we just saw that concluded here and you'll actually see that my one death token does now that's the other one that's the first one that's not the exit is it yeah it is it just okay right yeah yeah so so you'll see here that there was exactly one death token that got burnt um that's just what that that log indicates and then there was a zero point or 1.066 ether that it was redeemed for um yeah and just fyi when i launched this contract it launched that exactly well it actually launched at 0.991 ether per death so this is basically due to the little rally that we um that we had right so uh the returns obviously the um you know will depend quite heavily on when you join and when you exit and i'd say probably one of the best times to mint death is right after a serious correction uh in a bull market and one of the best times to redeem death is right after a massive rally um you know uh yeah um seems to be correcting all right so guys any questions at this point uh so so you were saying that the whales would just come and make use of this contract so they would um take out your tokens and put on uni swap when they will be just earning the earning the fees all right and and as a end user like if i want to uh go into like a leveraged long uh ifa position now i would go to uni swap and buy and swap for these tokens right yeah so as an end user the idea is that this is just another token purchase for you you don't care about the cost yes yes but the the the value or the value proposition is that this token is is leveraged against uh ether mathematically yeah okay cool um i want to ask so this uh this tokenizes your cdp right uh and it automates it and tokenizes it yes yeah the later the layer we add tokenizes it yeah that tokenizes one particular cdp so and then the parameters are chosen by you like like how how much like what percentage and stuff that's already chosen yeah so the the parameters at the moment are if um yeah so the parameters at the moment are 170 if it falls below 170 it gets repaid up to um 185 and if it rises above uh 200 percent it gets paid back down to 175 that's the um yeah and it's a and it's a type a vault the e type b volts unfortunately at the moment can't issue more die until there's a vote by maker but what what the thinking is is that this specific the death contract what we'll do with it is we'll basically um we'll run it we'll test it we'll see how it operates what it does and stuff and then um and then if if we see that there's like clear demand for it or at least even moderate demand for it i will probably make it so that um so that you sort of can make a factory where somebody can create their own tdp and then um and then essentially through the factory have their tdp automated and then tokenized right and then maybe even automatically listed on an amm so so for instance james if if you had a more aggressive set of settings that you feel would perform better then you could make uh james death for instance and um you know and then essentially issue that as a as a token and then again you know what else can orbit wells can do the same type of arbitrage we suspect will will happen in the first version of the token um we haven't quite sussed out all the details of how we'll do that going forward but but that's kind of like the longer term uh direction we're thinking in right yeah so just to so this is just like an mvp essentially where we hard coded some of the things just to see if the base idea itself has demand once it's hard to do everything so the factory concept you mentioned so i would imagine like having like a two-dimensional token like you know the the dev token but for another cdb and yet for another cdp so it's like a two dimensional thing but this is not uh possible in ethereum right so one would have to essentially just copy and paste your code to to to their automated cdp in order to tokenize their um the cdp right well we would make it a lot more convenient basically um you know they they'd be running it out of uh i cannot say sort of out of order the code but maybe i don't quite understand the question or the objection correctly then yeah so you know what if they you make a garden of cdps with different parameters and and in ethereum there's no way to um have all of these tokenized tokens under the same name right well now you can i i think i have a good um good response to this so the the why earn i think is a great example of what we might see happen with with the the d eth contract so you have wire and then you have y die and i think i don't actually know how many other ones there are but they came to this convention where when you have a token and you put a y in front of it it indicates a particular kind of d5 mechanism um and i'm actually not sure what that mechanism is i haven't dug into it but i suspect something similar with the with the d could happen here so you'd have d and d btc um and then uh no that doesn't i don't think that quite answers your question because i think you're asking more specifically what if there's 20 death contracts and they each have different parameters um it's hard to see how that will play out what standards emerge uh but there's not really a technic a problem at a technical level ether scan can have as many tokens that call themselves death as they'd like um and then i suppose we would just have to kind of in real time address any confusion that arises and kind of make it up as we go as far as standards and aiming does that help answer the question yeah sure so yeah i think so that means there's no um standard or automated way to do it so it's like the stock market if you have 10 funds from the same company you might expect a similar stock symbol or something like that well the thing is i mean it depends on what you uh what what part of the exposure you want because the thing is we can we can issue multiple of these derivatives at different settings but if you want exposure to people getting in and out of to the if you want positive exposure to the demand of um of these kinds of derivatives i would say the simplest is just to buy fry because essentially in that regard you will um you know you'll basically be partaking in the the fee and the value accumulation of the uh decentralized tokens right so in other words that the fried token are are you aware that we have a we have a well we're building at the ao and that we have a token uh yeah i i uh took out some fry with that uh like i ico contract i wasn't sure you know how so so now you are building value on top of that token tokens yeah so we're building several products on top of it yeah and as so the best way to uh to describe that whole sort of conglomeration of con concepts so we are team toast we're a very small group our main main goal is foundry which of course has to fry token and things like smoke signal and this death contract when we work on it we we basically say well is there can this make money for foundry and fry holders somehow which ultimately is the question can it take a profit and send a profit back to the treasury or can it buy fry and sort of limit the supply and if yes then we work on it um and so this death contract is just another example of that and then one day to finish all up we'll have to build governance which we hope to have done by the end of the initial sale in february 2022. okay that's very cool thank you any other questions any other questions now does anybody else have anything else i don't think so i think it's um i think that's it i don't see anything else in the chat either okay all right well um yeah so lots of anyone who's interested um i can add you to just bring me basically um privately and i can add you to the little uh death group that we have just for this um initial sort of beta version death group the death group you know where all the cool kids hang out and then i can include you there um i think our next steps now is um yeah we are going to have a little bit of a discussion there about um how safe we feel the contract is and if we can open up a um a uni-swap pool for it yet um yeah and then yeah just have some discussions about how maybe how maybe they start off like like very limited trade on the thing as it as it is now so yeah that's that's it for demo day today guys yeah and i think as far as a timeline sort of estimate as far as i understand skull things should be pretty developed by by early next week right we should have some more information on the audit and you should have the gulper and some other some of those related solutions pretty much sorted by early next week is would you agree with that uh yeah yeah i think that's reasonable okay cool all righty okay well i think we can end it here then thanks very much everyone okay thanks guys cheers