Email Signature Dog Shot Record Made Easy

Email signature dog shot record

welcome back to the music marketing podcast today we've got two really cool guests on if you guys want to introduce yourselves hello everyone my name's Maura mm-hmm and I've got yeah Mr I work virgin my records in the artist content creative team mm-hmm so you're both in that team yeah yeah both one in the same cool slightly more handsome version great I mean I think our audience will probably love this because we talk about content and non-stop we literally force it on them so be really good to us or get bit of understanding when your backgrounds where you started and kind of how you got your jobs in where you're at now okay John ago first and my story kind of amazing and I studied music University thought I want to be a singer found out that wasn't very good so I had to find other means of making money and basically just when I was at uni I there was always like nights which need need posters or friends that needed photoshoots done or my own bands or projects that needed logos and artwork and so throughout that process you start making things for other people realizing I could charge people for it and so life University thinking not having a job and thinking this worked for a minute and then applied to every label under the Sun for that internship no one had a look at me and then I spoke to a friend who was working at Sony records it's him and he was just like you're a graphic designer why is your CV so boring like why is it just a piece of white paper the text in it and as a good point and so I made it bright red stuck a picture of my face on it and like some nice on so that was it that was it and just yeah I just made it really playful and literally that the deer handed it in I got a call from Universal he tried being like we think you're perfect for this role and went flew down to London like the next day I was in Edinburgh a time free dental and the next day it went for the interview and then the kind of rest was history so I did the internship and and then six it was actually digital internship so it was that making like advertising banners and social media banners and it was like it wasn't really that sexy graphic design stuff that I kind of aspire to do and so still doing that in the say and but there was like through that with there was opportunities to make things for artists when there was no budget or whatever and then just grew grew the role and and sort of grew into being sort of creative in the team and then the the buzzword being content and everyone realizing that it's a necessity in artist campaigns we just grew the grid team out and that's kind of where and Meryl came into it I was able to expand the team and a friend of mine at the label or a colleague of mine I should say and showed me his Instagram and and it was some incredible work and I was like my boss had always told me hire someone that's better than you so I was like I can do that so so Meryl also at the same time was harassing me on social media being like and so you know he was seeking information out of me and then kind of led to me offering you a job yeah it's kind of it was a very kind of organic exchange in a sense that I started in Rito working in retail but so I did a traditional route I went to uni did graphic design got my degree and was almost like what I do with this now and then at the time I kind of just became very complacent with what I had and not really knowing what to do with the skills that I had so I kind of stayed in retail for a while and my kind of ambition for wanting to be a creative kind of just lay dormant for a long time and at while you're still in retail and your friends always tell you oh you should go and pursue this you do this why are you here kind of thing but to be completely honest with you I didn't have the I didn't have the kind of the energy that I needed and at the time to possess to believe in what I could do but I knew what my skills were but because I hadn't used it for so long it was like you might know you might think that I'm great at doing this but am I really like who's gonna want me at this time and then eventually it was kind of need to take the initiative to try and be better and not for anyone else just be better in general it was always graphic design for you it was but it was always graphic design never I never knew I was gonna be music like yeah it was really weird even just being here was really and then eventually I kind of stumbled onto the music because I started animating album artworks okay which I had been doing for a long long time putting it on tumblr it wasn't getting any any notice I was getting like two or three days yeah two or three shares here in there but because I was doing it for me I wasn't precious about how many people were seeing it and then I kind of went Instagram started happening and I start to get the hang of like this might be something here so instead of a selfie hearing man I then just started putting up work and no one been at the time was still really looking into it and then eventually I did one for Drake not because need permission me I just wanted to do it I liked the album I thought I'm gonna go for it was for the more life album at a time and then the day after I just saw a notification on my phone Drake had posted it and full from then it was like like the phone was going berserk I think my battery would probably write 70 to 30 so yeah and that's how loads of other industry folks started to seeing it from over here from international international labels and that's how our colleague at work saw it and passed it on to Rory and then we just we just got to chatting and I saw the opportunity I was like this guy's in a label I'm talking to him now I'm like look I'd love to come and see you I've got some great ideas probably building at the time but I'm taking this I'm just gonna run with it and then when it was the time to come and see worried I had already loads of work to prove that I was capable of doing content or being a creative and I think the first time we actually met you there was no job there they got on my part I met him wasn't expanding had always asked more headcount but but it wasn't until probably three months and you just kept you just kept in my address book in my emails and and I knew straight and you when something came up that I would go tomorrow I didn't and like my boss goes don't interview anyone else was that I don't need it was a massive blessing I'm very grateful for it but just like because of the whole thing the Drake thing happened I didn't just get excited by it and then I did nothing that was like it so much fuel in a fire yeah and then I was getting commissioned from jobs here in there like real work for real artists like big artists across the world and I think that helps kind of to be confident enough to be like if I've got a short at virgin or elsewhere I'm just going to take it that was a turning point yeah I think it's an important one that even artists have where they say is it worth doing free stuff for exposure and it's like in any career you're in yeah it leads to opportunities like this you have to always have to know your worth to a point where you should charge and if people ask you for free work when you're at a level where you should be charging obviously offensive but it shows that if you actually put in the work and just like this thing with that as well you know the amount of times and graphic sound is probably one of the most common industries where it's they all do this and it will help your portfolio or photography or anything like that and certainly in creative industries and it's like um I do agree that if you have a passion for the thing that it the thing in question do it for free like you know if they have no money and you're excited by the project do it like and it's not time isn't you've got some time I'm sure I'm sure he's like the amount of time or love Islands started save that time watching love island you know and and spend an hour a day working on something for free or something that excites you that's passionate and so yeah I think you can do things for free and then but then you get to a level and you shouldn't stop like just because you're the best designer in the world or the best musician in the world and someone asked you about something important or something that you could have a valuable input in - for free you make money elsewhere your story just so often in terms of everyone wants a job at a major label and they go through the application process they don't get invited in and we speak to a lot of people who work there and they go kind of it was just coincidence that it happened to know someone they did something and I was gonna say this question for later but it's such a big question you have touched on it what advice do you have out there for graphic designers and people who want jobs at labels who actually want to get in then get their foot in the door I think is have that ambition to want to do that anyway but don't just kind of think that there's only one traditional route for you to go to like for Rory it happened at the time when Instagram probably wasn't popping so for him to get his foot in the door was to make a creative CV and actually like hand someone something whereas now when we look in for freelancers that we want to Commission to do either outdoor artworks animations or TV ads whatever they may be we're not just looking for big massive follower followers I have like a million followers and you're gonna charge us X amount like it might be someone who's got 150 followers but their work is just phenomenal we will find you and it's kind of like on this side of the fence you might be people watching this might be like yeah but you say that but really we do like my histogram is full of people that have no idea I'm either following them or I've saved their work onto my board and I'm just waiting for the right project then you've got every single artist Under the Sun DMing you not knowing that you actually graphic designers you're not the ones that are gonna sign it which is fair because if they don't know that's why platform like yours is so important because it just gives insight in every direction I advise in terms of like those that you know I had a very traditional route of like how I got into music industry like I handed a CV and a hey charge someone in HR I thought it looked good and then passed it through you know their ranks and a lot of the jobs and music industries are acquired through knowing stuff as you say it's like it's knowing someone to help get that CV in front of someone above that HR person and because the hatred people receive so many so many CDs but my thing is is similar to marrows in the sense of most jobs in music industry you can do without having to work a record label as in like yeah I could do design covers for but you know not being assigned to are aligned with very much I could I could design record covers for any of my friends or artists that are you know Spotify anyone can upload anything to you know you can create artwork similar for marketing that you can market and it doesn't have to be friends it can be that you can go down to see a gig Alfa an unknown artist that's unsigned whatever and go do you have anyone doing your marketing or do you have anyone like promoting you or like helping you get gigs or managing your whatever all these jobs that are in with a record using industry like you can do sure when you're at a record label you get you get given a roster and you get given jobs but actually you can you can do all of it before that and then I'll help you get your foot in the door when you when you go for the interview and you have this in there like oh you're doing already so you kind of doing this job I guess yeah yeah Drake wasn't a client for you first what you did yeah yeah for sure exactly so I knew that he could do the job prior to that I didn't have to then interview him and put him through some like jump through hoops to prove that could do the job because he was already doing the job and then I just needed his skills and it's a similar thing effect there are so many people that want to work in industry but there's also at the source of some crazy stat of like there's five hundred thousand songs uploaded to spot for every month there's a lot of people that need art work that need marketing that need help with social media that need help with all of that you know our roster is how many are sorry there's like 200 maybe I don't know I don't know but they say this to national we were one of the biggest labels in the UK and that's a lot of people but there is another eight labels in the or there's more than eight but like you know there's the major labels there's the the indie labels and then there's people just doing it themselves um so I think I think you can do it you don't have to have the sort of email signature saying I work for a major record label to be able to do this stuff in the music industry so what is the everyday job then what are you doing for these artists because a lot of people probably think it's art work and that's you done what's the everyday job for you guys I mean every day can be as little as sitting through meetings to think of great ideas and try to be innovative about how you're gonna put these ideas to practice or it can be from making outdoor posters to sell the product and to communicate what is that you want to reach out to people it could be as big as thinking what we're gonna do overseas to engage more fans and it could be digital activations but a lot of what we do is very collaborative across all the different departments whether it be promo press or marketing it's very much how can they get the most out of us to kind of shine light on on that particular artist on that particular campaign so yeah it can be it can be a very about things a lot of people think I just sit there and I just anime stuff which to me a kind of you're hurt it's like I wish don't bother me today today I animate every once in a while now that I'm fortunate enough to kind of know about how the industry works and be more comfortable within the team and the wider team to kind of Commission someone else do it or oversee your project or brief it out really well so someone else can do and then you just come in and out when you're when you're needed yeah so it's a very collaborative effort and I think the key there is that it varies artists project by artist you know and what Mara and I will do is help an artist feel more comfortable though being creative and you know if they don't have a creative arm helping them find what that is and helping them find what that looks like and that's a big part of our job is just like helping express creativity in a visual sense you know not a musical sense and and so it's like it comes like a lot of the time it boils down to social media because that is the the quickest and the most instant thing for people to be creative because you can take a photo and publish it and have five thousand likes and five minutes or whatever it may be and so it does start with that with a lot of projects but then it can be as grand as you know designing and developing the album artwork for you know some of our favorite artists which is like humbling to say like we're working on you know some of these huge artists and and creating the fit like the first thing that Mara and I ever did physically together was the lower corner album this year oh sorry last year you know and it was the first time we had her name and print together and that was like a big deal for us like because that you know we collaborate all the time and and we make digital things and things that no one ever see and all that kind of thing but for the first time to have like her name written artwork by Roger and Meryl Burgess was pretty cool so but then but then it can be like I can work on an artist project and never make anything physical like never design anything and it's literally you just holding their hands and helping them helping them express themselves or finding connecting them someone else there's a better designer or creative than us so it's about kind of like you know as Mara says connecting the dots and and collaboration and like thinking outside the box a bit of like how can we do this differently or or seeing where it's been done better before and taking elements of that is what to name a few artists that you've worked with others units you sent extensively impressive you wanna just have a full license to bragging and tell us all the all the big ones yeah so in terms of like designing like album covers and I was a part in Luce Capaldi album which was pretty successful last year and Maura and I did the loyal' album last year as well I did Royals first album - and alongside sort of some excellent photographers outside - got Villette who shot the em loose Capaldi won a loyals girlfriend shot the last and his last album cover and and so yes that's part of it as well as it's like collaborating with other creatives that are not within Virginia and you know they're far superior photographers than I am so and what else have I worked on a while at metemma you know actually I do like this sort of digital advertising side of things for Florence Machine Bastille and Ashley Luce is one that's really close to me he really lets me sort of flex my creative muscles and he like in trust me and Meryl now works on it we will work on a lot of things there by side now and because our skills are so different Merritt Merrill is is got his lane and this stuff that he sees and is inspired by is completed for mine so it's always good to like have both both sides of that and then we can meet in the middle of some house so HG is an exciting one and that's I mean there's more viable for you are I think for me is I get a lot of joy out of working with your developing artists as well as much as the big ones and also just to touch base on like the stuff that Rory said about SG in the laws and the Lewis Capaldi's like for me to see someone that I work with on a daily basis and admire and I appreciate what they do to be able to see him grafting hours and hours and hours and then to see the final products like all the way across the world and seen it at festivals I remember we had a moment we had a moment at Gloucester where we were watching Lewis Capaldi play well we started we started off backstage kind of we were supposed to like this interview piece so we kind of just got a peep to look out to see how it was like because I had never seen it I didn't care about Louis karate I wanted to see how it looks back from his view how are you looking out which was insane and then we went into the crowd to kind of really take him where it is to experience it and then it was just about a massive logo Lewis Capaldi like up on the screen I was just watching roaring roar II was kind of just looking up at it and I don't think I mentioned it but it was like me watching him seeing what he had created even it could be just like manipulate in some pixels that had like a tiny bit to play in the in the grand scheme of what is to be Lewis Capaldi like that's amazing like for me to see that I'm like next time Glasgow comes around I want something to be like I did that kind of thing so seeing someone else just smash it where it be worried would be someone in in the promo team or in the marketing team seeing them kind of graft on a day to day and then seeing it finalized in real world that just makes me feel like I want to do something really cool as well but in general last year what took up quite a bit of my time was very very very rewarding was the Krept and Konan campaign for revenge is sweet and that was the first time that had really kind of groaned the confidence and the the know-how and gained the trust over the two years or so that I've been at virgin to kind of let people kind of come to me to kind of lead ship in terms of realizing the vision that the boys created for that whole campaign for that whole album and so like Rory said it was kind of bringing the right people to get the right jobs done seems things that they could do much better than I could and in this sense it was collaborating with a photographer called fool Maui who's absolutely incredible based from here in the UK how come he didn't put my name on the album so yeah that was literally from making a set build working for incredible people so it was a lot less of a digital LED artwork it was more like we had to build the set we had to make the props we had to work for an incredible graphic designer Aidan and to work on the sweet designs we had to like lighting people's like a massive massive massive undertaking and it's kind of seeing it happen and roll out and how fans were reacting to the artwork and that was the first time I've got like I'm actually doing what I wanted to do many many many years ago and it's taken this long but it was all the more rewarding so coming almost like when they did the show at the o2 and seeing the artwork visualized in a real set that cost thousands of thousands of pounds I didn't make this it but it was little sprinkles of everything that everyone had made like to see it in a room like that to go to the O to for me was like I think that is key you as well like you know saying you can change one pixel or write one email or have one idea that like we constantly have brainstorm for ideas and there'll be someone that sat in that room that might not work in the project and therefore won't get credit for that idea further down the line but they were the person that birthed that idea and it's like you can influence something and it's like so rewarding knowing that you had that tiniest bit of and like the label there's like probably 90 people there and and so there's troops of people all collaborating and coming together to help one artists project office Lee you work in lots of different things but you know an artist project has teams of 10 upwards people at all they all fight in your corner and try to think up how we can make it work for you and if they can constantly adapt and constantly being fluid of being like well that's working so let's keep doing more that way how closely with the artist do you work do you sit down with them and have a full meeting where you're talking about like the overall approach to the release is is that how close you work with them on earth I mean it depends on the artists closer we got our international Ross as well where we don't get that much face time value even if they signed domestically to us so it's sometimes it can be more challenging but not impossible or it can be like I work with Harvey he was just in the office tracery right now over my shoulder looking at our work I'm like ah so it can be as simple as him coming in we're sharing ideas and like worry touch based on earlier it's kind of building the trust with the art is the kind of how am I gonna help you literally visualize what you've got tapped into you but musically I can do nothing for you I can appreciate your art I can do nothing for you I love to try but I can't but visually I can try my very best and we're quite successful at making them realize what it is that they want to put out so whether it be we go to the shoe Joe and sometimes we're not even making anything it can just be like what we're having our conversation about whatever your interesting games I love games we talk about games talk about films but it's the trust that you make along the process that makes that final hurdle of actually making whatever it is you're going for that makes it a bit easier I think sharing is key as well to that of like and sort of gateway we always want open with our artist is like we saw show them something cool and their and and get their reaction and sometimes they'll go I'm not sure about that or sometimes they'll be amazed by it and I've never seen anything like it before but then that just opens the gateway for them to share stuff with us and then we then have a better understanding because that's key of like I always say I'm not the best designer in the world at all there's there's far superior creatives and but what I'm good at is kind of understanding people and and like conversating and getting to know what they like and dislike and like putting them in situations that help them like nurture them to be creative and some people work amazingly in big groups of people and then like it was a loyal album I knew that I just he wouldn't work well in an office environment so we just came around my house and we just looked at tons of books like type books photo books all that kind of thing and it was just like he just picked out things from that and it was just really comfort like comfortable home environment and and you've just got adapt for for which artists work some artists would love to go to like a gallery and be inspired by other people or whatever it may be so I think the biggest part of our job whilst it's whilst we are creators it's it's it's coming up with some it's making is understanding artists and making them feel comfortable and how much control do they have over it because artists of people that want have control over everything love the control freaks is in like that's their their product being put out to the world do they have the control where they say I don't like that or is it more kind of the labels like no this will work now they have control they now they do and I think it's wonderful that they do I think it might have been very different and a few years ago or maybe ten years ago but but now the artist has the power the art is you know and I'm to write so they should we try educate and help and and give advice from our use of expertise and and but take it and that's what that's what my thing it has to be built with trust we can't just go this is the right thing to do and then go but I think this is the right thing to do so obviously I'm gonna go with my band you know I've I've lived with this for they've been the artist longer than we have and so the more you spend time with it they begin to like I don't remember the one of my greatest moments loose power they or he doesn't know this but my personal greatest moment was when and he entrusted me to like to write some copy for him because he knew by that point and I could I could help you know I knew what he was trying to say so we were like working like subtitles or something and he was like no I trust you you you like like we can adapt it but that was the first time I was that I just actually trust me something so small but was like you know he was letting me speak him back I don't speak on behalf of and he like he he then goes no it needs to be this but even that just that glimmer of trust to go you understand now what I'm what who I am and what I'm trying to say and well is a lot and and it takes art is different different let's get there you answered that cuz in our comments section we get so many artists saying don't sign to a label you lose all creative control okay you're kind of proving that retain that's why I learned at university I you know I went to study music to be a singer and I had this horrible idea of labels and like a good friend like my best friend is now a musician and I remember when we were first chatting he was out I don't want to st. a major record label like and like you you lose all control they like to take you for a run but but we want we want you to be the better like your your the product you you know yourself best and we want you to be the best version of yourself we do want to amplify that and like we will we'll have signed you because you're doing something that we like the look of we won't have sent you cuz we're like they're a blank canvas we can do anything we want with them like this let it's too difficult to do that now you know you can no longer manufacture like pop artists or bands or things like that you know and one direction was probably the the last successful version of that or were and and so that doesn't happen anymore people want real they want and so the artists needs to be themselves and we just need to let dial that up and help them express themselves the best they can a lot of the thought behind people thinking that that was the case even if they do now or before I think it's worth remembering that the people that work inside those label walls where fads like we literally are fans too so for me being able to work on artists that I listen to on a daily basis or go to your gigs like it doesn't matter I don't listen to your go to your gigs or buy into who you are because I work at a major label I'm a fan of music in general so for me to be able to work on for example when Darko decided to come on board and work with us on the gangsta track the track was already doing crazy things before we even got near it and the day she came in to to sign with us I literally said I was like yesterday I didn't know she was coming in I said yesterday I was in the gym just play play in your music and kind of just vibe in out and now you're here and we get to do amazing stuff together and she was like let's go and let's go just go and do it so we're not like these label robots are trying to no it's literally we're blessed to be able to do what we love listen to the music that we love and kind of just do cool stuff yeah that's the funny thing that I always laugh at like that idea because it is it is is it kind of misconception and it's like we want to make really cool things like I would like to think that you know my legacy is is you look back and go oh that's that's cool you know we don't want to just go oh he's a sellout so it is a weird thing that that that misconception exists but I understand where it came from I think that was sort of the music industry of the past yeah which aspects do you actually work on then so you do all the design you do all the artwork kind of you've you've mentioned so many different things from the festivals to like could you just take us through a quick list of the things that you she touched on in an artist's career in the areas where it can be an it's like it can be like lyric videos photos for use in like legit just for use for social media or photos for artwork or it can be it can be creating like advertising assets so you know the the posters you see on the street or the or the average you get served on Instagram or and it can be that it can be I'm trying to think if that means the list it genuinely is like what what do you need created we're kind of the only team and only about the that creates things so like the other the other team the other teams will um sort of strategize and find and find the people to do the job but will create will create the content so it will be the ones that make the poster so they you know they and and they they will tell us we need to advertise this thing to this audience and then collaboratively will go alright well the best way to do this is by making it blue the past few years have you had to swap out a better understanding of social media because if you're working on ads you obviously have to think okay I'm creating the visuals for this how is this going to reach the target audience and then impact them in a way that posters say don't if you have sort of kind of teach yourselves that in a way yes it's a lot of it is or the early days was trial in error when it became more of like a digital focus first thing but now because most people are Instagram savvy so it's almost like we can't we use Instagram whether it was it will be for music industry or not so you kind of know what works you know what doesn't you know what gets engagement you know what kind of doesn't so it's like you said knowing your target audience so something that might work for Luis Capaldi on the Instagram might not do as well on another platform so it's when the marketing team need a particular type of asset it's kind of down to us the kind of with them kind of crafted the right asset for the right platform so it's not case of just churning out stuff putting it out because it might not work for a Harvey it might not work for a best deal so it's kind of like created for purpose that particular list yeah sorry you can ask Oh what does work so I know this is a really broad question cuz artist artist to artist but do you have any tips for emerging artists when they're just like I don't know how to create a brand I don't know how to create engagement I call a palette simple things like that yeah like I think that that really can say aesthetic and sort of brand is falling away a bit because of people's access to you know it's just real life now so I think the important thing is to create yourself and like you know give people a version of yourself that is true to you and that is in you know everyone's interesting and it's just finding the things about yourself that are interesting and that's more the brand now it doesn't like I don't see so much there's there's certain artists where this is not the case in there certain artists that like are creatively and aesthetically like just genius and that is their brand you know you look at the chemical brothers and like their visuals and their live fissures are just incredible and it's like that you know you go to a gig for the music but also just to see that incredible show and whereas I think with so many sort of popular artists at the moment is about their personality it's about who they are as like a musician but as your friend at the weekend and the part you know so I don't think I would necessarily give advice on like how to select color palette I think I think be brave and do what you want to do but but don't like do something because you think it's cool do something because it's actually the better version of you and it's like if you always wear black always that's fine but I don't feel they don't force yourself to be something because you think that that's gonna get the most likes or whatever it's like and actually you and there's so much information available of like as you said there is no right there's no right answer to that because what works for marrows Instagram is completed and from mine which will be different for the biggest artists in the world - like loose crowd we were talking about it the other day he's like I've got like the anti Instagram like if I post like a nice picture of me it gets like no lakes but I'll post like a selfie of me up here and it will get L go through the roof so it's just like these these sort of platforms are so tailored to your page my my Instagram is kind of anti as well because I'd do a lot of like text but like stuff but like historically on Instagram technically stuff it was terrible because people think it's the advertising or posters or something that but my audience liked it so whenever I post like a picture I haven't reversed a picture of me and it's no I'm never posted one again so so yeah I don't think there is a right answer for a fake like how to do it like educate yourself be inspired by lots different things they look at Pinterest go to exhibitions and allow other artists but like don't just look artist and your lane like borrow from other ones cuz then no one can go oh you copy that person because they'll never join the dots through there like because of what Louis has done this is now era of everyone trying to be funny for one but also going down this kind of raw route which isn't sometimes fitting to their brand but do you think that Instagram is going down that route a little bit of everyone being a bit more honest and raw or do you think it's just Louis I mean he is a gem as in as in he is actually funny so again it comes back to that that thing of like don't be something you're not don't try be funny cuz you think that's what works if you haven't got the capacity to be funny because people will see through that and they will choose to watch the funny person over you and whereas it actually if you can be really motivational people will watch that because you're because you're actually you motivate others or so it's finding that thing that is true to you and it's like with the the funny thing you'll struggle to dial up something that you don't have like you should struggle to like it all hit a ceiling and then you're like well this goes nowhere and the thing with Lewis is that he's just really fluid and adaptive of like he's funny but his nose when his joke get old and he'll then go into a new joke so it's like passive thing is changing all the time I think that Mara and I used to have to always do like you know swipe outs were like hey listen to man use track on Apple music or Spotify or wherever is and he used to just be like selfie style and those used to engage really well because it was like a shock to the system because people were so used to seeing really polished adverts and and they were like just obviously an advertisement and then and then people start of conned on to actually it's better if you do something loaf I and it feels really personal itself estelle but now people are used to that we're having to change again and we're gonna and so they'll be a process and someone will unlock something new and the rest of industry will follow it and there so it's like don't be too far behind that's my only advice of like either be the person that finds that new thing which is great we all want that or or follow quickly like be aware be like super super aware of what other people are doing so that you can see what's working for other people jump onto that in in the absence of finding that new thing you in the sort of environment where you guys can say I've got this idea and I want to be the person that starts it and you've got the kind of ability and the environment you're in there like yet give it a go is that how it works because obviously it's a lot of pressure because these people have millions of followers it's not like an indie artist with a lot I'll give it a go do do you guys have the kind of control to do that yeah definitely it's very like when we would discuss them about the trust thing it's like once the artist feels that you do kind of understand them as a person not just as a brand and not just as them as a musician they kind of do almost rely on you sometimes to kind of give them that spark of an idea and we often say sometimes ideas we have they might not be the greatest one but it might give you the spark of kind of making the one that you're actually gonna use and sometimes it could be as simple as that but people are like Luis Capaldi that I've like kind of cracked the code he hasn't cracked the code because he understands Instagram and algorithm he knows that algorithm for him that I was discussing this with someone the other day just general chitchat about socials and what we should put up and what we shouldn't kind of thing and it's almost like I think we're too busy trying to chase what's gonna work best what's gonna get the most engagement they've reached what's going to get me on the explore page but really we're just then trying to play the game of tic toc or wherever you are whatever platform but if you understand what your algorithm is what makes you feel good about what you're sharing with people I think that's what connects the most it's very hard to trick people now you end up just trying to get the audience to you don't have rather than tearing everything to the audience you already have and is that a big thing that you know what our job at label to do is to like Mara said is give them like kind of thought starters of like here's an idea we know it's not gonna be right but then because they know their brand and they're they're just amplifying they then come up with an idea but then what we can provide is like when there are trends you know it's not the artist artists job to be on top of every trend and know exactly what hashtag is do you know when I was at the bottle cap challenge or try to think of other things but like so that then that's our job just to go hey there's this thing don't just do the standard bottle cap challenge because that will get lost in the five million other ones but here's an idea it's for you to do it so that it's different from the rest and that's kind of where we come in off like with for social media anyway when it's like there are these trends and and they come and go in a flash and it's that how can you do it for your fans so that you're being part of a conversation but also do it differently enough so that it's got your spin on it because otherwise usually another person doing jumping on another trend and does an artist like story come into it so do you start with like defining their story and what they're about first and then go into it that way kind of how does the process work when you first sign an artist they don't really have much going on then you know the music is good how does that kind of process work for you guys starting from the beginning and defining everything I think for us it depends on the level of artist some artists are willing to kind of just come out and share with you what their story is but some have already done it through their music so it's almost like how can we tap into what you've probably said already or what you haven't but how do you want to get your story across as a whole and if it's for example like you said an art is that maybe it's ways that they're very fresh that they haven't put anything out at all yet people don't know about the story yet so there is no music to kind of get what they are about on a grand scale maybe like if they're more indie the people know about them but to a broader audience how can we get our story across so then it is for us to kind of go in and find out more about you your do's and dont's what you're feeling what you're not and kind of grafting crafting how they want to tell that story and that might be over a period of two to three years sometimes longer it might be a short essay piece that they want to write they want to share with fans or it could be a mini documentary based type thing there's loads of ways that they can get their story out having to do the traditional sit-down interview type Finn because now people more receptive of just holding the camera a bit more Candide a bit more today I'm going to show you what I like to eat that's part of my story today I'm going to show you my dog my dog is a big part my story so dribs and drabs kind of just keeping that engagement going throughout the whole duration of their career you find on Instagram it's more like feed keeps it polished and their story more roar or it can it be both mix it depends like as in as if you were giving an over ruling sort of judgement yeah but again like my thing with with stories they're disposable as in the they're gone within within so that you when you asked oh do you guys have the power to like you know to howevers artists big following do you have the power to allow them to put something up or to influence that and it's like we always just say we'll be gone in 24 hours surface orifice every delete it like like everyone's got the power to press the delete button and I don't know once it's on the Internet is there forever but like if I never remember it but that's the other thing of like people's attention or gone like that so like like one of our biggest jobs that I find we do a lot is like convincing people that it's not like social media and what you put out there be precious over it but like you can make mistakes like like you it's good to make mistakes because then you learn what's better in the future so like we make mistakes every day like and we're fortunate enough to like if we were making artwork and we're making we can make 10 drafts and go which ones you like best and so that's a really fortunate position for us because people can see the rubbish ones and see the good ones where it's different for that when you're an artist putting something out in the world because you have to put out what you think is the best version but it's also ok not to have the best version and then to volve and and then have a better version next time and that's AG comes in together the storytelling of like artists should evolve and they shoot they shouldn't just come out and be like this perfect thing that you know there should be a beginning a middle and an end we always talk about when artists are doing stories as an Instagram stories of like don't just put up here's me and my dog here's me in the studio here's me in my bed that's not much of a story like tell people oh I'm gonna walk my dogs and then you so you have that intro then they're walking the dog something like funny or not it doesn't even happen find something interesting happen watch walking walking the dog that happens and then you letting the dog in the house because the walks finished that's not the most interesting story but like actually something incredible could happen on that dog walk or it's like and we always use there's two examples we always use if actually Luis he was running out of air mouth I can't remember what they basically you needed to have a to catch a flight to tap over his ear mouth so that he got a royalty card I don't know much about your mouth so don't know but essentially he got on a flight to Glasgow for day and he just told his audience that late his on stories like oh I'm gonna jump on a flight to Glasgow today because if I don't I lose my gold card or whatever is and so he did that and he took stories the Hult so people were prepped off like oh this is gonna happen this could be quite funny to watch and then throughout the journey he was doing late votes of like oh should I stay in the airport and get drunk or go see the sights and then so every each step of the way it was kind of like Bandersnatch see netflix style think people were deciding for him but had a beginning and had to like whatever was happening an end and then he fires back and then he had the sort of confirmation email or whatever it was to say that he got his card and it's like it had a beginning with N and similarly with Lewis when his toilet was blocked he told the world that toilet is blocked then there's like footage of him going to the shop buy a plunger and then he gets and it's like the most and no not at all no no and that's the thing and like people then try to like like force these things later down the lane and we go the success of that so how can we help but actually the best ones come when when is and then again that's just him knowing himself and knowing his audience he knew that would work and so we're putting ourselves out for job for a while yeah suffice a massive thing was training platforms are but did you start creating basically our work for CDs and like vinyl and all that how has that changed do you feel like it's changed at all because now that artwork it does impact whether somebody forgets playlisted or kind of how they pop on Spotify do you feel like when you were designing that I actually impacts her it saddens me to say no I think it matters less now which-which deeply saddens me and like obviously CD sales are going down and your artwork is now becoming like 300 pixels by three more pixels so I think it matters less and that's why I'm sat here going don't worry about your color palette and do it because I do it doesn't matter as much do you do their canvases on Spotify yeah so what's kind of the situation with those at the moment cuz some artists are using them some aren't kind of what what works best for those I think with canvases is again don't be too precious over it because no and ultimately there is an eight second vertical loop no one's ever gonna listen to a three-minute woman's song you say that because sometimes we will put like a cryptic code in there and the artists might be like gold one of my songs on my playlist has a cryptic message in there and if you find it you're not so there's things that you can do to use canvases that can be a bit more creative than just putting like a loop of your music video so yeah you can be as creative as that but also just put for the first time that someone's streaming your song or they've never heard of you and they're like I'm gonna give this a second if they just see a cool eight second loop it might force them not force them or guide them to go check out something else and that it's like a cascading events be thoughtful like so yeah like my thing with all these platforms that people always want to like build a website to to truly visualize what they want to beep it's like hack these things that already exist just a save a lot of money because building website cost a lot of money or you know and hack that system and because people aren't gonna download a new app or it's like oh yeah I want to build an app and we always advise not to because it's quite a commitment to go to the App Store download it give space on your phone or whatever it is whereas actually view it Spotify has installed in most people's phones anyway so if you can just hack that little vertical loop and do something cool was in that it will reach far more people and and that's why I like we do so much more on instantly you know do so much more in these platforms and it's like how we have we always think like when it comes to advertising how we can like grab people's attention and do something that that will will jar them because it's not they're not used to seeing that in the app and it's like there's one that we were talking about today which we're like sick of seeing but like I don't think people are like when it's a post that looks like something's coming out of the post so like say that their leg is like because they've sort of rehashed the Instagram dashboard and so it looks like it kind of 3d post and we're like ah so but actually is hacking these things and making feel that it's being abrupt and and people they are then seeing something that they're not used to seeing and these platforms where they're just like scrolling from they want to they want a thumb stopping thing they want it they want their attention to be to be grabbed where are you kind of seeing that your roles progressed because things are changing everyday there are new platforms constantly there certain things even now that you're like ah this is definitely gonna pop this is something that I need to start learning about is there anything in the moment where you think that's gonna be the next thing yeah I mean there's always something happening always always always you now love tick tock it is amazing but even like the filters that people are creating for these platforms are absolutely phenomenal like I'll follow a few people that they're not professionals that work in studios they're not in music industry type led creatives they're just people that kind of enjoy the creative process there's a few really good Instagram filters that people are now making but they're fully 3d to track your face like anyone can download this open software and you just build you just build filters there's a guy for the life in the common buddy's name now but it made a really cool one for Travis Scott for the new album for Jack boys and it was like the balaclava made in 3d that anyone can use or he made one for Kate Ranade had he did these eyes like the pupils that were moving and then he tagged Kate Ranade and in case you another used that as a filter of his own shade out people in thousands of people used it so these people are finding ways to kind of hack these creative platforms and reach artists you know you know there's usually a region art you stain or you have a message button and Instagram and if your message is sure these artists received millions but if your message is good enough and you're persistent enough a lot of the time it gets through and I think it's creating something worth that other people want to share like if I didn't make the thing for Drake for Drake to share in a million years he was never gonna see that but a lot a lot of people shared it and eventually it somehow it lands on their doorstep Instagram is a very very very big platform but it's not that big because of how many people are on there and if you make the right thing it just cascades it just goes and that's what makes things work so yeah this there's definitely a lot to learn I wanna I've want to learn badly these 3d filter things and again it's not because I want to make it for our artists which I do but I want to make some cool stuff on there I'm gonna see at home and just what can I meet today kind of kind of vibe or even on tick tock I can I make new filters I want to be part of the tick tock I mean I don't want I don't want to miss it it's amazing but the key is just being fluid like adaptive and fluid and constantly sort of aware of what's next and just like being excited by things and it is that thing being thoughtful enough to go how can I be the first to do something new on this but on this platform or just with this tool like this week or this month the most common thing is which Disney character you are with you know and give that another week or two nor die out and it's like so if you're gonna do it do it now you know and who knows and and that's one thing that I want to get better at is sort of the research of like where these things are birthed from like sometimes it's impossible to find but there is so much information at our hands to be able to go why that you know and it is Maris thing of cascading why that trend is now becoming so common and like people want to do it it's good it's a great thing but if someone doesn't six-month time they'll be like why do you know or is it revival and people are like yes you're bringing that back whatever yeah but so is it thing of just like being on top of it being like really being aware of like just your climate and and and what's going on I think it's probably a good place ender do you guys want to kind of expect or one is where they can find you where they can see your work is it is it Instagram this best I was gonna give my home address but come with instagrams best for me people is asked like do you have a website my Instagram is not working that's where they found me that's where I'm staying yeah so be MFP visuals no one tick tockia no I have it's the same one tick tock I'm just watching other people I'm yet beyond tick tock I'm sure I will convert soon and but my Instagram's just raw Rieger ror y te w AR please yeah please reach out just in general we're not always looking for massive creatives like it can literally just be anyone that's wants to be involved that's incredibly talented or even if you just have a passion for in you're curious we get questions all the time and I think because we don't scream and shout that we're from industry big label kind of corporate kind of type vibe that people just come to us and they ask us questions this week of fake and a guy that got in touch with me like years ago and I then wanted to interview him like when we were expanding team and he wasn't available and he just said oh but I've got a friend who's like Riku and I followed him for ages and just nothing's come up that was right for him and and then and then yeah this thing came out this project came apart so I know the perfect guy for it and we just got the deck through if like his creations and they were like insane and they're so good and it's just like that came from someone message me on Instagram being like hey like I'm really want to work like how can you help and I was like not yet but it'll come and like two years later it came like and it wasn't that I was there I always wanted to use him but um you know just finding the right thing thank you thanks for watching and you will be back soon with the video and make sure to subscribe hit done like fun turn on the bar as well and we'll see you in the next one [Music]