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alright let's focus on this okay let's talk about gender all right there we go let's talk about gender this is super [ __ ] important to me okay so I want to speak listen point of personal privilege okay I want to acknowledge the fact that while my opinions on gender abolitionism are sincere and I think rooted in a pretty deep academic understanding of the subject I have never like gotten [ __ ] on for my gender before you know you know what I mean like I've never suffered or experienced any ill will on account of my gender or my gender presentation so everything that I have to say on the subject is going to be informed almost as a necessity from a point of at least some level of privilege all right let's talk let's talk about gender my friend OHS okay what the [ __ ] is gender all right since time immemorial all right we have had in terms of broad dimorphic social groupings two sexes now obviously if you're a big woke boy like me the biggest woke estoy here can I do a quick radiant wait hold on what's primary to secondary color hold on wait let's do primary blue wait I'm gonna do red wait blue pink okay wait watch this okay wait foreground a background yes there we go all right listen okay this is if we're gonna use gender colors I mean we're committing you know this is how shut up this is how gender I'm sorry this is how sex actually is okay it's a it is a bimodal distribution we're typically speaking people fall within a closed range of options but there were examples of people who fall closer to the other end of the spectrum than they do within their own so to give an example for instance people who are male are typically larger than people who are female but as we all know there are some people who are fee who are larger than individual males so the like binary grouping of gender like this doesn't really work and if you examine the scientific literature you'll find that there's pretty much broad consensus on the idea of sex being a.m. being a continuum like a very complex set of characteristics that we just grouped together for the sake of sort of social convenience but with all that being said okay we have in terms of our social groupings typically had sis men and sis women for quite a long time and there are some characteristics that we can associate with those okay so we have the the dango how can how much can I get away with on YouTube there we go I can get away with that right and we've got goobers and we've got big hunks okay and we have other characteristics like like hairy ass armpits which are secondary sexual characteristics that are representative and pretty much everybody know there's some relatively hairless people I'm gonna draw out some characteristics okay that are typically associated with sex all right let's do this together it's going to be a fun game okay all right we're gonna do here look this is a dango I'm pretty sure I can get away with that on YouTube okay all right we good with that I'm gonna draw this is these are wide hips that's a little belly button see whatever what are some other good ones here okay hmm let's let's think of a few good ones here what can I get away with oh yes assists women don't poop we know this okay so those are some examples of secondary of some sexual characteristics that are or oriented pretty much entirely around the physiology that people are assigned when they're born obviously there extends to which we can change this but for the purposes of gender abolitionism none of this is really relevant what is relevant is the characteristics that sort of get associated with these things okay like here's a good example suits okay yeah I'm going to quickly draw a little suit all right okay look watch and draw very quickly see like so and then we're gonna do to do see look that's like a little suit see have a [ __ ] you even draw dresses all I remember is like Elsa's dress from frozen who even wears dresses I don't even know what the [ __ ] I'm drawing that's a dress okay and we've got that we have like earrings see big hoop earrings we have long hair versus short hair and a wide variety of other things okay and why am i drawing all these nonsense doodles well the reason I'm doing this is to illustrate a critical difference in the types of things we associate with gender and the ways in which those characteristics manifest so if you think say for example that you're like just a not at all woke person okay you don't really know the difference between sex and gender okay and I asked you to describe what a man is all right now this person probably doesn't know like [ __ ] about trans issues probably not so if I ask them what a man means they're probably going to go like Oh hairy chest apenas and there were a suit and they've got short hair they grow a beard and um they were they're like have a deep voice and they're very confident and masculine and they're the dominant sexual partner obviously and that sort of thing and if you take a look at all those characteristics you can break them down into two separate categories one of them penis hairy chest what-have-you these are more physiological characteristics that are associated predominantly with your genetic makeup when you're born but other things like having short hair being sexually dominant being confident wearing suits wearing like nice leather shoes these things are associated predominantly with gender gender refers to a set of social expectations and roles that are oriented around one sexual presentation here in the West we have two genders or at least two socially recognized genders we have men and women and because we are at this moment currently reconciling the existence of trans people with that sexual and gendered binary we in this system in the West recognize or at least we believe that gender and sex are more or less oriented around each other that gendered characteristics are naturally emergent from sexual characteristics for example men being more mechanically predisposed or men being more sexually dominant or confident or what-have-you men wearing suits but if you look back through time and you don't have to look back through a particularly long length of time at that you can find examples where this breaks apart there is by no means any intrinsic association between men having short hair and women having long hair like that that system is not in any way genetically priori until it be men's hair and women's hair this same it's the same genetically it's just how we choose to cut it and I could think of plenty of societies in the past that it where it's been fashionable for men to have long hair and plenty of societies in the past where it's been fashionable for women have short hair think about um what do you call them flappers back during the 1920s right they kept their hair pretty [ __ ] short Jesus had long hair you love Jesus don't you men like blue women like pink that only came about because a toy company back some hundred years ago ran out of um they ran out of dye for the toys that they were making prior to that point pink was considered to be the predominantly masculine color look see this look at this it's got a pink face little octopus that I got at Anime Expo look at pink I mean really look at it it's a bold color Roman you can think of like Centurions powerful it pops it's strong its vibrant blue is a more cool sedated color right he kind of flipped the gendered structure on its head there prior to that point pink was considered masculine blue was considered feminine we can look this up actually super quickly because I remember yeah the if you look down a toy aisle right now if you go into any store a Toys R Us do they even exist anymore or Target whatever you can see like the girls toys or like crazy [ __ ] pink and the boys toys are like crazy [ __ ] blue it's wild it's like it's out of a cartoon but if you go back just a little bit in the past this association did exist but people today will treat it now like it's sink resent I once saw an infographic on what how you should like color your house like what how you should paint each room you know and it was like in the kitchen you should paint it a light yellow because it's vibrant and it will make you hungry in the morning and you should paint your living room a nice sage green because bubble and then it gets like you should paint your son's room blue because it encourages calm confidence and you shouldn't paint your girl's room pink because it encourages delicate oh okay I'm sorry I thought we were I thought we were using facts and logic right here not [ __ ] feelings no matter how you look at it the farther back you go gender becomes increasingly arbitrary everything Lea associated with dresses versus suits men used to wear dresses suits haven't existed for that long but there have been plenty of fashion trends in the past and today where women have looked plenty good in suits and been widely celebrated for their appearance the fedora used to be considered a woman's hat now it's considered a men's hat I'm not sure how that transition happened facial piercings earrings in the [ __ ] you really think men weren't rocking that shitty back in the day men were wearing dresses you know there are societies in which women were expected to be the sexually aggressive ones I'm pretty sure Greco ancient Greece some city-states where that was the case all of these associations are arbitrary and in my opinion and this is where we get into that gender abolitionist bent and in my opinion these associations are not only arbitrary they are harmful and this is where we get into gender like roles gender expectations okay to say that gender is arbitrary is not like a super hot take in most left-leaning circles I'm not exactly expecting accolades for that one and to say that gender roles are harmful I think is similarly you know tepid its bathwater temperature a take but as an anarchist I see value in the deconstruction of social hierarchies and taxonomies which I believe contribute to oppression not just to make those hierarchies good not just to make those hierarchies fine or decent or not harmful but to destroy them something should have value to be kept what do we get from gender like what do we what do we actually get from it what's the benefit quia actually take a second to think for a second because I I actually want us to think about this okay what do we get from gender cuz I can't think of much everything that I have that is associated with my gender for example I'm confident I speak in a deep voice I'm large you know I mean pretty big you know I like strengths mostly both like as a metaphysical concept and physically I like being physically strong I think those things benefit me in some ways in my day to day life these things are gender associated but I could get all of these without gender gender isn't really necessary to teach me the importance of these things it doesn't help me recognize why these things are important I've never looked at myself and thought I should be confident and well-spoken because I'm a man no I should be confident and well-spoken because it helps me achieve my goals I should be strong and bold because I'm a man well no I should be strong and bold because it helps me achieve my goals I can't really think anyway in which gender helps people or if the expectations surrounding gender help people because if something that gender provides us is valuable we should be able to argue for its value outside the gendered paradigm at least that makes sense to me right so I don't know what good gender gets us I can think of some harm gender ascribes to us see gender can't really exist outside of gender roles anytime you create a category for someone the existence of the category implicitly reinforces the belief both from with those within the category and those from without him that people in that category should hold themselves to certain values there's no value to a category that has no meaning right so what if you're a man well strong confident sure cool man can't cry can't show emotion emotionally brusque difficulty expressing their feelings difficulty communing with communicating with and relating to others taught to be aggressive competitive and almost like antisocial to an extent when it comes to their to the the presentation of their values and others thinks are some pretty like [ __ ] up values that are associated with masculinity and there are that we call them toxic masculinity you know like this is a pretty well regarded term toxic masculinity elements of masculinity which when reinforced in the mind of its constituents lead to negative outcomes men being brusque and aggressive and having difficulty sharing their feelings and [ __ ] it there's toxic femininity too like that caddy [ __ ] like hypersensitivity to others like social status that I think like gets coded pretty hardest toxic femininity that like pathological obsession with other people's like social lives and how to these things aren't exclusive to feminine need nor are toxic masculine elements exclusive to men but if you look on like both ends of the spectrum here there are a ton of ways in which gendered expectations can reinforce harm in a person's self perception and in just the way they engage with xiety this is like this is like some easy [ __ ] right so I ask you why keep these categories like what benefit do they serve because as long as those categories exist people are going to be held to expectations concerning the characteristics associated with those categories and if there are no characteristics associated with those categories then they don't they don't mean anything if you want to say hey girl power but by the way a girl can mean absolutely anything there's no right or wrong way to be a girl then then why be a girl what okay like hey you're I'm up I'm a boy by the way boy doesn't mean [ __ ] there's nothing there's no right way no wrong way to be a boy what is being a boy even mean I don't know but I'm a boy what what why be might be a boy wait why keep the category if it doesn't mean anything what the [ __ ] that doesn't make any sense why why do you keep categories exist the categories are all socially constructed all of them they don't exist in nature we build them through language through social rigor to serve a purpose and if a if if a category doesn't serve a purpose but it could conceivably cause harm why keep why be book friends why be boy I don't get it so oh it's off center hold on why be boy I don't get I don't get it why do it what's the value what's the purpose and maintaining it taxonomy that doesn't serve any social function that serves no distinction that doesn't reinforce any values which doesn't reinforce any roles but doesn't teach us anything which doesn't give us anything all in does really is serve for a potential of discrimination down the line as long as there are categories people will discriminate based on categories that's just that seems to be a fundamental component of existence as long as race exists there will be racism as long as sex exists there will be sexism and lungs gender access I supposed will be gender-based discrimination categories will always invite some form of a discrimination so the ones that we have the ones that we keep we have to choose those things now I hear you asking right now what about the trans is okay what about what about the [ __ ] people all right gender abolitionism gets mixed up in a lot of gross ass turf [ __ ] because turf people like to pretend they don't care about gender and then the next breath we'll talk about how femininity is this mystical spiritual thing and out to you on birth if you have a vagina and that if you have a penis you can't be a woman because you're just being a faker or something you're a confused man so turfs a lie when they call themselves gender abolitionists I have never met a turf who genuinely didn't care about gender they pretend not to care about gender if it means they get to bludgeon trans people that's their little that's the little game they play right there that is not they [ __ ] love gender turfs [ __ ] love gender okay they adore it they crave it turfs [ __ ] snuggle gender to bed every night they write that [ __ ] on their little [ __ ] on their what do they call it what's the Japanese name for love pillow I don't know they love that [ __ ] okay don't listen to them what about what about the trans people okay well I asked you what about the trans people so the reason why I want gender abolitionism is because I think people are hurt by gendered expectations I think these categories cause measurable harm and who do they harm more than trans people I ask you who suffers more than trans people when it comes to misplaced derogatory harmful oppressive pernicious expectations associated with gender who more nobody trans people get hurt more than anyone else that's on that's they're getting the worst of it so why would I prescribe any kind of gender abolitionism why would I support it in any way shape or form in a way that harms trans people the people who are most harmed by the existence of the category I'm looking to eliminate a lot of people and by people I mean turfs who aren't really people will say this they'll say hey there's no such thing as gender and those they'll say this to a trans woman okay hey there's no such thing as gender oh you're just a feminine boy why can't you just like you can wear a dress and be a boy you don't have to like be a girl you can never be a girl why don't you just be a feminine boy that's the that's sort of like the turf line there I proposed to you this okay as an alternative to the turf approach to gender abolitionism a distinction that some may call problematic but it's one that I believe genuinely exists that we should respect the existence of the distinction between transgender and transsexual I know the term transsexual sounds crazy [ __ ] outdated I recognize that but please hear me out in this distinction because it's an important one okay transgender means to us identify as any gender which is not the one but we you were assigned at birth so a non-binary person is trans because they I need non-binary people notice don't identify the gender they were assigned at Birth that makes them trans that's definitional right there that's easy they fit the if they fit the [ __ ] in there Congrats you're trans however transsexual means that you are physiologically uncomfortable with the sexual characteristics associated with your body and you would like to change those these two categories often overlap but not always I know there are transgender people both trans women trans men and non-binary people who have no interest whatsoever in changing their body they are eight they are 100 oles with their presentation with I would like that [ __ ] you know they are they are a-okay with that [ __ ] they're fine with that I know trans women who who have big [ __ ] floppy dongers and and and and like flat chests and they're they're completely fine with that cool that's on that's fine yeah hell yeah and that person would be trans gender but I don't think they would be transsexual they don't seem to have any interest in altering the sexual characteristics assigned with them at birth and that's every bit as valid as the alternative and there are many transgender people who are also transsexual who in addition to making an effort to socially present as a woman if you were assigned male at birth or whatever in addition to what the [ __ ] dude trans woman do I don't know [ __ ] frilly a stresses and cat girlie or zone in addition to that stuff they also want the floppy dongho punched in words and to get big big floppies up here they get the floppy from there to there you know and there then transgender social presentation identity and transsexual to alter the sexual characteristics that they were you know sort of endowed with at birth but I also know a few people who are transsexual but not transgender I think this is probably like the smallest minority but they're every bit as valid as any other I know actually my best friend in high school and later on I would actually consider to be such a person because he is not transgender he was assigned male at birth and goes by he him but he has considered taking on HRT in the past just because he likes the idea of altering some of his sexual characteristics nothing to do with gender he likes being he that I would consider to be an example of being transsexual without being transgender so there's a difference between these two things right here an in gender abolitionist world in magical future gender abolitionism one group would continue to exist and one group would by definition no longer exist if there's no gender as a concept you can't be transgender it's not possible it can't there's no gender you can't be transgender if you are assigned male at birth and you want to present in a different way than we might imagine one assigned male at Birth might traditionally present themselves as that's not trans anything because the category you're transcending no longer exists however draw it out okay look it's simple my comrades okay here's the gender box okay all right the X is where you're born into or you're assigned and the in the oh is where you want to be okay so if we're gonna there you go okay so if you're assigned here and you want to present here mmm congratulations you've done it you're transgender okay but that doesn't work anymore in a society where the boxes don't exist you're just there's no X you're not assigned anything there's no oh you just there's just the oh you're just born in this ephemeral space of abstraction where there's no expectation no associations when you're born in a gender of all of society there's no expectation for how you'll dress how you'll act how you'll talk how you'll behave nothing but the absolute baseline physiological expectations that one might associate with a person who's born in the way in which you're born for example like here you have a penis maybe you can pee stain I like the very baseline [ __ ] you know everyone can be sinning but there is no expectations whatsoever when it comes to how you would present yourself how you would identify how you would decide to orient yourself sexually how you would interact with other people but there would still be trained sexual people it is still entirely conceivable in a gender abolish society that a that that a person could be born with like big floppy boobies and well hopefully hopefully they wouldn't be born with that actually that'd be a little bit strange but shortly after being born they would have the big floppy boobies but they don't want to have big floppy boobies they want to have a flat boobie I want flat boot no Bowie zero boobie that's not a gender decision that's a sexual decision and those people would be transsexual if we recognize the existence of this distinction the transgender transsexual distinction I think it's perfectly reasonable to under like the understanding that gender abolitionism doesn't have to come at the expense of trans people if anything trans people are the ones who would be most thoroughly liberated by this because trans people above all others experience the suffering associated with jumping between those boxes with the removal of the boxes every single part son has to free of social pressures free of oppression free of coercion make the personal decision to go out there and live their life authentically presenting dressing speaking engaging in the ways they feel most comfortable all of them every single one of them and some people who have gender I guess in this case it would be sexual dysphoria would want to get their floppies dog Odin or Don goat floppies and that's fine and they can do that this to me seems like the best way the most humane reasonable way to address the harm done through gender without losing any good any social utility what do we lose who's harmed by what I propose I don't I don't think anybody um I've heard a bunch of different terms thrown around for this gender abolitionism gender nihilism gender anarchy some terms seem to be more predominantly associated with turf some not I don't know I don't care words are dumb just like gender what I know is this in my opinion the world would be a better place if we slowly made steps towards drinking a [ __ ] ton of water if we made steps towards dealer Jenna maizing gender as a construct if we made steps towards making it less important think of how important gender was back just 70 years ago in the 1950s have you ever seen advertisements from that era the man-woman divide in America was like this it was like this this existential it was like a divine rift between the two and all of society was oriented around the social distinctions between these two groups it's [ __ ] wild if you go back it's crazy and nowadays we've gotten a lot better about this men and women more integrated so on and so forth but it's not far enough why don't we keep pushing that envelope why don't we keep pushing that place until we recognize hey well we've made this recognition now hey you can be a man and be wispy and effeminate hey you can be a woman and be brusque and masculine we keep pushing and pushing and pushing until man doesn't mean anything and woman doesn't mean anything and we're left with two categories that mean nothing that have no distinctions that serve no value and then we slowly recognize that they we don't need them anymore this will be a really long term process this is not like something that we can do in a year or a decade or even a century but it's a long term goal that I believe in very sincerely because I don't like unnecessary social constructs I don't like race either I'm also a race abolitionist I don't want [ __ ] race to exist [ __ ] that hey this person has dark skin light skin sure hey this person's black or white with all the [ __ ] that gets associate with that not [ __ ] that we didn't use to have race the way we have it today we didn't use to have gender the way we have it today these things can be changed molded they're not intrinsic we can fix this we can do better than how we're currently doing and that's a way in which I want to do better alia Caius asks Vash what about the colonized societies that have multiple concepts of gender deeply tied with their cultures outside the Western binary asking because they come from a culture where extra gender options exist I've done some research into other societies in which there are varying like different like outside the Western binary of gender and while I recognize the validity sort of in a socio-cultural historical sense of these identities I I still think they're oppressive I'm not suggesting that we like patronizingly go and re colonial eyes these societies to destroy their understanding of gender just that collectively is our world glue grows more globalized more modernized these are steps we should take towards gender abolitionism liberation whatever the [ __ ] you like to call it in it [ __ ] me I'm behind on chat how does this idea recon with scholarly accounts of gender like Judith Butler's which described as a complex relationship between the individual in their society oh it squares perfectly with that Judith Butler argue that gender is a performative act that gender is a is a set of performances that we demonstrate so when I talk to you with this deep voice when I do these hand gestures when I crack my knuckles emphatically I'm performing masculinity at you where is it's perfectly reasonable that somebody with my exact same body could act just like this and if you gave it a couple of days or maybe weeks to get used to it it's dead it's completely possible this could seem every bit as normal to you as my the way in which I normally present but I don't act that way because I present my masculinity but I don't think that's in any way shape or form contrary to how gender abolitionism works we present this way because we're told to present this way the performance only is the performance is only possible because we're on a stage if you destroy the stage the performance ends no Judith Butler is not a gender abolitionist GF making me some rice how would sexuality work in a gender abolish world instead of being hetero would she be feminine I think that would probably be the closest way we can envision it now where were when we think of a gender abolished world we think of a world that is radically different from our own so much of our world is tied into gender it's difficult for me to understand how sexuality or preferences might orient themselves but in my mind like I don't really think people are attracted to gender right like it's not really gender it's presentation it's it's it's its appearance it's there's a whole variety of characteristics I don't really know like like imagine like we encounter an alien race that looks exactly like ours that has similar social standards but they have no understanding of gender they look exactly like us and you meet someone who looks pretty much like your type but they have no understanding of gender they just go by like they in our language like would you be like oh no sorry I'm only into girls or oh no sorry I'm only into boys probably not and given how much how much interest there's been like historically in in in alien creatures as a concept who fit within our standards of beauty I don't really think gender is how we're attracted to people and how could it be gender didn't exist back when our Neanderthals were [ __ ] one another back when our [ __ ] Neanderthal ancestors were clubbing each other over the head to get that like [ __ ] hairy ape dick like there wasn't gender back then that [ __ ] didn't exist and they were still [ __ ] around gender isn't how we orient attraction gender is how we describe a set of characteristics which may or may not be correlative that sort of correspond to how we are attracted to people I'll give you an example think of how many people how many men who consider themselves straight are attracted to femme boys and the traps thing now of course trap is a slurp Oh blah blah but that's the name of the sort of the phenomena that we're seeing think of how much like this is blown up there are literally like millions of dudes that are like straight identified but are into that and why wouldn't they be because those femme boys are trapped or whatever they like them they're boys yes but they're very feminine and because they're feminine they align with the the the sexual interests of people who are interested in that kind of pornography and those kinds of people it's not a gender thing it's a presentation thing it's not your chromosomes it's how you look and how you act I think this is how people define their attractions really and there are exceptions to this certainly I know there are some people who are who are literally like they'll look like a point at a dude and they'll be like no I'm not into that and then I'll point at the exact same dude and I'll say actually this is a Capri everything trans woman and they look like me and then they'll be attracted to them so I know some people have associations with attraction let the orient around gender specifically but I think that has more to do with their baggage than it does with any intrinsic association with how sexuality and attraction works does that make sense i under I'm trying to convey a lot of concepts here and I'm trying to do it very quickly and I understand that that I didn't like write it all out beforehand but in my mind gender abolitionism is a coherent philosophy of anti-hero hierarchal thought which is perfectly in line with our modern understanding of gender theory perfectly in line with a desire to liberate and validate the existence of trans people perfectly in line with the desire to reduce harm in society that is that is how I think of it and it's a process you know I am very much a man in every in every socially accepted sense obviously I don't know what my chromosomes are I can reasonably guess X Y I don't really know I've never gotten to test it I know my test levels are pretty [ __ ] high I've got that and I present masculine in pretty much every conceivable way I don't really mind if people called me like they them or she her it would be like weird I guess but I wouldn't really mind but most of the reasons why I go along with like the he him like masculine Ben is for the sake of convenience because it's easier for me to go by him because I don't care hey it doesn't matter to me and I would hope that with time that attitude would grow more prevalent my girlfriend hyena another perfect example of someone who doesn't really care about gender that best friend of mine from high school the one who I said identified as a man but would nonetheless like to take HRT I'd also consider them to be someone who doesn't really care about gender and I think that's valuable I think that's I think that's sick is [ __ ] I think that's dank nasty anyway anyway that's my perspective on gender abolitionism so to reiterate it is a destruction of the category of gender in a way which does not invalidate the existence of trans people does not deny them any rights or privileges and if anything liber8 s' them from from coercive expectations that may lead to further dysphoria down the line it leads to greater societal harm reduction in the long term and I think most importantly it sticks it to the turfs by showing them that turf theory is garbage my theory is better