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all right here we go so let's get into this hi everyone a lot of you may know me my name is Josh and if you only have 25 seconds if you have to leave in less than 30 seconds I want to give you something probably the most important thing so if you have to leave in 25 seconds here's the one thing you need to know about having first conversations and it is this talk less now a lot of you that's a new concept like what do you mean aren't I supposed to be the one talking during these first conversations so people ask me like well how do I do that and in order to practice it I want you to just practice being curious this is going to help you a lot during first sales conversations a lot of times when I say this people say well how do I become you're curious and this is a great way to practice during your next conversation with anybody whether that's a colleague at work your spouse or even a prospect I only want you to ask questions for the first five minutes like a five-year-old this is gonna start to practice and build your curiosity skills there are four things that are gonna help you get the most out of this session today the first one is this if you are listening to this webinar you're watching it and you're like hey I'm not a sales consultant these questions won't work for me this framework won't work for me I want you to stop yourself and think how might I take the ideas that I'm hearing and apply this to my business and my prospects if you're hearing yourself think this why should I listen to him you absolutely should not listen to me I don't have a silver bullet these are things that have worked really well for me in my career and the clients that I have take what I'm talking about and pretend it's like a little jelly bean that you want to try out and over the course of your career you will collect these little jelly beans from people like myself and you will create your own jelly bean jar of your sales philosophy next you might be thinking to yourself I tried these things I tried first sales conversations and I really suck at it if you hear yourself saying that I want you to stop yourself and think what's one thing that I did really well and what's one thing that I would do differently next time how do you do this just record all your conversations going forward even if you use just your iPhone it's a great way to make yourself better next you might think to yourself I've been selling for 15 years ten years seven years I already know all their stuff already and so in that case what I would say to you is this can i reinforce this can I go a little bit deeper so by way of example you may have seen this if you've been in my previous webinars this is a guy named Andy Riley he writes a book called the bunny suicides it's a book about you guessed it ways in which bunnies can commit suicide so this was his first volume Eddie wrote just a little screenshot but he didn't stop there he went a little deeper and a little deeper and came up with another volume called the dawn of bunny suicides and other creative ways to have bunnies committing suicides as you can see this one on the San Andreas Fault and he went even deeper still and created another volume the point here is that you can always learn more you can always be deeper on any given topic ouch let's get into it with regards to first sales conversations here's some of the things that I hear all the time one I get ghosted meaning I have these first sales conversations and I think we can really help this company and I think things are going really well but then I get ghosted and people disappear people end up chasing they have these great first conversations and then they keep chasing for a next meeting sometimes they feel that conversations don't feel natural and they feel a little bit out of control the cause of this ghosting is only one reason you're just not that interesting to the person that you're speaking with you're interesting to you perhaps but not to the other person which is why they're not getting back to you every single time you get ghosted point the finger back at yourself and start to question about what you could have been doing to be a little more interesting and we going to talk about specifically what that means next you might be barking at print I hear this a lot you've read a sales book on how to do first sales conversations and you're just going through the questions like spin selling I call it barking it print your kind of reading the questions but you're not exactly sure why you're asking them and why you're asking them in the order you're asking them so you've come across as robotic three because you don't have a structure or a game plan for how to lead an initial conversation you're winging it and the biggest one that I hear often times when I ask people how they learned how to have a first sales conversation it's always around some type of a selling process like spin selling but it's never around how people buy which is what I'm going to show you today so what you're gonna learn today is a few foundations with regards to how I want you to approach these initial sales conversations from a mindset and skill perspective and then we're going to get into a conversation framework that'll feel very natural and then I have an offer for you at the end that's free if you want to improve your conversation skills and ultimately close more deals so let's get into foundations number one is this imagine for a second that you were going to hire a personal trainer and a personal trainer on the left when you showed up for the first day they said this what do you want to do trainer on the right said this based on your goal and my assessment of you this is your workout plan you would probably choose the personal trainer on the right because the personal trainer on the right is coming across as an expert practitioner so principle number one is this a waiter takes orders a personal trainer has a perspective on how to get you from where you are to six-pack abs and I want you to have this mindset on these first sales conversations of being the personal trainer and not the waiter people do not want to buy from personal trainers who are asking them what the workout should be they want to be led to better by an expert principle number two let's imagine for a second there are these same two personal trainers and you are training for a race and on the left hand side you ask the personal trainer about vo2 max and he says well I'm not really too familiar with that test but the personal trainer on the right says you know Josh we could certainly talk about that but do you know the difference between vo2 max and an FTP test as it relates to your goal with his triathlon training the personal trainer on the right has my attention because he knows his domain and he's an industry expert you have to be an industry expert you have to know more about your prospects industry than they do so you sound like the personal trainer on the right and not on the left I don't want to be around or hire or do business with the blue personal trainer how do you do that try this it's a product called feedly it's about $10 a month and allows you to subscribe to all sorts of industry expert publications so here's a snapshot of mine I subscribe to a lot of sales stuff as you can imagine and every morning I skim through it to stay up to speed what are you doing to become more knowledgeable in your prospects industry than they are you may not be doing enough number three my grandma's toaster it sucked only once I'd worked the toast was always light but despite that I could never sell my grandma a new toaster these are the benefits that I saw grandma it would be faster it would be darker even though there was benefits to the toaster that I was trying to sell her those were not benefits to my grandma because she saw this if I got a new toaster it'll be slower because I'd have to learn a new toaster user interface and I don't care about dark toasts I only prefer light toast and my toasters free cos I've already paid for it so although your product has benefits and value propositions that matter to you until you get your prospect to talk about what matters to them those benefits do not matter your benefits only matter if they matter to your prospects so let me go through the conversation framework you're gonna learn a way to be able to bubble up what matters most to your prospect and then position accordingly if your product has seven or eight or ten benefits and only two or three matter to your prospect don't talk about the other eight because they'll think they're overpaying for stuff that they don't need number four I don't know if you guys have ever seen this this is one of those mall kiosk people that sometimes lock eyes with you and say can I ask you a question and how do you feel when people say that you probably want to run in the opposite direction that's because there's this pressure when you're trying to move faster than your prospect is weight is willing to go it's almost like being on a first date with someone and saying can I meet your parents and yet that's what we come across as salespeople all the time you sound like that mall kiosk person trying to move faster than your prospect is ready to move and that's what makes people ghost you so if someone were to say to you on an initial sales conversation within a minute that sounds interesting we're looking for something just like this why are you different your inclination would probably be to go into pitch mode oh my gosh they're so interested I better sell what I'd like you to do is to lean back and say something like this happy to tell you but I don't want to assume why I think we're different matters to you so what would it be okay if I ask you a few questions first or hey you only have five minutes can you give us a quick demo a lot of salespeople would say gee will cram it all in in five minutes lean back and instead don't be the mall kiosk person you might want to just repeat their last three words it's a great way to get people talking more try this anytime you're talking to anyone just repeat back their last three words and watch them keep talking that's a tip from Chris vos so we only have five minutes can you give us a quick demo a quick demo and then they'll keep talking and then you might say something like you know here's the thing I'm giving a before I understand your situation would do you a disservice it wastes a lot of your time because I'd probably blabbing about things that might not matter to you would it make sense to reschedule notice what I'm doing here I'm taking the role as the personal treat I'm not getting pushed around I'm an equal footing as my prospect so I want you to detach from the outcome the objective of the calls not to get the sale number five well Josh what what is the goal of having a conversation like what's the goal what are we doing here when I asked this question these are the top answers I get to get a sale to get the next meeting to get a demo to get to yes to qualify them these are all things that you want but guess what none of these are things that your prospect wants not one of them and so what we need to do here is adopt the buyer mindset and the buyer mindset is this the only reason a prospect is talking to you the only reason is to see if you can help them kick more ass or be more awesome than something let me explain you what I mean by that some of you may be familiar with this if you've been in my previous webinars but it bears repeating because it's so important if you remember Mario 4 Mario Brothers Mario on the left hand side would jump on a flower and that flower would give him the fireball that would allow him to kill the monsters not fireball let him kick more ass or do something better in this case kill the monsters your prospects are like Mario your product or service is like the flower and the awesome thing that your prospects can do as a result of getting your thing is the fireball the only thing your prospects are interested in are fireballs to just drive this home I'm gonna show you a picture and a slogan and I want you to ask yourself is this a flower or fireball so here we go Yeti tumblr is insulated with three layers of ceramic planet-x flower or fireball and is a hundred percent of flower and yet this is how often we talk right so a fireball would be keep hot things hot and cold things cold right another example of zoom lens telephoto zoom lens optics fluorite whatever of how light stuff means that's a flower a fireball helps you take better pictures of your kids playing sports you have to have crystal-clear clarity on how you help your prospects kick more ass right so there's four ways you can help people kick more ass let's go through it right way number one is this let's say for instance that I'm a triathlete which I happen to be and I want to finish a triathlon so there's me coming across the goal line that is my goal that is how I want to kick more ass and be more awesome that that vision I have of myself crossing the finish line that's the fireball now let's say for instance I was going along and I got a flat tire one way a salesperson could help me in this case is to say you know what I'm going to fix your flat tire and get you on your way to the finish line so way number one is get people away from something they don't want this is what's often called a pain here's the problem people most people don't have pains when they talk to you only about 10% deal right taking yourself well how am I supposed to sell if there's no pain remember this is only just way one wait one is I've got something and I need to fix it my air conditioners broke and I need to fix it this is when people are really down the funnel really far they're probably looking at five or six competitors already and less than 10% of the people you talk to will have flat tires way number two is this and this is where the magic is let's say I'm doing a triathlon again a little bit longer distance this time and I have the same fireball I want to cross the finish line and I don't have a flat tire everything's fine I go into the bike store just to get a checkup and the salesperson in the bikes or store says this hey Josh I noticed that you have these ordinary tires on your bike are you familiar with the difference between the ordinary tyres you have and these gator-skin tires we have over here and how they affect your triathlon time well what are gator-skin tires oh those are tires that don't get puncture wounds hardly ever so you don't have to waste time changing your tires and ruining your time oh yeah I'll take some of those way number two is what really great salespeople do they start to not ask for problems they find problems by bringing things to people's attention that they may not have considered before very powerful teach people what's possible everybody always wants to get better at something some people may not know problems even exist until you bring it to their attention very powerful in a sales conversation as we get to the framework 90% of the people you talk to will be very open to new ideas and new perspectives if you phrase the question properly like that salesperson did in the bike store way number three is this I want new tires Josh you're only doing a sprint triathlon the tires you have are perfect so not selling anyone anything but taking a higher ground and again doing what's in the best interest of the prospect to play the long game that gives them the fireball you don't make any money but you recommend they do nothing and I do that all the time and every single time people come back and tell you how appreciative they they are and it always comes back and the final way is this people want to pie to buy something that's overkill so the wheels we sell here Josh they're overkill what you need of these other wheels but we don't sell them so try this other place up the street so way number four to help people be more awesome is again not to sell them anything but to actually point them somewhere else so if we take a look at all the ways we're going to be able to help people be more awesome as we get into the framework these are all the ways and notice none of them involves selling anything they all involve helping someone be more awesome and if you don't get that in your head what does it mean to be awesome for my products can be a really tough battle for you you have to be able to articulate what's the before and what's the finish line what's the Yeti mug what's the warm things warm and cold things cold for my business help helping your prospects get clarity on their fireball will differentiate you from your competition what do I mean by that I was on a call last week with a prospect that's now a customer and they came in and they said I want this I want to increase cold outreach response rates now is that a fireball or a flower it's a flower so I said well what will that do for you and they said it'll get us more meetings again a flower and so I asked and and what will more meetings allow you to do better and they finally said get more revenue turns out in order to get more revenue that's really the fireball that we help them realize and increase in cult outreach response rates is really down on the list right can you get more opportunities in your pipeline unstuck can you convert more conversations you're already having into customers right these are all ways to help you get the fireball but not around the thing you were asking for so make sure when you're doing these customer conversations and people are asking what they want are they asking for a flower or they asked me for a fireball and if they're asking for a flower helping them realize what the fireball is can really differentiate you from the pack okay here are the foundations we just went through be a personal trainer not a waiter know the industry better than your prospects benefits only matter when they matter to your prospect and your role is to guide people of being more awesome even if that doesn't involve you or your service now let's get into the actual conversation framework here we go first thing is we have a step before we actually start talking a confirm step so somebody agreed to have a meeting what do I do before the meeting well I want to be likable right like the personal trainer I want to be likable so one of the things that people can do to increase response rates before meetings these are what top SDI's are doing is they're sending these little video voicemails prior to the meeting to connect with people and remind them of the value they're gonna be getting out of the meeting to fireball so here's an example from Claire from a company called Ann flow and by way of context Claire was in college she had her period didn't have any tampons and decided that she didn't want any other college student to ever happen not again and so she created a company where she provides tampons to colleges and they had them in restrooms just like they would toilet paper and she set a meeting with University and here's her confirmation message that she puts out there before the meeting I see see ad we have so many tampons and pads waiting for you guys so we're really excited to regroup have this conversation and help your school join the menstral movement and if it makes sense for you guys give us an email back let us know what you're thinking we're really excited to help you change the world one cycle at a time talk with you soon bye bye this idea of building credibility does that there's another idea this is the bottom of an email footer that I have when I send a meeting confirmation it doesn't sell but it shows all the things that I've been writing why do I do that because I want to be perceived as the personal trainer that's an expert so what can you do in your initial outreach so that when they get on the call you're already in a 1-up position I use a product called calendly that automatically sends reminders to the prospect a day before in 15 minutes before the meeting and you can see I tweaked the message on the left hand side in a very humble way I'm sending you this reminder because the sales book said I should be sending your reminders again a way for people to smile and increase my likability a little bit next prepare before the meeting right prepare why remember that personal trainer that green personal trainer this is what it sounds like if you are an unprepared salesperson or a waiter you'd start the call by saying how are you doing today it's gonna make you sound like that later you might start off by saying how many STRs do you have that's gonna sound like a waiter if you're prepared you might be able to say something like this yeah I was peeping your about Us page and it looks like you have five STRs are they all located in San Francisco or are some in New York this makes you come across like the personal trainer and not the waiter how do you prepare take a look at their website and see if you can't glean how they're currently solving the problem which would allow you to ask a question like this I notice you folks are using paid advertising how's that been working out for you seeing a positive ROI or return on to the ad spend what can you glean from your prospects business in terms of how they're solving the problem that you might be able to help them solve and use that as we start our initial sales conversations LinkedIn is a great one this is just a profile of a prospect I was meeting with I noticed that she started out in LA and then became VP of Sales so I started my conversation with Laura to VP of Sales how on earth great way much better than how was your day Google past month so Google a company and killed and use the filter last month over here where it says past month and see what recent news was coming up and you'd be able to ask smart personal trainer questions like this Congrats on the 20 mil based on what I read it looks like you're using it to raise i'm enhance the platform do i have that right Twitter's also great notice that this person was doing a 10-day retreat again a really great way to show that you're the personal trainer and connect okay the conversation framework itself now we're actually on the call conversations happen over the span of multiple conversations I'm gonna be showing you this framework but it happens over the course of many dates for many different times and they all start off the same way with something called a C which is a connect so the second you get on this call to second your prospect picks up we want to connect with them why is that well take a look say we have two personal trainers and they're both awesome and equal but one of them you just don't like and one of them you just like more it made you laugh they made you smile you just liked them better when all things are equal you're gonna choose to do business with the person or the personal trainer you like and that's what this whole connecting thing is all about at the beginning of the call so what does fake connecting sound like this is an actual recording from a waiter salesperson Josh this is here how are you great how are you I'm doing okay yeah actually I had tried calling the number that you had left in me market analysis form it didn't go through and luckily I saw there was an alternative number here in your email signature oh no problem gladly I'm glad we connect him yeah yeah I actually I tried 6401 and apparently that's not that's not an active number so you got 64 - maybe there's a typo kaito for sure all right cool all right good I'm glad I was able to connect with you how are you today my goodness don't do that no reason for it's been five minutes eight ways to connect some ones that I've used notice how long they've been at the company right notice you've been at the Lloyd for 15 years what's kept you there or noticed you're a newbie out of all the places to work why Deloitte notice you climb Mount Kilimanjaro why on earth saw at the Christmas party you were wearing red pants does everyone wear wear wear red pants impressive client roster VP of Sales what makes you such a badass CEO notice you spent some time in Austin me - did you love it never been to Colorado convinced me why it's so amazing curious to know how are if things changed after the merger these are all great ways to start those first initial five seconds so you don't sound like that waiter salesperson if someone responds and says I'm having a frazzle day don't just go to the next question what might you say if someone says I'm having a frazzle day what might you say anybody type into the chat there what might you say you got some couple in there yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah I love it that's exactly it having a frazzle day a frazzle day no this is a technique I'm going to use right we talked about this before just repeat the last three words someone said and let them keep talking so many times I'm listening to conversations where people give you something you just keep rolling so don't think about what you're gonna stay next just concentrate on what they're saying just stay in the conversation right just stay in it people ask me like well how long should that go on as long as it goes man as long as you're feeling it there's no rush you don't have to have all these conversations in one conversation so that's the C next thing we're gonna do to come across like a personal trainer or not a waiter cuz we're gonna frame the call we want to lead the call we're not gonna ask people what do you want to talk about that's like a personal trainer saying how do you want to workout today so this is how you frame it in a professional way Chris thanks for carving out some time today I believe we have 30 minutes do I have that right pause and then some version of this for your company let me kick us off and take a couple minutes tell you how we've helped sales managers be more awesome and why we're different just two minutes and then I'd like to turn the tables and ask you a few questions to understand more about your situation and if not when if I'll do so and after that you can decide if you want to continue the conversation people decide to buy for their reasons and on their timeline not yours so part of our approach may get to the end of the conversation is to test to see if the prospect would like to continue talking with us not dictating to them that we want another meeting I'm not gonna ask them to give us a decision on the first date that would be like saying on the first date hey at the end of the state can you decide tell me if you want to have a second date at the beginning of the date it's awkward right Chris that's what I was hoping to do they anything else you'd like to cover so you'll write a version of this for you and after that connecting phase is over I'm gonna transition into this if you just did the see in the a you're automatically going to notice that you're going to feel much more in control automatically if you just worked on your confirm your prepare your C and your a next is s S stands for situation in order for us to recommend anything we have to understand where people are what's going on in their world and one of the first questions that I love to ask to be able to suss this out after my egg is some version of this hey I'm I know I reached out to you but of all the people you could be meeting with what prompted you don't want to chat with me today obviously this is an inbound you might say what prompted you to want to meet with us today and they'll they'll start spilling it and you might repeat their last three words and you might get all the information you really need in terms of their current situation out of this just one question but if you don't and people aren't divulging to you what's going on you might start to ask some questions of yourself now here's a red one and the reason it's red is because it's a waiter question right because I can research this before the meeting never ask a question that you can find out for yourself ever that's why this is red instead of asking where is your SDR team located that's a situation question I might say like this right tell me about your SDR team looks like they're located in Chicago Austin and Berlin trying to get a sense of their current team and their current situation taking advantage of the research that I did I might also ask what are you folks currently doing to whatever the thing is that you help people do better in my case set meetings next thing is we have to see if there's a way for us to get them away from something they don't want or move them towards something that's possible so these are opportunities I don't like to call them problems because remember only 10% of the people you speak would have a problem but they always are open to new ideas and perspectives for helping them do something better so I'm calling them opportunities all right so I'll learn a little bit about their situation and what they're doing I might say so how's that going so far and they may tell me y'all terrible and I want to listen are they trying to move away from something or are they trying to move towards something is there negative energy oh my gosh we are getting killed with regards to revenue or is it more up energy we're doing awesome but we want to do better we want to go from 30,000 to 35,000 if you're not getting anything you can try one of these opportunity pulling questions one of my favorite ones right what this kind of a question right typically the people that I work with tell me three things the rest er's aren't setting 20 meetings per month the ramp times taking too long now they're not sure how to improve their cold-calling skills um do any of these things resonate with you so this is a question where you are trying to have a hypothesis based on the people that you're working with of things they might be able to keep doing better so if you're not getting any information you may have to sort of hypothesize about the things that you help people with now here's the thing this is like a metal detector if it's not going off and it's not beeping in the oh the conversation is over if you can't get your metal detector to beep and beeping means you're not talking they're talking and you're saying the last three words and tell me what you mean by that there's energy behind the thing they want to get away from or what they want to move towards and they're just flat oh I don't know I don't work on that oh that's not my responsibility I don't really have anything to do with that I would get off the con so it looks looks like the types of things we do aren't a fit for you but if these things ever bubble up it might make sense to talk or is there some other people on your organization that you think might be challenged with some of these things but it's perfectly okay to end a first date early to save time next is summarized so after you've learned a little bit about your prospect situation and you've heard a little bit about what they want to get away from and what they want to move towards you want to make them feel heard so pause before you pitch and summarize what you heard you might say something like this it sounds like and you want to use their words not your words and if you do this right and this is how you know it's time to move forward you'll hear this some version of this that's right it's like you work here you got you got it you understand me this is a marker for you at this point in the conversation if you're not hearing that's right after you summarize something's wrong and back up don't proceed a check point for you after the summarize and after they say that's right we're gonna now build a little more credibility like the personal trainer we're not going to talk about our product or service but we are going to talk about it in the context of how we've helped someone else call this the customer story you know what what you told me I hear it a lot it's similar to someone else I was working with another manager just like you she's finding it difficult to get more sales qualified leads especially in an untapped market like you said and how to best improve our team's cold calling skills specifically as it relates to the hundreds of marketing leads that they're getting in I'm building my credibility because I've worked with other people I've helped other people get six-pack ABS before and then I just transitioned into the V which is the value or impact let's say this trend continues for you Lisa what happens we're trying to do is help people voice what happens if they continue to go down the road they're going down want to hear some energy here well I'm going to miss my numbers I potentially could miss my bonus I may have to start laying off some people I may lose my job these are all the things that'll happen if I stay on my current path and then here I go with those value questions right this is what was happening in the bike store you know it may ask do you know the difference between Trigger versus traditional cold calling and now prospects respond to them in different ways these are questions that I'm asking to get people thinking about new ideas or new perspectives right so in the example in a triathlon store are you familiar with the difference between your tires and these Gator tires and their effects on triathlon finish times no I didn't know that if you were selling the jacuzzi the waiter would say I'll just put your Jacuzzi in the personal trainer would say hey notice you have a teenage daughter have you considered putting lights in the jacuzzi so you can see what's happening back there at night these have you considered or do you know the difference questions are the things that separate master conversations from waiter conversations have you considered using direct mail to increase your outreach response rates like one of these questions sound like for your business so you can get people thinking about what's possible things they haven't considered yet very powerful questions have you considered using different outreach strategies based on the importance of your targets just some questions that I well what do you mean by that and then I start to educate them on what's possible and what's going on in the industry with some of their peers and this pulls people toward me much more so than a waiter next is I start to do Q which is qualifying if I this far in the conversation this could be my fourth or fifth conversation I want to see if people want to even change this and this is how I ask the question I ask it in sort of a way that gives them an opportunity to say no right so assume you're just seeing what's out there and aren't really looking to change anytime soon no no no we are looking to change soon I want to know if this is something that's important to them and at the top of mind because if it's not I don't want to spend my time right so some version of is this something you ready you're looking to change now I also want to know if they've ever done something like this before because it tells me if they have precedent buying the types of things that I'm selling right I know I'm a unique snowflake but if you guys ever brought in a sales mentor like me before yes or no I also like to ask who else is involved in these types of things so the way I'd like to ask it in a very non salesy friendly way is um you're the only one that needs to weigh in on this right you run the joint and people usually laugh and say no no no no we got to involve Bob lose it and I start to get a sense of who the people with that have authority are to be able to move things forward should they decide to move forward and then there early on the conversation a qualified conversation I talk about money and here's how I talk about it very early on before I pitch I say let's talk about money gotta know like do you have a Groupon and I pause people usually get a chuckle and I'm trying to diffuse sales pressure know I would have a Groupon you know at a high level based on what you're trying to achieve finishing the triathlon in under four hours requires an investment of between 15 and 20 K we take MasterCard Visa American Express and we start talking about price early they might say I got to run this by Bob I might say well how do you think he would respond I want to get price out early and after I've shown value so we don't get to this big moment at the end where we're surprising people with it next after I've done that I want to ask people if they want to continue the conversation with me so here's how I do it right feels like we may be able to help you folks with your fireball based on what you told me I've got a couple ideas right off the bat that might be helpful but I notice we're kind of out of time Lisa where would you like to go from here and your prospects will tell you and it's such a much better position to be in than you telling them oh we got a rope bobbin what's his role well he's an IT and he's gonna want to see this but would it make sense to put some time on the calendar tentatively check his calendar and reel him in yeah yeah that would make sense Lisa where would you like to go from here right or what next step if any would you like to take I'm gonna test to see if the prospect wants me to be their guide going forward I want them coming to me not the other way around the opposite of this is saying let's schedule some time on Tuesday and you may be able to badger your person into scheduling another meeting but they'll probably cancel it's a yes trap and they're saying it just to get you off the phone but with this approach you're putting your prospect in control which is really the only way because people buy for their reasons not yours and you're testing to see if they want you as their guide and it also feels a lot better I've also said you know would it make sense to rope Irina in or Lisa in or your boss in it would again we want to put your prospect in control that's how I end these initial first sales conversations before we break into QA I've got a special Oh one more little thing after the meeting again to be that personal trainer send a little summary of what you spoke about nothing fancy but just something like this you know here's what we discussed here's what your fireballs are and here's what the next meeting is you can see I have it scheduled here March 15th at 6 p.m. so one of the approaches is if you don't have a next meeting scheduled if your prospect hasn't agreed it's not a real opportunity and your prospect gets to control that not you if your prospect agrees to a next meeting you send a summary of the conversation here's the offer in my opinion nothing can affect your bottom line more your revenue or your pocketbook from our sales performance perspective than increasing your sales conversations for free if you go to the sales DNA that coat slash talk page you can select the time with me and we'll have a little conversation about your conversations and if it's a fit we could talk about how I can coach you on your conversations and what that often looks like is people ask their prospects permission to record their calls and then I analyze them with them on the phone after their conversations over and we kind of go through it and talk about the framework one thing they did well one thing didn't go well and after two or three conversations they've significantly up their game they're spending way less time chasing and more time winning deals so again it's a free offer sales DNA dot KO slash talk to chat a little bit about your business and personalize this framework around your company