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as I mentioned I'm Jane leer I'm excited to share with you today what we've been learning through piloting different approaches to measuring gender attitudes and behaviors in Sierra Leone for the school me project so I'm going to share our experience with three different tools a child assessment classroom observation and a teacher self assessment so for each tool I'm going to go through and present briefly what the what the objective is some of the key findings and then I'll talk about how we've used the data and some of the challenges and successes we've had in doing so so school me is a Save the Children program being piloted in Sierra Leone and Cote d'Ivoire I'm speaking just to the work that we've done in Sierra Leone today since that's where we've had the opportunity to pilot more tools and we have a much bigger sample size overall school need aims to increase primary school completion rates and improve learning outcomes for boys and girls and specifically through supporting families schools and communities to identify and challenge the root causes of gender-based disparities generating shifts and attitudes and behaviors in favour of gender equity in terms of intervention activities school me starts with gender training for all staffs and this is really key and then at the community level school me works through partnerships with core groups of community stakeholders to identify and put into action plans to address the barriers to gender equity and education at the school level school me consists of in-service teacher training and gender sensitive pedagogy and literacy and numeracy instruction and then at the institution level we work through partnerships with mest that's the ministry Education and Science and Technology local police authorities and family support units which are police entities that respond to domestic violence incidents in the community so this is one of the first times that Save the Children is implementing a education program that focuses explicitly on shifting norms about gender so in Sierra Leone we're doing a proof-of-concept study assessing the impact of school needs to request a randomized controlled trial all of the tools I'm going to share with you today have been developed through an iterative process sourcing pre-existing tools piloting and adapting going back and Reap islet e and adapting also informed through qualitative data collection at two different time points for this webinar I'm focusing just on the tools that are highlighted here the child assessment classroom observation and teacher pre/post assessment because these are our main metrics that we're using for measuring shifts in gender biases and gender attitudes over time and to clarify end line data collection is being collected as we speak so today I'm just sharing baseline and baseline data stay tuned for end line data I think this presentation will hopefully be a lot more interesting in a few months and we have Edline data to share our overarching research objective for the program has been to explore how context at the school home and community and gender biases power imbalances within these contexts shaped children's learning and well-being over time and in response to programming this research question is how is illustrated in this empowerment framework I have here and I've also put this here to emphasize that the gender related measures I'm sharing today are just one component of the measures that were outcomes were measuring to evaluate our progress they're a key component but I think the real power in having this information comes from being able to link it to outcomes at the environmental level these are the Greens the green circles you have here and at the child level foundational competencies so the emotional learning and well-being so the first tool I'll share is the child assessment of gender attitudes this is adopted from the gender equity movement in schools tools I see are W the the way this works is enumerators read aloud a series of statements about desert norms related to education and girls and boys say if they agree or disagree this graph shows the baseline data from Sierra Leone we see in red the percent of boys who agree with each statement and in orange the percent of girls who agree with each statement so it's pretty interesting to see the differences between what girls think versus what boys think with boys being much more likely to adhere to unequal gender norms but these AI feelings are pretty common among girls too for example nearly one in four girls think that girls need less school than boys more than two-thirds of boys think boys are smarter than girls but nearly one in three girls also agree and as I mentioned some of the real useful information we can get from this is being able to link it to data at the from our caregiver survey about the home learning environment and learning outcomes assess at the child level so some of what we've done through that analysis we've looked at the factors that predict adherence the unequal gender norms and we see that child sex is a strongest predictor so boys are much more likely to adhere to unequal gender norms than girls exposure to physical violence against women in the household again this data comes from the caregiver survey and peer gender norms so the more children in their class adhere to unequal gender norms the more likely the individual also is to endorse these statements we also looked at the relationship between gender attitudes gender-based violence at the household and learning outcomes and we find that greater female participation in household decisions is associated with greater likelihood of being able to read and children whose caregivers reports that women in their household are physically abused have lower self-concept the next tool I'll share today is classroom observations of gender dynamics and this is really more of an example of a lesson learned something we tried that did not work so well the goal was to measure teachers expectations and differential treatment of boys versus girls and it was meant to be a routine monitoring type tool something that could be easily implemented by our field staff Ministry of Education partner's head teachers without requiring extensive training so to that end we focused on the frequency of different types of interactions and of course frequency really only scratches the surface of what's happening in the classroom and doesn't necessarily speak to the quality but again we wanted this to be a fairly straightforward tool that could be implemented repeatedly kind of as a coaching and monitoring the tool and here I put just a snapshot of a few items from the analysis in brief we found that this tool was not very useful you see we have here the average frequency for positive and negative interactions teacher-student interactions and these are just a few examples the tool itself includes many more interactions for each category but overall we find no important differences between how teachers treat boys and girls in terms of positive and negative interactions classroom tours and responsibilities but we see from the teachers responses to an open-ended survey I think I forgot to mention that at the end of the classroom observation the observer asked the teacher a series of brief questions about their expectations about girls and boys learning and perceived abilities in the classroom and we found large differences between teachers expectations of how girls versus boys are doing in the classroom so this did go both ways there were some teachers who said girls were more capable than boys but overall there is a tendency to think that boys participate more and have more of an interest in schools than girls so we know there's more to the story but we weren't able to capture it with this classroom observation tool another major concern was that we had really low interval I billet II so that means basically that if two observers are in one classroom observing the same lesson they would have pretty different tallies for the frequency of different interactions so ultimately we decided or we thought about so there's many explanations for for why this could be happening first of all observations aren't natural teachers and students inevitably change their behavior when the observer steps in 30 minutes might not be long enough to get meaningful data on classroom gender dynamics also as I mentioned the checklist focuses on just the frequency of interaction so it doesn't really pick up deeper aspects of quality and also we had a relatively small sample size 54 observations but the difference is that we did see we're practically insignificant they're very small so this suggests that it's probably not just a matter of sample size and ultimately we decided to really collect meaningful reliable classroom observations of gender dynamics would require extended fieldwork led by experienced researchers which was just not feasible for this project so in order to measure what teachers learn from the workshops and gender sensitive pedagogy and see how they change their classroom attitudes and behavior we decided to use instead a teacher pre post self-assessment this tool measures teachers knowledge of gender the difference between gender versus sex their understanding of gender sensitive pedagogy their attitudes towards gender identity and practices in response to violence and sexual harassment in the classroom and the perceived problems or issues that they see in their school environment the self-assessment so teachers fill this out in this case they filled it out on the first day of the school based workshop in gender sensitive pedagogy and then again they'll fill it out again at endline or at the end of the intervention overall findings are summarized here we find in general pretty low understanding of the differences between gender versus sex support for gender equality and professional activities that's the attitude index number one here so that means that in general teachers agreed that men and women are equally capable of being a doctor University professor school teacher politician but we found underlying resentment for men and caregiving domestic tour roles and for the idea of boys and girls training household tour D ratings you can see the chrome chrome box alpha here but some findings to highlight to assess class to assess teachers practices they were presented with hypothetical scenarios of student on student physical conflict or violence and sexual harassment in the classroom and asked how they would respond so the vast majority more than eighty percent said they would intervene but there's not a clear understanding of what counts as physical violence against children so 72 percent of teachers say they cane students to discipline them both boys and girls no difference here between caning boys versus girls students and 15 percent of teachers did not consider asking children for sex to be a form of violence against children in terms of issues that teachers identified as problems in their school for both boy and girl students the concern most frequently identified by teachers was that families neglect their role in children's education for girls early pregnancy early marriage being too shy in class are also common problems and this is true for boys as well especially girls and then issues of female genital cutting and being sexually harassed or abused an alarmingly high percent of teachers say that this is a problem for girl students and this is interesting we know from other sources that these issues are prevalent in the context but our qualitative research interviews with children and caregivers these issues came up a little bit but much less frequently which I think has to do with just overall taboos and talking about this to research and equality to researchers in a qualitative setting but it did come out very strong in the survey of teachers so for all of these tools together how are we using the findings first in terms of research and program design we're getting a better understanding of the gender socialization process in these contexts so we're programming and in particular the link between gender biases unequal gender norms and behaviors and education outcomes second for advocacy and resource development the descriptive findings from the child assessment for example the percent of children who think that boys are smarter than girls this information is not necessarily that surprising to our colleagues in country or to those of us who have experience in these contexts but the findings have some been somewhat of an attention-grabber for Western audiences I think helping us highlight the urgency of focusing on gender biases and gender norms and it as an essential part of improving gender equality and education and learning outcomes overall for programming the finding on gender on children's attitudes towards gender norms have been useful as a starting point for the conversations that our field staff facilitate at the community level the teacher survey is helping us decide which areas to focus on for teacher trainings and then of course these are our main tools for measuring our progress over time and our impact where possible so challenges there are many first social desirability bias so are these reliable measures are we measuring what people really think what they really do or just what they think they should say the answer is that with these tools these tools don't really allow us to differentiate between what respondents think they should say versus what they actually believe and what they're doing in practice so we probably have a mix of what the norms are in this context and also what the individuals believe there are tools that do attempt to isolate individual attitudes and behaviors from expectations about what others do and what others approve of or in other words norms these are newer tools and we're piloting them in Sierra Leone right now so it'll be interesting to be able to compare and contrast second effectively communicating and using the findings has been somewhat of a challenge as well I think for Western audiences there's much more of an appetite for these kinds of measures but there's still a large number of donors who still want to see tangible inputs and outputs and don't really know what to make of the these gender attitudes data it's also challenging to make these findings meaningful for program participants program participants and even our own field staff want to see concrete results improved education access better school conditions and the idea that many people think boys are smarter than girls is not necessarily new or meaningful information to them so the utility of this research for the communities can sometimes be harder to justify a third challenge I think it ties along with that the data that we have focuses on a somewhat narrowly defined definition of gender biases and attitude so the data that we have focuses on this kind of more negative portrayal of how gender biases and attitudes affect children's educational experiences but we know that gender norms are dynamic they are actively contested and challenged by voice and girls themselves I struggle with how to move beyond this binary notion when doing quantitative research that is meant to be represented representative of the population in the impact area I will mention that there are many excellent examples of participatory methods and qualitative methods that really put the power in the hands of girls themselves and I wish we had been able to do more of that for this project but as you all know we have to balance expectations and limited resources and our goal in this case was to have quantitative measures that could be generalized to the population of interest to see how these norms are shifting over time in response to our programming if I could do it all over again I think first I would want to prioritize just three to four behaviors and attitudes for programming and for research rather than attempting to kind of do it all we focus on this in this program with measuring gender attitudes at the household level division of responsibilities and power between mothers and fathers for example and helpful chores for daughters versus son prioritization of education to some extent child marriage sRGB be at schools and we know these issues are all related and you can't we focus on just one without thinking about the other but I think one lesson learned for me in particular for thinking about which norms we're trying to really critically measure I would want to prioritize just three to four based on strong formative research prior to programming and survey design second I would want tools to better document the community participants perceived relevance buy-in ownership of and participation in the program activities and finally I'd want to invest not just in the research itself but really in time and resources for the program staff partners and participants to use the findings I think this is especially important for things like these gender attitudes data gender norms gender biases which are for for our field staff for our community participants this is new new new kinds of data new things to be thinking through and I would have loved to have more time to really interpret and use the findings together I put a list of resources here these are all very much measurement focused I think I'll share these with Sujata afterwards so that she can send to all the participants and finally just want to mention that this has been very much a team effort so a huge thank you to our program participants our colleagues at mest and local institutions and all the school me staffs and of course the the Save the Children Korea donors who have made all this possible and thanks to all of you for bearing with us with the technical difficulties and please do reach out to me I know I kind of went over things very top level here I'm more than happy to talk offline or in the question answer session about how more about the analyses that were doing the challenges we've had in piloting and more the technical properties of these tools so thank you very much I'll hand it over back to you Sujata Thank You Jane that was that was a very informative presentation a lot of things to think about in terms of the implications for policy and also measurement it's a different way of looking at things and you're right to say that the demand from my donors and from from the communities more quantitative and results focus so what does that mean for this kind of work interesting next we move to show him II I said good morning good afternoon good evening everybody where you are I'm delighted to present to you breakthroughs journey of of implementing a gender equity program across 150 government schools in a district called Haryana which has all the regressive practices against girls and women as you could think of you saw what the program was so I'm not ready to go into details about the program too much but just a few few details about the program it was a school-based intervention where we created youth clubs in schools you know the schools are called gang of stars and the byline was if you win I win so you know children were kind of encouraged to find the the stars within themselves the intervention site were four districts and the time period of 2014 to raise 16 and we addressed classes of 6 to 9 students both boys and girls we started with a orientation of the principal and a training of the teachers in the similar way that that Jane mentioned in the earlier presentation we had an RCT attached to the program which is a randomized controlled trial which is one of the good standards of evaluation and I believe in India it was one of the first first our city done on gender equity or gender based attitude and behavior change so it was a and I'll come to the learnings of an RCT later on but but just a little bit more about the curriculum the curriculum really you know the will really looked at psychosocial and interpersonal skills of adolescence and abling them to build their agency by being confident by being able to take inform decisions communicate effectively develop develop they're coping and self-managed and skills to change behaviors and influence decisions related to their education career aspiration mobility safety age of marriage health accessing education and health services boys and the the curriculum are interactive participatory fun games that they play in their everyday lives and after each session they were given a small you know exercise so that they could go home and practice it with their parents and have an intergenerational dialogue with their parents on this kind of issues which is not very common in India 45-minute sessions in classrooms we had 30 such sessions in the schools over the over the two and a half years that we work and we have 12 assembly sessions meant for the whole school because we just didn't want girls and boys from 6 7 8 9 to be able to participate in a program we wanted the whole school but of course we didn't have resources for all of that are coming to the impact evaluation the strategy you know how the strategy worked was that we would empower students to this curriculum called gang of stars principals teachers can be influenced through our training and we also had one teacher was a guiding star in the program in each classroom they would be in each other be one teacher would be throughout there for the whole journey and parents and community would be further mobilized through our community mobilization activities using media technology and you know other kind of tools like theater street theatre local songs have you know meetings at night when the men comes home so that we can reach out to them as well the study was very very you know designed in a randomized way so we had 314 schools and we choose about 150 schools would have the treatment and 164 schools where we will not do anything and we'll see the results at the end of the of three years the the the evaluation has you know three main things actually we wanted to see is the program effective at changing participating students general attitudes does attitudinal change translate actually into behavior change does the intervention have a different impact on male and female participants and finally what is the cost-effectiveness of this kind of an intervention can we scale it up across many other schools or not we surveyed fourteen thousand eight hundred and ten students at the baseline so you know you can imagine it was a large large database I'm happy to say that at the end line we were left with thirteen thousand nine hundred and eighty nine only eight hundred and ten students had dropped off from the system which was very very heartening data for us in India where you know girls drop off school and they reach puberty we didn't have was we had a retention rate of ninety four point two percent which is super super great for us the baseline was done in winter of 2013 and the end line was not done in winter of 2016 17 so actually three years of intervention with the same cohort in school so we started with you know 18,000 students we you know completed with 18,000 students - the ones who had already graduated out of school so that was the cohort that we looked at coming to the outcomes you know and how we designed the design the research was that the gen we developed a gendered attitude index there were 18 questions on attitudes towards gender equity and I'll come to the questions in details a little later there was a gender expeditions index to see whether the Sam boys aspirations about themselves their careers their education is moving or not and there and to see whether and there are 12 questions to see whether the general attitudes actually translating into gender behavior yeah what were the you know what were the questions like yeah so the gender you know questions like should I pretend it happens or it should be allowed to get more opportunities and resources for education than does men are better suited than women to work outside of the house or as we sometimes also created a vinius for for the participants to imagine so for example marriage suppose I was a character a girl to whom marriage is more important than her job what would happen to pooja you know if she continued to believe that so we create a small little vignettes on education where if you are the head of the family who would you have sent to the town for further studies your daughter or your son so we gave them small little vignettes to imagine to explore to understand their own perceptions and to understand what the society you know demands from them so the way the vignettes are really really important and they kind of gave us really rich data on the perceptions towards things that were important in the in the education in the in the framework which is education early marriage the gender expeditions index focused in as I said five questions have you ever discussed your educational goals with your parents or adult relatives if I am talking about extremely marginalized extremely poor communities where education is not a priority and world's education is not given a you know a lesser five priority than that and so there is very little conversation about education in these kind of households what is the highest level of education you would like to complete if financials an opportunity of school and colleges are available to you remember most of these households were you know where where women have either not been to school at all or have dropped off school they're rarely anybody in this in this database was whose mother actually or a female member of the household has actually completed education so difficult for them to kind of imagine what it would be like the gender behavior index so we were starting out with a hypothesis that the intervention will increase gender equitable behavior among stories in the treatment schools and what were we looking at we're looking at whether the children will be comfortable and interact with the opposite gender just to give you a little snippet of what the schools were like a lot of the schools were co-ed but you know sometimes there was a wall between the girls section and the boys section there will be different timings for boys attendance and girls attendance there would be no interaction when we add the baseline there was no interaction between the boys and girls they would not be talking to each other did not be sitting together even if this come to one you know our initial community mobilization events girls will be sitting our front boys would be at the back and no interaction so we wanted to see whether they would be at the end of our intervention would be more comfortable and interact more with the opposite gender girls would have more autonomy and engage in you know traditional household work activities because girls would not stop coming to school because they would have to look after younger siblings or do household chores so a number of questions that captured the behaviors of children together form this index what were those questions you know these are here how frequently have you been teased whistled at or called names in the past one week did you cook clean wash dishes and did other you know household chores have you missed school due to household based opportunity in your chores were you able to talk to your parents about what you would like to do in future what type of chores we do at home and this was both for boys and girls like do you do cooking cleaning dishes taking care of siblings you know do your siblings help each other so some of these questions form the basis of the gender behavior index the results we were really really happy and and really kind of gratified to see that the results indicated significant gender attitudes increase in significant gender attitude index both among boys and girls and there was increase in equitable behavior especially among boys significantly there was not there were some changes in the aspirations index but it was not very robust to call it significant I will come to the details right now so some of the main findings was this and this was you know because it's an statistical and a quantitative study it's focused on a standard deviation metric so if this was you know gender attitudes in texts and the orange one would be the aspirations index and that is the behavioral index and this was the kind of increase that you could see there was a zero point zero point two standard deviation in behavior change in boys and zero point one standard deviation in behavior change for girls and I'll come why the difference and what are we doing about it I'll come to it a little later there's a four percentage point increase on general attitude index which is indeed indicates a significant improvement in gender attitude and three percentage point increase in gender behavior index you know the average score at 64 percent at baseline where 100 percent stands for fully gender equity will attitudes and the further for the gender behavior index the average score I was at 79 percent at baseline a 100 percent stands for fully gender equity ball behavior so some of the things that you could see is that the general attitude sub-indices so employment fertility attitude towards female gender roles you know it would see significant increase in understanding and in a change in attitude towards female gender roles there was also significant you know attitude change towards employment opportunities for both girls and boys and the attitude that girls should be allowed to work and families should actually fare better if both men and women work education was also something that moved quite a bit and those should be educated they should be at least allowed to complete secondary education in some cases girls should be allowed to study as long as they want to and as much as they want to the fertility excuse didn't show any significant change mainly because we were working in schools and of course in India you know we cannot talk about sex education or reproductive rights and held in schools you know we were told you cannot talk about sex so you know he we kind of didn't want to upset the whole apple cart we did talk a little bit about safe menstrual hygiene and you know menstrual cactuses but also very limited it was mostly you know on from a health perspective so not much change in that but though there was a little bit of you know movement in that as well so this is the control and the treatment at the pink ones are the control where we had started at the baseline and you can see it has more or less remained at the baseline while at the control you know there is a significant improvement at controls which is the 150 villages and three years down the line what we taught is that the gender attitudes can also be impacted by other factors which was being a female or what was your parental gender attitudes you know and so to put the impacts of the breakthrough the intervention in context being a girl increase the gender attitude index by 0.577 standard deviations and treatment effectives you know so so what happened also that we when if for example this children came from parents who had very strong jaded discriminatory attitudes at the base line at the end line we saw those parents have actually moved halfway and more throughout that scale so they're very gender discriminatory attitudes have actually changed to comparable you know typical gender attitudes and have changed to a certain extent to equitable gender at each gender behavior index again as you can see at the control it remained the same from inline to a baseline to inline at the treatment it has improved significantly so what would the behavior sub innocence that we tried to kind of talk about and and and examine was interaction with the opposite sex and it had in turn you know increased a lot it has increased by 0.2 standard deviation by the end of the intervention participation mobility of girls had also increased you know girls were being allowed at the end of the intervention to go out alone or go out with their friends to markets to movie halls to other you know places to school go alone on to schools as well we didn't see too much you know improvement in participation in household chores or even decision making but I guess you know it's a three-year intervention so we will see it a little bit more as time goes by and we kind of increase the number of years a number of intervention ah one of the things that I want to just talk about before I show you the way forward is that there was a significant difference between gender attitudes change gender behavior change among boys and girls boys were able to translate attitude into behavior much more quickly than girls were this was something that struck us as as significant and one of the reasons that we found as we started speaking about this and working with on this we saw that one of the things was that girls the boys had a longer curves to kind of learn of love learning to go through than the girls you know I remember the girls you know gender deviation and the standard deviation of girls understanding of gender equity was 0.5 and the boys were much longer to learn but more importantly there were social sanctions on the boys to change their behavior which was non fare for girls which means I work with girls we have to continue in our work where you girls will have to also have a component of bringing in the society and the community together to be able for them to give permission or to allow the girls to be able to take decisions on their own make their own career choices you know and make decisions about themselves so what we are before before the way forward I just want to kind of you know focus on what else we are doing for the cost-effective analysis is still not done we are still doing the cost effective analysis we are trying to kind of work out behavioral games in schools so that we could understand a little bit more about the changes we have planned a long-term follow-up service of the households so this was at an individual level we want to now kind of focus on some of the households where girls have completed education or where there is employment of female students and male students male students wives age of marriage and childbearing sex composition of children so what we are doing is we are following a cohort of girls now for the next three years you know we just kind of started writing up the concept note looking for money looking for resources along with j-pal who are who are partners in the study studying some of the girls who were part of see casually going forward that this good as as about breakthroughs are we are streamlining the - them into 42 sessions over the - over two years so 30 sessions will be much went to a stations we have about another 15 minutes left so I'd like to open the floor to questions and if we don't have enough then we can play the movie towards the end okay and so I do actually have a question for sure honey yes so in the original school curriculum how many sessions did boys and girls go through education 30 sessions yes this is Nora speaking thank you very much to both Janos Joe Heaney they were extremely interesting and rich research experiences from which we can learn a lot one question I'd like to ask both of you is about the preparation of those who were the frontline actors in the case of training the teachers you were very carefully trying to understand gain the impact of the training approach what did you learn about that and how you do things differently and so Heaney the importance of preparing your frontline actors is going to be must be critical to the effectiveness of this program can you tell us something about how well and how you prepared the the the teachers and the other community actors to support this program and make sure we see your the interactions were effective maybe Jayne you could go first yeah thanks Nora that's a great question can everyone hear me yes please go ahead okay so how did we prepare the frontline actors I think I had a one line in there and one of my slides that the school media intervention starts with a training for our program staff because really those are the field staff those are the first frontline actors who it's really important that they have a clear understanding of why we're focusing shifting gender attitudes and we that we don't make any assumptions assumptions that those who work with us already have all of this figured out so big piece of school media I think has been perhaps most meaningful is just the training for our own staffs the children's long training called gender champions training that walks through issues of gender biases gender identity gender roles in participant zone lives their home experiences growing up at the workplace etc so that's a good kind of way to get make sure that everyone's on the same same page to start with and then for the the teachers yes this self-assessment is how were the one that I shared today that was kind of the baseline that sapote the pretest so before teachers had started learning about gender sensitive pedagogy so that was again useful to see kind of where they're starting from and I think in fairly on it's interesting because there's been a lot of different or a big emphasis on girls education lately so you can see just visibly billboards around the country and everyone you talk to seems to have this idea that we've got to get girls in schools but at least my perception is that it's kind of surface level right now so and I think that kind of came out in the teacher surveys you see that all of them have an understanding that yes gender equity and education is important but it's kind of limited to just getting girls into schools and not necessarily thinking through some of the deeper issues and so right now I can't I don't know yet how successful the teacher trainings have been because we haven't done the post tests yet but that'll be really useful to see how attitudes and reported behaviors have changed as teachers put the learnings into practice and it's a series of school based session so it's meant to be who's meant to be space kind of in between each each workshop at the school level so the teachers have a chance to put into practice what they're learning come back interact with head teachers and other peer teachers for the the next session so it's a process and we'll have the the post data within the next month or so q very much Jane sure honey do you have a response yeah I'll highlight to three things one was that we had a partnership with the local Education Department so we got the permission from the government to enter the schools and also to do teacher training throughout our program so we first started with a principals orientation and I think we did a follow-up orientation one and a half years down the line but those are short interactions with the teachers we spend actually quite a bit of time so we did we did go through a genderized sexuality training which is a customized for break through programs and a training on the on the turkey and the gang of stars curriculum with the teachers at the beginning of the program and we did follow-ups every year bringing them together in one room we selected one teacher to be in every class to be a part of the program and we called them the lodestar because he saw the guiding star because he or she was the guiding star of these children and and over the years you know we saw that in the schools where the teachers were most proactive most you know participative the children learn so much more you know and some of the some of the things that we saw you know that we could really address within the schools with this curriculum as well was that initially in the classrooms when we would enter we would see on the table a long big stick because you know corporal punishment was part of the norm children would be getting beaten up both girls and more boys than girls though but what girls and boys I'm happy to say that the end of the you know 1/2 years of our intervention the sticks started disappearing and so that was the amount of kind of intervention we could do in the schools our staff as Jane mentioned went through a huge training of you know five-day training on again gender sexuality human rights which is very pretty much break through those own customized training but you know but on each session you know we would design up to four or five sessions and then call in our staff for an intervention and a training on how to you is that so that happened I think maybe six times a year initially and then petered off to maybe a couple of times in the last two years and now you know as we are planning to scale up we're planning to do it you know one big training and then refresher courses annually that kind of a thing because we also kept adding new things into the curriculum as the sessions went by but now it's pretty much standard and set in stone so I don't think we need to do so many followers but initially we did so many follow-ups we you know we each session probably we handle the facilitators and took them through the training we also had a scale up program to this where we we trained teachers from an organization called Pratham which is very well known school program and we have some data to show from there as well we also worked with Save the Children but that was on mostly on community mobilization and very interesting data to show from that as well so yeah a lot of training a lot of you know refreshers and a lot of courses happened so the question is can you say a few words about what you've learned about how the gender indices were using are correlated with households social demographic characteristics and also with other outcomes like well-being dropping out of school grades um so yeah that's a great question and one of the I think one of the more rich information that we've been able to get from the baseline data is looking at what the predictors of gender attitudes among children are by linking that to household socio demographic characteristics so what we found is that things that you may think would be correlated like household socioeconomic status religion education are not correlated at all I took mother education is weakly correlated the strongest predictor was violence against exposure to violence against women in the household which was correlated with greater adherence to unequal gender norms and as far as linking to learning outcomes since this program for school me it's tool based so the children at baseline who we interviewed we're all in school so right now we don't have data on dropout but we will attend line what we do have is links to learning outcomes literacy skills and social-emotional skills in the case of Sierra Leone and we see that I don't want to get this wrong I have it in my side so let me open it up we see that for the gender attitudes were very weakly correlated with lower self-concept and literacy skills but the magnitude of correlation is very strong are very weak the same thing at our end we were we had there was no so we were it was moved from same kind of a socio-economic background it was government schools you know poor children from marginalized backgrounds so no effect on socioeconomic status so right now where we did it has a very strong sandpaper preference in the community so houses with inevitably houses where more sons were there had much more you know regressive gender attitude even houses where there were girls and if we could show you the movie I could show you they would often kind of cut up the hair and make them wear boys clothes to kind of have an aspiration having a boy so so not much where mothers were educated a little bit more there was some correlation but not a very strong where fathers really kind of stood up and took decisions and and and and helped girls in incomplete education or continuing your education we saw some significant changes happen there because you know decision making in these kind of socioeconomic backgrounds are mostly resting with the eldest male members of the household so we saw some significant changes happen there where father stood up and supported their girls create one more question that I see is how did you control for response bias what Jane and you showing me okay Jane you go first sure um so this has been a work in progress and I think with the gender attitudes there's really there's really no way of isolating you know what to what extent the children especially are just saying what they think is the correct answer due to whatever norms are in their context or what they think their friends would say what they think their parents would say or what they truly believe so we do our best through a numerator training and through the piloting to make sure that the wording is very straightforward and easy for children to respond and all of the kind of introduction rapport building that the enumerators do but it's a it's a real bias that it's hard to eliminate with any kind of attitudinal scale so I think what we're doing now in Sierra Leone is piloting a new approach that asks about individual behaviors and attitudes as well as expectations about others so that tries to differentiate what the norms are in the context to what the individual believes but even with that tool there's still a risk of social desirability bias so I think it's an important consideration there's other ways to do it as well like having just asking about the same behavior but phrasing it positively and negatively and comparing students responses to that so it's an important concern and something that we're still working to address effectively I'd say yeah perhaps you know the indices we developed were actually helpful in doing some of that and there were very very specific questions that we had we had done so well when we were and as Jen said very straightforward questions very simple questions very real questions in terms of you know and they were all in local languages so the so we were able to kind of really get responses that were there the media was something was which was difficult to control and you know it might have spilled into the control control areas as well but because there was no follow up and there was no no kind of you know other kind of push for community response in those I think we will manage manage to can you know managed to keep the control bias under under control great this has been a wonderful session thank you so much to look to a view for rave presentations and to the participants for their patience and have a good morning evening afternoon to everyone