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hi everybody my name is Josiah also known as chilling silence and today I want to give a bit of a chat with you about Schnoor signatures in did you buy date and wife nor is not a snore hopefully you'll find this really interesting you'll get a lot out of this and let's get stuck straight into it so this presentation is on snore signatures taproot the implications around them hopefully by the end of this you will be in a position where you will agree that snore signatures are going to be beneficial for did you might to implement so for those of you who are unfamiliar with me my name is Josiah speck Minh and I do did you buy things I've given a number of presentations such as this one I run a YouTube channel where I do daily updates on what's happening with digibytes I run the digibind & Friends the podcast I do talks at universities crypto groups for other streamers I usually talk about digi fight but also about crypto currency and blockchain in general now I am an unpaid volunteer as we all are with did you bite due to there being no ICO and no centralized entity controlling things on behalf of did you buy did you buy it as a permissionless blockchain whereby anybody can speak on behalf of it and as such Here I am today so let's get started with a little bit of history first and foremost before we dive into what Schnoor signatures are and why we want them so first of all Shanor signatures themselves are not new they were originally created in the 80s by a German cryptographer by the name of Klaus Schnoor he's an absolute genius who retired in 2011 after spending 40 years at the johann wolfgang goethe let's have a pronounce that correctly university in frankfurt now he patented Schnoor signatures in a 1989 now this expired in 2008 now which is the the key night amongst you will notice actually happened about a year before bitcoin was launched in 2009 Satoshi it seems was more interested in utilizing ECDSA now this is probably due to their popularity being more widely understood due to them being open source and it's pretty important when you are building an open source and permissionless blockchain however Klaus wasn't the only one playing around with public key cryptography and a variant of Schnoor signatures was developed called DSA now this is the digital signature algorithm this was created by the NSA in the early 90s it too is patented but it's royalty-free so DSA was the precursor to ECDSA which was created in the late nineties with the EC and EC dan and ECDSA standing for elliptic curve so ECDSA the elliptic curve digital signature algorithm this is what bitcoin uses and currently also did you might as well although it's not quite as good as noir signatures it's basically good enough with DSA and ECDSA being very widely used today so should know what signatures are better than ECDSA for a number of reasons especially now that the patent has expired first of all the size now these are a fair bit smaller which is great for squashing an even more data into the existing block sizes now this is important because it improves the efficiency of the data stored on the blockchain rather than simply growing the raw brach size snow signatures are not malleable - yeah malleable for those unfamiliar kind of think of gold gold as malleable you can bend in and you can modify a little bit so you know signatures are not able to be modified and changed as ECDSA signatures are with the original set up in Bitcoin the transactions were valuable and this is what the Mount GOx exchange claimed caused him to lose hundreds of thousands of bitcoins though this has been contested with other studies showing it was under five hundred BTC lost which at the time was worth four-fifths of nothing Bitcoin used segregated witness or cygwin to solve the malleability of transactions but snores signatures aren't inherently malleable so that's nice and it's part of the reason why Bitcoin cash implemented Schnoor signatures last year now there are mathematical linearity benefits to snore signatures as well where you can take the effective sum of signatures and verify that they are all legitimate with just one single validation so that speeds things up a bit there's a bunch of innovations that this enables which I'll go into a little bit further later on privacy improvements are also a nice addition because every transaction on the blockchain looks the same so where existing multisig addresses are currently beginning with the number three this could be changed in the future whereby a multi-sig transaction looks exactly the same as a signed transaction this is the result of the linearity that I mentioned earlier so with Schnoor signatures a two of three multi-sig address your public key doesn't have to be known by the network nor does the details of who you've entered into this multi-sig arrangement with naturally as a result this increases the privacy of each person in this multi save arrangement however with that said I want to be clear about nor signatures not directly making did you buy a privacy coin this is similar to what we did with dandelion which Bitcoin is now also implemented where by we improve the privacy aspects in subtle yet significant ways and it does definitely open up more avenues in the future so to clarify with an example let's say we take Hans Ruger and Rudy as the creators of a wallet that required two out of three of them to sign a transaction at the moment the network would have to know the public key and we would know that Hans and Rutger were the ones that signed a particular transaction with Schnoor signatures it would look like on the blockchain just like if it was me making a payment to Rudy so we wouldn't know if it was Rudy Hans Hans and Rutger or Ruth Kerr and Rudy fulfilling the requirements for transaction to be signed by two out of the three of them all that the rest of the did you might need work would know is that it is valid and that it meets the requirements of two out of three now the size of signatures isn't a particularly massive benefit but when you're talking about a relatively average transaction being let's say 400 bytes going from 72 bytes as we are currently with ECDSA to 64 bytes with no signatures you're looking at a savings of around about 5% however if you presume that a full 1 megabyte block contains 2,500 transactions as it does currently with Bitcoin that same block can now hold another 125 transactions without any further improvements so over time that adds up to an additional seven hundred and twenty thousand transactions per day on the digibind network without actually adjusting the block size they had a meta minimum so that's pretty impressive linearity benefits are also subtle yet they very much play into the size benefits you can aggregate signatures in a way that you cannot with ECDSA so this provides even further space saving benefits it's not a direct mathematical two plus two equals four that happens with this but it gives you a bit of an idea of what happens so again if we look at our previous example with Rudy Ruettiger and Hans let's say they make a transaction and we just get it signed in using snore it's either valid or it's not save Rudy and Hans make a transaction they both sign it there is only one combined signature on the transaction rather than the two individuals the same would happen if they were in a multi sig arrangement that required all three of them to sign off on a transaction again there would be only one single signature for the combined or perhaps we are a large nonprofit let's say we need a seven out of ten multisig now instead of requiring seven signatures to be stored in the transaction they all sign the transaction and it's effectively added together and abrogated so the amount of data needed is now only a single 64 byte signature as opposed to the previous seven times 72 bytes or what really has a number of people excited is if we were to sign a block like the overall block should it contain all Noora signatures this would mean instead that you could have just one signature to prove the validity of all of the transactions in a block rather than each individual input being signed so again this plays back into both the privacy and the science benefits that we were just talking about earlier no need to know the public key of all of those people multisig just looks like any other transaction and receiving space and some decent space too all of these are great benefits but it does get bitter looking further into the future there are also possibilities and proposals that have been put forward in the BTC world about how noir signatures could be utilized in a coin join scenario further obfuscating user inputs and outputs again further protecting users privacy this I want to clarify though is not currently something that we have immediately planned for did you buy though it could be implemented on other did you buy wallets and again this is also very different from member Wimble which focuses on fungibility now I'm going to take a slight detour I mentioned member wibble verse a snore based coin joint system because I often get asked about nimble Wimble presumably a lot of people have heard about it because of the Harry Potter name plus it rolls off the tongue a lot better and is simply more catchy than snore so snorts signature-based coin join is very different from member Wimble as member Wimble is more specifically about the fungibility of coins with them being interchangeable this is quite important when you have a use case of money as your primary focus member Wimble in and of itself does not directly protect against a spectator somebody viewing the blockchain from knowing the values and how much you are sending or receiving so why is funds about what is fungibility and why might fungibility be important French ability is the notion that all coins would be created and treated equally across the board and unable to be distinguished from one another think of it more like having marked banknotes being worth less than an unmarked banknote because it's clearly being tracked and traced a blockchain based example might be the coins from the crypto pia hack as possibly not being as valuable as freshly minted ones if he was an end user for example whichever unknowingly received those coins from the 2019 crypto BIA hack you might have a harder time getting them accepted and credited into another exchanges wallet for example this is what member wendel looks to solve with fungibility with all coins being created and treated equally so at this point in time there is no current intentions to implement member Wimble into did you buy the focus for now will be on your signatures let's take another bit of a look at at an example though of you being paid you'll weekly wages by your employer and your employer decides to get a little bit curious about your spending habits now your employer would not specifically know the amounts that you are paying and rent each week or in my case how often you go to McDonald's if you were to be using a snore based coin joint on the other hand member limbal would not specifically prevent your employer from knowing that value they could probably see that on the blockchain however member Wimble would mean that if you did ever unknowingly receive some tainted coins such as those previously involved in the likes of the crypto pia hack beat from your work a friend and the new should in the theory have zero problem with another exchange accepting those coins both have their important points of differences now chinoise coin Jolin also has the added benefit of auditing and accountability of the blockchain maximum supply when we contrast this against other solutions such as zero knowledge proof sin Z cash there's the possibility of inflation bugs going unnoticed in say Z cash there is no such issue with snore based coin joints for the base layer privacy further adding to the appeal optional signatures now we're true from here the path forward is relatively straightforward nor signatures are not really something that is contingent even within the Bitcoin world at this point as they are able to be soft forked in so the existing code submitted as part of the Epis is built against bitcoin core 0.19 at prison did you buy seven point one seven point two which is our latest version is based on Bitcoin core zero point one seven will upgrade to make life simpler and pull the changes it's going to call us a little bit of fun with the dandelion implementation in Bitcoin being slightly different from digibytes but that shouldn't be too difficult for our Rockstar developers this part here is happening right now once we have did you by utilizing the Bitcoin 0.19 code we can then implement these VIPs the coin improvement proposals a lot easier pulling in noir signatures - did you buy but there's currently a bundle with VIP 343 41 and 342 that all kind of go hand in hand supporting snore signatures and this is what we will look to be implementing finally after all of that will be merging pal and bringing back GPU mining - did you buy it because this will be a hard folk for the network all the core wallets are going to need to be upgraded meaning the underlying infrastructure everywhere will have support for signatures and it will simply be up to third party wallet and service providers to tweak their software to work with no more signatures alternatively though if they decide they don't want to improve this software they can still carry on as is no problem with did you buy 8.19 and the existing legacy address formats or pic32 and cygwin for example again though as mentioned previously this is pretty straightforward for the most part and because it is able to be soft forked in for Bitcoin the Bitcoin community seems relatively supportive of sure signatures given all of the advantages I mean why wouldn't they there has been significant testing occurring at that level though more will occur on the digibytes side of things confirming our implementation prior to release so to close there are some pretty major benefits in a number of ways a number of different areas here and they all tie together quite nicely these benefits are predominantly size and space-saving the linearity allowing for aggregation to the privacy improvements so keeping in mind that most end users will never ever know that they are using snore signatures most end users simply don't care about the technicalities that's okay the ability to have a seamless upgrade is going to be pretty key for did you buy and basically at this point there's no real good reason why not to progress with signatures there's lots of benefits all around while maintaining digibytes focus on security as part of its forward-thinking nature so thank you so much for tuning in if you do have any questions feel free to reach out to me on Twitter or telegram I've been Josiah thanks for watching Cheers