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so planets become more interesting moons become places to go and revisit but there was a whole other goal and that was the search for intelligent life still is in the universe oh man it is very reasonable that maybe in my lifetime but in your kids is's lifetime somebody's going to find evidence of Life on another world and because if we found such a signal it would dare I say it change change the world the day we discover Life Will signal a change in the human condition that we cannot foresee or [Music] imagine that's pretty [Music] good this is Star Talk Neil degrass Tyson here your personal astrophysicist and today I've got an exclusive one-on-one conversation reserved for only those people who are not only important but are also a friend of mine we got with me in studio Bill NY greetings doctor how you doing man got a bow tie on and everything you're just completely that guy I am that guy the science guy what you see is what you get and did you tie your own bow tie today yeah you imagine bill nine wears clip on tie that would be a funny Bill Nye decided to end his career and lose respect from all his fans just I want you to know if I ever see anybody with a bow tie I ask them if it's real and if they say not which is about two-thirds of people not see what he did there I I say I want to tell Bill Nye on you and then they shudder because they they can wear clip on both TI that's fine I mean I just think it's it's not in the as we say uh the spirit of the game I flew my ass out here to Los Angeles we are now in your office of the planetary Society Pasadena California the same town where this Society was birthed a true fact false give me a fast birther story on this uh so Carl Sean had been very influential in getting Voyager uh the Viking landing on Mars and the two Voyager spacecraft launched and just so just for historical completeness there were two missions of Viking Lander and a viking Orbiter and so it could photograph the surface yes amazing really amazing VIs AR ideas and so he noticed uh that public interest in space exploration especially Planetary Exploration was very high but government support of it was waning and he had this big idea for a solar sale spacecraft it's 1970s now 1976 yeah yeah and the Disco era and that was set aside for more human missions including the famous handshake in space so that the Soviet Union and the United States would have no more conflict and that worked out great it was an Apollo capsule in orbit around Earth the soyou capsule and they were configured so that their collar could could join and they open the hatch and they're all weightless so they're just floating through and they would shake hands and I was told that the Americans were trained to only speak Russian and the Russians were trained to only speak English and US astronauts still speak Russian still a thing they do MH so uh and we flew on soyou's rockets for a zillion years all that inclusive Bruce Murray who was head of the jet propulsion lab during these famous missions Viking and Voyager and propulsion lab right here in Pasadena yes right at why were up the street and then U Lou fredman Who was an orbital mechanics guy engineer yes at uh both the PHD which you like uh they decided that there was enough interest in space exploration that they could start the planetary society and of Grassroots interest Grassroots yeah so we had the planetary so had tens of thousands of members by the end of pick a number 1982 uh was started in the winter of 79 1980 I'm a charter member now I remember getting the letter and I I was not I be frank with you I I was not moved by the letter because if I remember correctly it says Dear citizen of planet Earth Earth and I said that's not very special to me what did you want citizen of New York I dear Neal I mean I don't know a little more personal than dear citizen of planet Earth it was the State ofth art anyway uh the planetary side has been around now that we'll have our 45th anniversary this spring and what we do is promote Planetary Exploration and just notably just uh last week as we're recording this the the Europa Clipper Mission left for the moon of Jupiter with twice as much ocean water res Earth and that is in part let's say entirely because of the planetary Society where our members 40,000 people around the world think space exploration of planets is very important wrote letters and emails to US Congress especially got this Miss Mission funded u 11 years ago and now it's flying and it was delayed because of Hurricane Milton hurricane Milton you know I wanted to have a little sort of romantic Nostalgia for the 1969 film marooned do you remember that yeah with OJ Simpson no that's a different no he that's what's that one you're getting your movies mixed up that was uh Capricorn 5 Capricorn 5 okay Capricorn 5 or Capricorn one oh maybe Capricorn one yeah yeah anyway this maroon where they maroon retro Rockets don't fire and they Buton they can't get out of orbit yeah all right and but they have a rescue ship to go rescue them but they can't launch because the hurricane is coming through Cape Canaveral those were the days okay and I remember as a kid it was like hurricane that's pretty artificial and then I realiz storytelling yeah it's Florida this was not a weird fact to put into your story and so then some clever meteorologist says hey Neil the eye of the hurricane is going to go over the LaunchPad you seen have you ever been in eye of a hurricane I'm told it's really eerie it's weird yeah I was Hurricane Agnes in the early 1970s uhhuh came over and all of a sudden it's a clear sky for a little while and I'm told there are birds that get trapped inside of the eye of the hurricane like tropical birds that end up thousands of miles away from there it would have been cool had they launched um the EUR a Clipper in the eye that would have been a risky set of businesses because the the windows enough so they just delayed it a week well not just that just keep in mind everybody humans have to be there to launch the thing like people have go home they have to secure they' got to screw plywood to the windows of their house and then they have to come back to the cape to be ready to push the button and look at all the fuel lines and liquid oxygen connections and all that that there's a lot more to it when we talk about spacecraft we remind everybody there tremendous number of assets and investments in the infrastructure on the ground back to you H has the mission statement changed over the decades very little uh but it's succinct now okay uh we are the world's largest independent space interest organization advancing space science and exploration so that citizens of Earth will be empowered to know the cosmos and our place within it that's really catchy you know well here's what it is it's succinct we Empower citizens I agreee I'm just saying it's like it doesn't roll off the tongue well it does if you're the CEO yeah before the elevator doors close you are CEO and president president no no no there's a bylaw rule I'm not president what are you we have a separate I'm CEO just CEO yeah uh I thought you were important exactly so the president is an unpaid position did not know that yeah that's great tradition here a nonprofit in California you used to be president I used to be vice president vice president okay I was equally unpaid as vice president uh and so the board of directors is committed and just notice everybody our board is the real deal bunch of people our president's Bethy Elman Dr Elman is a professor at Caltech she has a couple missions that she's a principal investigator a pi on and uh our vice president Heidi Hamill is one of the 20 most influential women astronomers in history uh um Britney Schmidt is uh driving around submarines under the ice in anarctica are prepared to go under the ice on Europa and Titan or Enceladus I mean I was joking Enceladus and one of the moons of Saturn of Saturn uhhuh another icy Moon icy Moon yeah yeah and so everybody if you have ocean water for four and a half billion years is there something alive it happened here on Earth yeah one of the defining missions of the 1970s was the Voyager oh it still defines people here's the Voyager I don't know if it's wide enough to see but there's a replica of the record uhhuh so this defined a generation of Hope for our future space exploration and Carl San was particularly visible and known over that time yes yeah has it changed over that over the decades and I ask that because if I remember correctly because I used to serve on the board of the planetary society and I I cherish that those years because it's where I met you and and it's where I met andran San's Widow yes I did not know either I might have met her once or some but we didn't know each other until we were both on the board so that was these are important connections yes to be made this is this is what we do we connect people with uh the passion Beauty and joy the PB&J PB&J loving it that's a that's a bill nism PB&J uh yeah but uh it is yeah but it's really caught on in the Science Education this is that's how but now all that aside peanut butter and jelly used to be a very common lunch uh treat I remember there was a resistance to people in space relative to robots and some of that might have just been the sphere of influence of Carl Carl Sean where he he just who was a robot guy from an engineering or scientific or science fiction uh critic of uh astrophysical Observer such I count myself among the ranks of yes Premier astrophysical Observer note well you can't get people to Europa it's too flipping far away and too cold and there's nowhere to walk and everybody's going to die so you build spacecraft to go there as our proxies that we design the instruments to be as human uh to give us both uh a scientific perspective and a human perspective but in the day robots were nothing compared to today in the day I mean 50 years ago years ago compare robotss then to today today I'm walking down the street in La there's a car with no driver yes no driver making left turns it's turning going straight you may see the bumper sticker here in California on the Tesla that says I'm probably not driving that's pretty Charming but not these are robots it's a car robot in that sense right I'm say what do you got here so this is uh the spirit rover a picture of spirit rover and the cameras and it's solar panels yes the cameras were set up to be this is the expression as high as a 10-year-old's eye so that you were these cameras were put there so that humankind could imagine ourselves walking around driving around on Mars and talking about the planetary side the lore that we promote and I think you alluded to this earlier is that Bruce Murray was a young guy in the 1960s co-founder on working on the Mariner program Mariner to to Mars Mars which was the ranger spacecraft repurposed to go ranger went to the moon to map the moon and as a kid I was being class and we watch the moon come up yeah except it's in space no sound yeah some of the Rangers crash landed yeah on purpose purposefully and uh to see what the lunar surface was like up close so I forgot all about Mariner because Mariner I think took the first pictures of Mars that revealed there were no canals yeah yeah at some and so this Bruce Murray gets credit when you're talking to us at the planetary site for being the guy who insisted that spacecraft have cameras cuz people think scientists love pictures but we don't give a rat's ass about a picture well it depends on the picture no what I mean is there's much less science in a photo than the public is led to believe well we get chart records we get magnetic magn counters magners magnetometers we got Spectra we got a lot Optical give me Spectra over a photo any day but at but if people get dyed about how beautiful universe is change the world pictures from space change world we all at some point must confess to ourselves that that is the fact go confess your brains out greetings Star Talk star talkers starlings you know space exploration is not guaranteed it needs your support that's why we have the planetary Society we are the world's largest nonprofit space advocacy organization connecting you with the Grand Adventure of exploring the cosmos become a member today check out planetary.org StarTalk if we want to credit back to some of these founding fathers I think Carl Sean was the first scientist in his writings and in his you know in his appearances on television and to put you just a regular person regular person citizen of Earth you became a participant on that Frontier it was no longer let them go do the thing and they'll report back later no or spend some tax dollars on this it probably doesn't have anything to do with you that's not it all has something to do with you everything you are part of this uh great process of discovery this adventure and Bruce Murray used to talk about the unknown Horizon why are you guys sending spacecraft out to these extraordinary distant places what are you going to find we don't know what we're going to find that's why we're sending the spacecraft I think it's Einstein that's famously said research is what I'm doing when I don't know what I'm doing that sounds good yeah yeah it's completely Isaac azimoff science doesn't begin with a hypothesis it begins with H that's funny oh no no you got that wrong oh help me out yeah he said very few scientific discoveries if any ever begin with Eureka mhm it's that's funny that's funny yeah what is that so we explore the planets so I another thing I credit the planetary Society for and its philosophies and it's out look is turning objects in space into Worlds world is a great word when you use the word world it's no longer a detached object from your imagination it really gets you here you got it man you hit the no Neil that's absolutely right that's I I don't know anyone else who any other organization organization or worldview that made that such an important point right on man so you guys you should join the planetary so another thing that I credit the enthusiasm of the planetary Society for is when I was growing up the moons of planets like why would anyone give a rat's ass it's the Moon look at the planet it's not the moons and then Voyager goes out there gets pictures of the moons and the moons are more interesting than the planet there's a lot going on a lot they're all different IO Europa G our moon is like the least interesting moon in the solar system what's interesting about the Moon is it's got a far side and a near side that to me is amazing and I asked Carl San why is the near side relatively smooth I asked him this as we say in Middle School to his face and he said uh it's the Earth's gravity enabled these impacts to get impact get accelerated yeah and so lava flowed more recently on the near surface than the far surface did that turn out to be true you tell me astrophysics Gravity Guy I've seen your gravity books man I dabbled in the three body I dabbled in the uh in the ham I think there's an argument that any asid that's headed in our direction would feel Earth's gravity and it would you would have a focusing effect towards so Sean back then said gravitational lens which was a that's not how the term was used but we got all get through it yeah yeah no your words include more than they leave so so planets become more interesting moons become places to go and revisit but there was a whole other whole other goal and that was the search for intelligent life still is in the universe oh man and I'm remembering how big a part of that was in in my couple of years when I served on the board but then when I came off the board it you know it's less tangible right because we don't know if the aliens are out there and and are they hearing listening to us so where is TPS the planetary Society relative to the search for intelligence well we've let that go to this seti institute Institute of intelligence uh Institute and they're based up in Northern California right and they're very well owed and they chip away at this problem and they just got a boatload of money just well I went with well owed you can go boatload of money spacecraft full of money yeah and so they will carry on a barge full of money a barge full of money they will carry on that resch in their enabled best way possible and they have a whole Suite of telescopes originally funded by Paul Allen the Allen AR yeah so these are telescopes that are sensitive to radio waves on the assumption that if anyone is going to talk to us so they're going to use radio because radios penetrate clouds Carl San was very well spoken about this about this logical place where water molecules would not absorb radio logical place logical frequency mhm or radio waves would not be absorbed by water vapor and so if an alien civilization water vapor is in the across the universe as well hydrogen's everywhere it would uh you could aim your Intergalactic or interplanetary uh Interstellar Interstellar message to go through the water hole as he called it very well very cool term right but all that aside it is very reasonable that maybe in my lifetime but in your kids's lifetime somebody's going to find evidence of Life on another world and the logical places are going to be under the Sands of Mars okay but this would be microbial life this is not yeah but still change the world then you would say to Mr micro Ms micro they microb do you have DNA are you a whole another different get that but that wasn't what seti was about no no it's still not right seti finding microbes that's not their it's fine knock yourselves out that's not their thing and because if we found such a signal it would dare I say it CH change the world and so we keep so said Institute keeps listening we had an exhibit at the Hayden planetarium before we rebuilt that was narrated by William Shatner and it was about the search for life and I will I remembered the quote because I thought it was a brilliant sentence and he said it in his sort of pause acting way um the day we discover Life Will signal a change in the human condition that we cannot foresee or imagine that's pretty good no everybody I say all the time everybody will feel differently about being a living thing yes whether or not it's what we call intelligent oh yeah it would transform biology The Logical question from the Sands of Mars there's another hypothesis that once Life Starts you can't stop it so if life started on Mars there's yes there's salty slush near the equator of Mars was kept almost warm by Sun are there microbes living under the sand and if we found them do they have DNA to wit was Mars hit with an impactor which happens all the time long ago knocked a living thing on a rock off into space it fell woo wo woo excepts in space no sound these would be microbes uh stowing away in the no trapped stowing away land on Earth and you and I are descendants of martians that is an extraordinary hypothesis you more so than me just yeah well uh it's an extraordinary hypothesis but if it proved to be true it would change the world and so it is worth that would be panspermia i p it's worth investigating and I just discourage all of you out there who want to go to Mars by yourselves on your own giant rocket just don't go go to the same places the same places that are interesting to you maybe or are very likely the same places that are interesting to people studying astrobiology that's just for anybody who happened to just anybody who happened to used to be on the board of the planetary Society before he or she was being sued by the Securities and Exchange Commission and is trying some political tactic to try to not try to get a pardon someday if you're that person consider doing people for sure there's nothing specific so anyway this picture means a great deal to me and the staff had this made and gave it to me and put it up in this office because it features the sand the Mars dial above the Sands of Mars and so back in the day uh in the vi in the Viking missions when Viking landed on Mars why does that look like this uh it's it's that's a little bit of a coincidence uh okay okay but that's a sample tube a replica of a sample tube that's being collected by the perseverance Rover and this you know you sample if you sample it they will come so there's Mars inside here it's a cigarette sized sample of rock simulated 3D printed sample of rock got it and so if in there by the way the rocks that land here so this gets collected by some geologist telling it there's a good rock to put in bunch of geologists thinking and this is sitting there waiting to be it's in they're in two places just on the surface m in case the Rover gets disabled and can't do anything and in the belly of the Rover they're being stored all right so and I can see the Rover's been around that's the de that's Spirit that's 20 years before yeah 20 almost 30 years before yeah and so so I see at the tip of that that resemble you got good stuff on your CH yeah so Clipper so there's the Mars do this is right at the tip of the see that white rectangle not the antenna the white rectang I get it right right at the edge there yeah so that's actual size okay so in the Viking missions famously the Rocks came back those pictures depicted the Martian sky as blue and the Rocks were too pink and it took him I was at the 30th anniversary of this thing and these guys were talking about it took him about a day and a half to realize that the cameras had been calibrated on earth and the pictures needed to be re-calibrated so they found intuitively that if you look at the shadow you can infer the color of the sky so those of you out there haven't sat through this go outside on a sunny day if you're in itha New York where I went to college there there is a sunny day scheduled in the next 10 years yes yeah then you make a shadow on something white like my shirt would be good and you'll see the shadow is gray to be sure but it's also ever so slightly light blue and that's because the sun is not the only source of light here on Earth's surface the sky is a source of light looking at me nothing but orange skies on the other planet yeah so on Mars The Sky Is orange or salmon colored or what have you and so they found that by looking at the shadow they could infer the color of the sky and then how much the colors of the Rocks had been influenced on the camera on the images uh by the color of the sky that's very clever so what you're saying is to summarize whatever's going on in the shadow is not directly influenced by the sun it's directly influenced but it's not the only influence no no no sorry you get you get an authentic background lighting from the rest of the sky yeah yeah so let's send a shadow Caster to Mars I was in a meeting a Strater that's a that's a guitar the blues guitar and you I don't know if you are a Stratocaster Master but there is uh the idea was to send this post this stick to Mars to cast a shadow and I was in the meeting and I said aren't there many many things to cast a shadow no we need it to fall in something precisely calibrated or well-known colors of grayscale and so I was in the meeting now my dad had the misfortune of being a prisoner of war in World War II for almost four years and he told the story often of walking in Japan in uh China at first and then Japan at the end of the war they got as Japanese influence shrunk they got moved to the south island of Japan for the last year of the war but he would by all accounts stick a shovel handle in the soil and watch the Shadow and reckon when it was lunchtime kind of thing and so he back that's right so he wrote a book about sunds he was the astronomy merit badge counselor he made a sun for the Boy Scouts for the Boy Scouts so I was in the meeting they're going to send a metal stick to Mars to cast a shadow so you have genetic I'm just jumping out of my chair you guys we got to make that into a Sund dial okay I'm glad you didn't put a shovel here for this so they were all looking at me like dude it's the Space Program bill I see you're wearing a watch no come on it'll be like people who speak Kling on except it'll be real Mars 2004 Two Worlds one son that's so Lou fredman one of our Founders came up with that he we were having dinner at a place that's now it was uh Louise trota now it's U Cheesecake Factory but he said uh one son Two Worlds in a few seconds we all went oh no no two worlds one son that's really inspirational Light Shadows on Mars are cast by the same lifegiving Star as Shadows on earth now wait wait there's more on the edge around the dial is a message to the future we built this uh instrument in 2003 it arrived here in 2004 to study the mar environment look for signs of water and life and on the last of the four read this what is it is it in braille what is it's in a younger person's font yeah okay that's what says on the last of the four it says to those who visit here we wish a safe journey and the joy of Discovery and that's written in English because of course aliens read English well well English no no it's written for humans so well other humans who yeah English is the language of Aerospace even now and so and of Aviation too yeah Aviation yeah so it's it's optimistic people are going to be there and they're going to go up to that thing and look at and think about the the way we go up to the Plymouth Rock the way we go up to what Mass yes a pyramid a mitu Picchu we go up and go wow that's an extraordinary thing humans before us did and it's optimistic and it has the joy of Discovery and that has become PB&J passion Med and joy jod joy of Discovery that's become a phrase with me and the staff hey Star Talk fans I don't know if you know this but the audio version of the podcast actually posts a week in advance of the video version and you can get that in Spotify an apple podcast and most other podcast Outlets that are out there multiple ways to ingest all that is Cosmic on Star Talk tell me about literal political advocacy because it's one thing to just celebrate it and but at some point somebody's got to show up in Washington this is what we did so uh have you been asked to testify oh heck yes uhuh so what we have been able to do uh is hire two guys who are just really into this and are excellent at it so we have one guy who studies policy this sounds like you're talking about lobbyists no so Lobby a lobbyist is a paid person and he has to have a license in this and that we are Advocates so what we do is get our members 40 plus members around the world 40,000 members around well said 40K yes 40 plusk m close to 50K people around the world this is evidence I'm paying attention to what you're saying I want you to know that that's why I interrupt you when I pay I appreciate it Neil it's very appreciated much 40 members of the planetary 40,000 Members Plus almost 50,000 some weeks it is over 50 yes we have this nonprofit problem continually yes people fall off you have to re-engage them you fall off they re all right all that aside we send letters and emails to members of Congress and the senate advocating for space missions that we believe uh are in the best interest of humankind and the best interest of making discoveries on these other worlds that will affect our world and the mo the one that we're all talking about this week is the Europa Clipper a replica shown here because it it launched right and I testified in front Congress in 2013 about the importance of this mission where we're looking for signs of Life on another world and or organic material from on another world to learn more about our own world and we do it for inspirational wonderful Joy of discoveries reasons but it's also if you want to be the world leader in technology you invest in space exploration I testified once but I felt like it was going into a black hole well that's a black hole see what he did there but I wasn't representing a whole organization as you are so that's a different Force operating well I'm one voice and my voice is not irrelevant to be sure it's relevant but when you these congressmen and senators get thousands tens of thousands of 10ks of letters and emails it affects them you at the helm of this ship that has influence I when I testified I'm just Neil talking to the Congress and I do they you know what am I doing here like what are they that's what they said to everybody said to me Neil behind your behind your back no so but so I look at this list here because it's not just Europa Clipper which is sucess on Route it's just most recent Hubble Mars sample return uh the New Horizons to Pluto uh the Europa Clipper of course what I got two other missions here Veritas which means truth but that's all I know about it and Viper what are those so veritos is a mission to Venus so haven't had a mission to Venus in 40 years it's not entirely hospitable well but you want to have a look and see what what happened on Venus yeah what happened on Venus we don't want to happen on Earth in fact people talk about climate change now regularly as I as you know I've been whining about it for you got a whole book on yes what's the name of that book uh undeniable undeniable yes a whole book talking about the reality of climate change and how to how to spread that information against misinformation misinformation from the fossil fuel industry who's worked hard to make scientific uncertainty the same as doubt about the whole thing right but that aside you can argue that climate change on Earth was discovered by studying the atmosphere of Venus MH and so uh in 1984 or so so this really an extraordinary thing it's the classic Bruce Murray what are you going to find when you go exploring these other worlds we don't know that's why we go exploring so Bill what you just said reminds me of that quote from TS Elliot where he says you I'm going to mangle it but the essence of it will be there you explore the world you know see new places travel travel and then you come back home and only then will you know your that place for the very first time as I say the more we explore these other worlds the more we know about our own that's that is it a new field comparative planetology Carl Sean used to toss that phrase around like it was a real phrase it's not like we're here and everything else is something else that's right plus can I tell you one time I was delightfully out geeked you're pretty when you but Geeks you know Geeks are on an unlimited Spectrum okay however geeky you are there's someone geekier than you particularly if you go to Comic-Con Arms Reach hard shake a stick someone geekier all right so I calculated how long it would take to cook a 16-in pepperoni pizza on your window sill on Venus on your window sill yeah you just put it on on the window sill you know close the window and just let it cook it's pretty quick take s seconds 7 Seconds okay okay all right so not only is it cook in 7 seconds because of the temperature did you take into account atmospheric pressure yes yeah back to you in my calculation I considered as you suggested what is the temperature of the air and how many air molecules are hitting it because it's got 10 times the pressure that we have here on Earth that's all factored in right that's how I got down to S second bubbling Pizza is not hardly going to Bubble okay so I then got out geeked someone said Neil did you consider the thermodynamic radiative layer within the atmosphere it's the optical depth it's the distance over which a photon is no longer absorbed by the air and it goes to your target mhm I said no I hadn't that's important it's it's why when you're in in a front of a fireplace and someone walks in front of you you feel cold immediately yes that's not the air temperature changing no it's radiation I say sit across the room from your refrigerator have somebody open the door do this do this you'll feel the difference yes cuz the photons radiating off your hand yes and so I had neglected the the radiative factor from the hot atmosphere so how long does it really take two and a half seconds two and a half yeah it's three times faster it's pretty fast so yeah if you got to get out G so if you're there with your pizza and you have some means to open a window without exploding dying getting cooked I'll keep that in mind but these are important thought experiments because um they're physics yes all science is either physics yes or stamp collecting so we got to land This Plane okay so a couple of things are we going to tail first propulsively land or we going to go in you know we're going to glider I'm a glider Lander guy so I don't want to Splash in the ocean that's very primitive but you it's hard to miss that's why they did that's why they the Pacific is a big time well and so is off the coast of Florida now you have if you remember this but when I was young the spacecraft was in 10 miles of the Navy ship that was a big deal now they wait don't get too close no they land you landed on the bull you know back to you so another big part of the planetary society's identity was the successful funding appeal funding and launch and deployment of the solar sale which was the dream of so many people one of your Founders uh uh Lou Freeman wrote a book yes and so this was like a a very big expression andrean was a big proponent of this yes uh andrean car Carl Sig's Widow and board member so would you count that as among the bigger achievements oh yeah especially under my watch no really uh uh we had a solar sale launch funded largely by andrean and people associated with the Discovery Channel and uh it crashed in the ocean and it was okay game over done boom so so then it took many years nine more years to get it together to build another spacecraft and in that interim this thing called the cube set emerged cubical satellite which are 10 cm by 10 cm by 10 cm and then variations of that have been you can go online and buy parts for satellite and they're cheap to launch expensive it's like a it's like your science project yeah it is and a lot of students a lot of universities and high schools participate in cubat programs and uh the other thing is electronics have gotten increasingly smaller more miniaturized one could argue that the miniaturization of electronics was stimulated by space yes well it's uh how to say symbiotic yeah we were able to get funding 50,000 people around the world just think it's great we launched spacecraft in 2014 to prove that it would work and by the way I've done very little as CEO the place is run by Jennifer vaugh our chief operating officer we have a Chief Financial Officer Jim sa we have chief of communications Daniel gun we got a development officer Rich we got all these people but once in a while somebody's got to decide to do something so it was my decision should we take this launch in 2014 with a spacecraft that wasn't as capable as we hoped one day would be but it had cameras and so we launched in 2014 we got these pictures down and that enabled us to get funding to launch light sale too there it is you could see the light sale unfurling is it I remembering and so by the way real so right there is a boom that uh golden looking thing is burum copper and uh what's cool about it or remarkable this is uh the same material in much shorter length just notice how stiff it is if you try to bend it yeah can't and then notice how compact it is if you try to roll it or bend it in the other axis and so this is what enables fold it up to get into the well rolled up yeah and if you look at it it's there's these tiny dots these are laser Stitch welded at the at the US Air Force research lab anyway I mention all this because there's a lot of cool technology that we perfected and flew in 2017 any good space mission does yes because you're doing something that's never been done before y had to innovate the control laws how you steer it and uh rolling it up and uh getting it robust enough to tolerate cosmic rays without being too heavy to fly we did all that and so uh very proud of that and uh people ask us what's next I'll just say stay tuned so a quick I want to remind people unless they may living under a rock uh many people you taught them science growing up as Bill KN Science Guy it really is amazing and now they're full- grown adults with kids and they some of them have kids and you're like Papa science here yeah and you you were the AA parent to what maybe was in our generation who's the guy on TV Mr Don Herbert Don I had lunch with him I L I look like nobody I had lunch with him Don Herbert and he was uh Mr what was he Mr Wizard Mr Wizard are you fing with me Mr Wizard so I went to his memorial service oh and you guys I was just crying just couldn't get over it man the guy was so influential um I can tell you the technical aspects of everything but his show was done intuitively our the Science Guy show we had all this research that 10 years old is as old as you can be to get the so-called lifelong passion for science to get it when you so it was dialed in I was nine I was nine I love you man yeah it was dialed in for people 10 years old that's why that's part of why the show was so successful and uh then you would I don't want to say transition out of that but you added to your let's go with Professional Profile yes uh to to be a space Advocate like for adults and for the nation and for the president for the world this sort of thing yeah so and did you ride in Air Force One One Time excuse me Barack Obama got to meet me yeah and uh spent some time you you chilling with Barack there you go but he was uh he is a very thoughtful and frankly Charming guy and smart yeah and so I um well he's brilliant and so we talked about space exploration good on Marine one I know hung out with you've hung out with him but I uh it was his airplanes though but it was quite cool and he was very receptive to um addressing climate change he was very interested in that M and uh his policies led to this the beginning of the start of a beginning of uh climate policies involved in the inflation reduction act aka the clean power which had some elements to it yeah yeah yeah so Bill Neil planetary Society great to see you so where do we find it you got a website for it planetary.org it's your homepage planet planetary.org planetary.org and we have a podast button there that that you can join yes and so on every page if you got want to run a nonprofit you put a donate button on every page right that's what it is and so we thank everybody out there who is a member encourage those of you who for some reason are not members to join us and we have now the planetary Academy aimed at families and the monthly planetary report planetary four times a year now because people get their space information on the electric internet so we have longer form articles in the printed magazine rather than rather than journalistic articles which we have some of each we have I claim the we have the world's Premier long form planetary science journalism nice but I myself have referenced it to catch up on certain yes well thank you we have the best going because you know Mission information is very fragmented is everywhere there's a little bit there and a little bit there and it comes into a coherent uh sensible pedagogical delivery to give us an idea of what's involved you want to go you send a mission to Jupiter big enor enormous rocket Falcon heavy three Falcon 9 strapped to strapped together 27 engines blasting at once going as fast as you can getting a slingshot from Earth takes almost six years and so you're in this game for the Long Haul do and and with Europa Clipper we're six years out that's what I'm saying yeah yeah years that's what you describe yeah yeah and just uh it will change the world thank you all planet .org Turn It Up loud Bill Neil great Star Talk yeah oh you got American Dream American dream I'm on Star talko [Applause] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music]